Game of Thrones!

[Randomnity]

Sounds about right, [MENTION=13402]Saturned[/MENTION]. I think being able to mesh books 4 and 5 together will make for a much stronger narrative.

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To reply to your spoilers:

In an interview with Benioff and Weiss (the show's creators), they said that killing off Ned was actually one of the strongest selling points for HBO. HBO loved the idea of killing off the protagonist since TV shows so rarely do it. They also said that they plan on making the Red Wedding the season 3 finale, and that they'll consider their job a success if they make it long enough to shoot that scene.

omg I can't wait for that.

 

[Anew Leaf]

Sounds about right, [MENTION=13402]Saturned[/MENTION]. I think being able to mesh books 4 and 5 together will make for a much stronger narrative.

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To reply to your spoilers:

In an interview with Benioff and Weiss (the show's creators), they said that killing off Ned was actually one of the strongest selling points for HBO. HBO loved the idea of killing off the protagonist since TV shows so rarely do it. They also said that they plan on making the Red Wedding the season 3 finale, and that they'll consider their job a success if they make it long enough to shoot that scene.

That is where I was thinking they would end S3 as well... holy crap that will be glorious. I sobbed when I read it. *is emo*

 

[ZPowers]

Sounds about right, [MENTION=13402]Saturned[/MENTION]. I think being able to mesh books 4 and 5 together will make for a much stronger narrative.

That, and I'm guessing they're not gonna wanna leave some of their most important actors out of the action for the season, especially since some of them are big draws or could have contract issues with that.

 

[ZPowers]

I just watched it. I'm holding off on commentary until Sunday because I think it's probably rude to get all spoiler-happy with an episode that isn't out yet... But I will say that I think I'm doomed to be one of those book snobs who spends the entirety of the season annoyed by their deviations from the novel.

and the last scene of episode twelve really annoyed me.

Alright, so it's aired in the US. You guys talking about

Melissandre & Stannis shacking up or Jon spying Craster sacrificing his son to the Walkers?

 

[Patches]

Alright, so it's aired in the US. You guys talking about

Melissandre & Stannis shacking up or Jon spying Craster sacrificing his son to the Walkers?

I'm talking about Jon getting grabbed by Craster there at the end.

 

[ZPowers]

I'm talking about Jon getting grabbed by Craster there at the end.

Ah. My guess is

SOME BOOK 3 SPOILERS

all that'll happen is next episode Craster will be pissed at the men of the Watch, and kick them out of his keep. Next season when they come back, he'll reluctantly allow them in, in part because Jon won't be around. All that really was was a way to show and not tell about Craster's sons. I don't think it'll have any big effects.

I had assumed you were annoyed by

BOOK 2 SPOILERS

Stannis shacking up with Melissandre, since it seems odd for a character SO driven by honor, vows, duty and loyalty. But it's implied somewhat in the books, and the shadow creature is theoretically created there. Plus, Stannis would probably do it if it meant him fulfilling his greater duty of becoming the true king

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[Patches]

I had assumed you were annoyed by

BOOK 2 SPOILERS

Stannis shacking up with Melissandre, since it seems odd for a character SO driven by honor, vows, duty and loyalty. But it's implied somewhat in the books, and the shadow creature is theoretically created there. Plus, Stannis would probably do it if it meant him fulfilling his greater duty of becoming the true king

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It is WAY more than implied.

It's not as clear the first time she 'makes a kill' but it is spelled out when they go to Harrenhall. They discuss from Davos perspective that she stays in his tent, and Davos even discusses that the shadow-thing that she births is basically from Stannis. I understood that as meaning that he was responsible for the conception of the thing.

 

[ZPowers]

It is WAY more than implied.

It's not as clear the first time she 'makes a kill' but it is spelled out when they go to Harrenhall. They discuss from Davos perspective that she stays in his tent, and Davos even discusses that the shadow-thing that she births is basically from Stannis. I understood that as meaning that he was responsible for the conception of the thing.

Yeah, through book 5:

Also some talk about Stannis not having anyone to warm his bed after leaving Melissandre in Book 5. Plus, there's moments where Stannis casts no shadow and he's sickly for a while after the shadow thing performs its attacks in Book 2. But it did take me a bit to put that together when I was reading, and a friend of mine who has also read the books was upset at the scene in tonight's ep because he missed that. I guess it's a bit like how they never directly say Renly and Tyrell are gay, just imply it heavily (even more heavily than this, I'd say).

 

[Anew Leaf]

I was also really disturbed at the breasts on the chick Theon was banging.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

Great episode.

I'm looking forward to see how this actress handles Theon's sister.

 

[ZPowers]

Great episode.

I'm looking forward to see how this actress handles Theon's sister.

Yeah, that's gonna be a problem when I'm discussing the show with friends who haven't read the books, cause I'm gonna keep calling her Asha.

VERY, VERY MINOR SPOILERS FOR BOOK 2 AND 3

And, well, you'll have to be content with a taste just now. Her role in this season (if it follows the books) will probably be limited to one or two more scenes. Then she won't show up at all next season.

 

[Anew Leaf]

Yeah, that's gonna be a problem when I'm discussing the show with friends who haven't read the books, cause I'm gonna keep calling her Asha.

VERY, VERY MINOR SPOILERS FOR BOOK 2 AND 3

And, well, you'll have to be content with a taste just now. Her role in this season (if it follows the books) will probably be limited to one or two more scenes. Then she won't show up at all next season.

yeah that was such a dumb change. i have been trying to strangle my inner fangirl purist but that just annoyed me.

also book 5 spoiler

Seeing Theon in season 1 and 2 makes me sad for what happens to him later. Yeah, I know he's a jerk and I called for his blood many a time... but what he had happen is worse than ten deaths. Ugh. Very clever of GRRM though... more of his shades of gray.

 

[Anew Leaf]

Yeah, that's gonna be a problem when I'm discussing the show with friends who haven't read the books, cause I'm gonna keep calling her Asha.

VERY, VERY MINOR SPOILERS FOR BOOK 2 AND 3

And, well, you'll have to be content with a taste just now. Her role in this season (if it follows the books) will probably be limited to one or two more scenes. Then she won't show up at all next season.

yeah that was such a dumb change. i have been trying to strangle my inner fangirl purist but that just annoyed me.

also book 5 spoiler

Seeing Theon in season 1 and 2 makes me sad for what happens to him later. Yeah, I know he's a jerk and I called for his blood many a time... but what he had happen is worse than ten deaths. Ugh. Very clever of GRRM though... more of his shades of gray.

 

[NotOfTwo]

It is funny reading this thread, so many spoiler buttons. I wish I could get into these books, I could use a new series. Just too depressing. I read first book but now I just want to know synopsis, not suffer along with them.

 

[JocktheMotie]

I may be in the minority, but I find the Lannisters one of the more likable factions solely due to their realistic worldview. They are not deluded, know how to play the game, and are fantastically ruthless. I really enjoyed book 2 as Tyrion really got to shine and owned it, it's sort of bittersweet how it ended for him.

I like how it really cast aside the idea of virtue, of "True Knights" and their worthless vows, and just the general fluid landscape of loyalty as power shifted throughout the realm. I particularly loved Catelyn and Jamie's conversation near the end of the book. Jamie is unapologetic, honest about his intentions, a clear conscience in regard to his actions, and why not? He understands perfectly.

Otherwise, I found book two a little dull, with odd pacing, and mainly just setup. Some spoilers ahead.

A lot of characters simply don't go anywhere or grow. Daenarys did jack shit, but you did at least get some interesting forshadowing. Arya didn't do too much either. Plots that seemed to be developing strongly are discarded halfway through the book, like how the Red Priestess all but disappears after taking Storm's End. All book, we are privy to Tyrion's wonderful strategy and maneuvering, and the final battle is over in 35 pages with Tywin and Littlefinger coming out of the Deus Ex Machina mobile it seemed like and saving the day behind the scenes of the book. Some extremely minor complaints, I hear book 3 is wonderful and I'll start it tonight.

Also, so happy Theon got screwed in the end. Such a repulsive, weak individual.

 

[Society]

3rd episode is apparently out on the HBO thing - all we need now is to wait for a good pirate to leak it... anyone? please?

 

[JocktheMotie]

[MENTION=13402]Saturned[/MENTION] [I can't write on your wall]
I sort of like Cersei too, to be honest. Again, she knows what's going on and the image of the Lioness fiercly guarding her cubs is apt. Her only real fault is that she's so externally focused she can't see Joffrey for what he is, and the stress of managing and guarding takes its toll on her as she becomes extremely paranoid and vindictive as things start to fall apart. She is always most likable when talking about Jamie and when she shows a little emotional openness.

 

[Anew Leaf]

[MENTION=13402]Saturned[/MENTION] [I can't write on your wall]
I sort of like Cersei too, to be honest. Again, she knows what's going on and the image of the Lioness fiercly guarding her cubs is apt. Her only real fault is that she's so externally focused she can't see Joffrey for what he is, and the stress of managing and guarding takes its toll on her as she becomes extremely paranoid and vindictive as things start to fall apart. She is always most likable when talking about Jamie and when she shows a little emotional openness.

I see your point. I guess she just aggravates me because of how unselfaware she is about things that I want to smack her.

I eagerly await your POV update after finishing through the books.

 

[Patches]

I may be in the minority, but I find the Lannisters one of the more likable factions solely due to their realistic worldview. They are not deluded, know how to play the game, and are fantastically ruthless. I really enjoyed book 2 as Tyrion really got to shine and owned it, it's sort of bittersweet how it ended for him.

If you watch the Season 1 DVD commentaries, you hear from the directors and writers that they frequently repeated the mantra "No Villains" to themselves, apparently. The idea being that even those who are perceived as the blackest and most vile of characters are still written with scenes that may show even the faintest bit of humanity to them. That they didn't want any caricatures of some kind of comic-book villain in the show; they wanted real people who may make decisions that can be perceived as evil, but they're still human and real. I think it's interesting to look at characters with that in mind. "No Villains"

Also, in reply to your Book 2 spoilers:

I can't help but like Theon. I know you're not supposed to right now, but goddamnit I'll be that Team Theon person.

Random Season 1 tidbit: All of the actors repeatedly laughed about how different the actor who plays Joffrey is from his character. They were stressing how he's one of the most kind/considerate people on the set and he was always sweet to everyone. Also, Khal Drogo is apparently a teddy bear IRL. Cersei's actress swears like a sailor and is hilarious.

Also, at one point Arya, Sansa, and Bran are doing a commentary together and start goofing off during the intro. This made me smile so much:

[YOUTUBE="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t92ukx0A2fk"]Arya/Sansa/Bran[/YOUTUBE]

 

[Udog]

Don't forget about the Simpsons parody!

[YOUTUBE="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUGzIfDRrLs"]Game of Simpsons[/YOUTUBE]

Oh, and I enjoy what Martin does with the Lannisters as well. I think there's too much Cersei in book 4, but it's very possible the real problem was not enough of other characters.