[MBTI General] ENFP vs. ENTP

[zarc]

Yes, it is true that at times we do not like confrontation, however, we, or I, at least, will/would *never* "let people get away with all kinds off stuff (solely) to be loved". If I am desperate of anything in regards to relating with others, it would be that of making an honest connection, and not of needing to feel loved or admired by them.

I think it's also that ENFPs will confront when someone they care for is being attacked (or themselves too), as indicated by nemo's friend and what I've learned of ENFPs. Do they like it? No or not always. And it might feel good defending the weak or your friend or yourself. I certaintly enjoy playing Justice. It's Poetic to me... But you'll do it because you feel it's the appopriate thing to do! I recall your defense of your friend CN and that guy. (and well, the rest of it which you can ignore if I triggered your memory or explaining myself certaintly did so...er.... But again, demonstrating you'll confront when you feel it's right to do so! Huzzah!)

Originally Posted by Desert Flower
but on the other hand they can come across as tactless and cruel.

Tactless? At times, yes. Cruel? Never.

I think, the missing link here, is that ENFPs (or any other Type) can seem tactless and cruel but that doesn't mean that the ENFP (or any other Type) is deliberately being so. A person may very well misperceive the ENFP. And really, DF, I think if that particular ENFP is being cruel towards someone, if they really are and are not misperceived as being so, then that's just an ENFP who's uspet or emotionally unhealthy. Can happen to any Type-- INFJ, ESTJ etc.

This is so antithetical to the person I am, and the way I conduct myself, that it damn near renders me speechless. I am assuming that most, if not all other ENFPs would agree that this behavior is not indicative of them.

Yea, I was a bit irked too lol. So, again DF, I'll say those ENFPs are just emotionally unhealthy/upset should they 'backlash' and again any other Type can do the same, albiet differently or through different stages.

It's been my experience that girls who are "sweet", tend not only to have retractable fangs, but to also harbor insidious intentions.

No CC, don't listen to the station you're at! Tune the stereo into a better one! (But I know you said in your exp, so and no, I'm not entirely seen as sweet. Depends. Sometimes I'm told I'm cold or distant or just a weirdo!! )

On the phone right now.

Hiya DD!!!!!

Hiiiiiii! I was waiting on ya! Oh man, another xxxP who's multitasking while being on the phone. I must study this secret.

 

[Kiddo]

I believe most ENFPs, like myself, are BIG into sincerity.

I wear my emotions on my face, and reveal my intentions in my words, and if there is anything more that I hate than being forced or being phony, it is that of being forced to be fake/phony.

Hm...sincerity might not be the right word...at least not when it comes to discussion and arguments. I think ENFPs are just good at equivocation tactics, whereas ENTPs are usually a lot more straightforward or at least tactful. From what I have observed, when it comes to discussion ENFPs just don't have any scruples about misrepresenting or exaggerating people's ideas in order to get their goat. Whereas ENTPs will maintain the integrity of an idea.

 

[zarc]

Hm...sincerity might not be the right word...at least not when it comes to discussion and arguments. I think ENFPs are just good at equivocation tactics, whereas ENTPs are usually a lot more straightforward or at least tactful. From what I have observed, when it comes to discussion ENFPs just don't have any scruples about misrepresenting or exaggerating people's ideas in order to get their goat. Whereas ENTPs will maintain the integrity of an idea.

Again as I said to DF, you're speaking of emotionally unhealthy/upset ENFPs. I used the Teritary Temptation examples also in response to your other post to show how both ENFPs and ENTPs re/act when feeling pressure from their Inferior functions. ENTPs can be just as bad, albeit a bit differently than ENFPs, when they're emotionally unhealthy/upset too.

 

[Xander]

I take it back, ENFPs are also smartasses, just in a different way.

CC, I think you're an ENFP. Reason being is that you're connected to others to the point where I'd expect you to be in part defined by them and yet you baulk at the idea of being defined by others or pigeonholed by a system. Apparently this is characteristic of an ENFP. Also you're comments are more familiar and on a personal level than ENTPs tend to.

I know that's not the question asked but I figured that may offer some insight into the question you did ask

Oh and as for the smartass remark, I figure ENTPs get it for their "ah yes but" responses and ENFPs are also prone to similar behaviour (IME). It's the kind of thing where you go "the sun will rise tomorrow" and you get back "ahh yes but if it dies overnight then it won't be a sun" or some such tangent.

It's not a behaviour solely seen in those types, just more prevalent IME.

 

[zarc]

blah blah blah

I just have to remark that this is the first time I've seen another person's Siggie possibly more irritating to the eyes than my own. I particularly enjoy aelan's insightful remark. I concur.

Carry on, people...

 

[Butterfly]

This is interesting. At times, ENFPs don't like confrontation and will let people get away with all kinds off stuff to be loved, but on the other hand they can come across as tactless and cruel. Is this cruelty only directed at people that ENFPs feel are weaker than them and can't strike back? Or is it some type of backlash from trying to be so nice all the time and keeping the anger pent up?

I find that a person's anger and cruelty tends to be proportional to their sweetness...this is what causes me to feel distrustful of the ENFP I am interacting with.

Its not so much as built up anger, though it sometimes can be. Its just when you tolerate something for so long, letting it go, you would expect the other person to understand that it doesnt sit well with you.
What bothers me is that some people take advantage of your niceness, and dont change. So I burst out....not in a damaging way most of the time anyway. Its not bad anger, just annoyance and frustration. Sometimes it can get bad yes! Like banging doors! But that happens like maybe once a year.

oh and this anger is not against weaker people...when it comes out it sees no one. All are equal in its path! What makes me furious is injustice, and I express that very openly...without regret and remorse.

 

[Butterfly]

I take it back, ENFPs are also smartasses, just in a different way.
Oh and as for the smartass remark, I figure ENTPs get it for their "ah yes but" responses and ENFPs are also prone to similar behaviour (IME). It's the kind of thing where you go "the sun will rise tomorrow" and you get back "ahh yes but if it dies overnight then it won't be a sun" or some such tangent.
.

Thankyou Xander!! for taking that comment back. I was beginning to think which planet have I been all this time? Because I do consider myself as intelligent and also I dont care what people think/say about me, hence I am NOT defined by others.

lol..funny about the sun comment. This happened at work when my colleague looked out of the window and the sun was setting. He said its beautiful sunset. I said "Oh but the sun doesnt set, its the earth that is rotating around it, giving the impression that the sun is setting. So visually some things can be deceptive. The Reality is different to how we sometimes perceive things" hehe.... He was like lol. poor guy!

 

[Xander]

Thankyou Xander!! for taking that comment back. I was beginning to think which planet have I been all this time? Because I do consider myself as intelligent and also I dont care what people think/say about me, hence I am NOT defined by others.

A negative feedback ENFP? Well I never.

I'm still not buying it till I get written proof though.

Note that I never made any comment in regards to an ENFPs intelligence though. I tend to find most ENFPs to be quite clever, if a little scatty. The one I've known for years I'd rate as more intelligent than I am but I'd still be comfortable putting him in the box of "defined by others". It's not an insult, just an observation.

 

[SillySapienne]

I think it's also that ENFPs will confront when someone they care for is being attacked (or themselves too), as indicated by nemo's friend and what I've learned of ENFPs. Do they like it? No or not always. And it might feel good defending the weak or your friend or yourself. I certaintly enjoy playing Justice. It's Poetic to me... But you'll do it because you feel it's the appopriate thing to do! I recall your defense of your friend CN and that guy.

9 out of 10 times, I will actively respond and defend a person whom I witness being wrongfully attacked. And the 1 out of the 10 times I don't, I end up feeling like a complete shitbox about it. Mean people suck, and I have zero tolerance for bullies and sadistic pricks (I've been known to make them cry, and even apologize!)

Over all, I enjoy defending the innocent, and I enjoy supporting what's true.

*I have always identified with the child in the fairytale, The Emperor's New Clothes

Oh, and I was right, CN's guy ended up being a prick.

Sometimes I'm told I'm cold or distant or just a weirdo!! )

Like, duh.

Didn't you know that all individuals possessing a vagina+intelligence+insight+wit = mutant freaks of nature!!!!

Behold...she thinks!?!?!!

I take it back, ENFPs are also smartasses, just in a different way.

CC, I think you're an ENFP. Reason being is that you're connected to others to the point where I'd expect you to be in part defined by them and yet you baulk at the idea of being defined by others or pigeonholed by a system. Apparently this is characteristic of an ENFP. Also you're comments are more familiar and on a personal level than ENTPs tend to.

 

[Butterfly]

but I'd still be comfortable putting him in the box of "defined by others". It's not an insult, just an observation.

I still disagree!!!

 

[substitute]

My experience of my brother and myself as a pair has led me so far to find that we both use the same method to search for information, but we use different methods to filter it. Quite often we both do the same 'aha!' at the same moment, we both perceive the same things or in the same way, we both love to brainstorm and we're masters of the rapid fire anything. But where we tend to disagree is with our evaluation of the data we perceive. Whilst I tend to look at things from a more sorta communal, practical and perhaps dutiful sorta point of view, he tends to look at them from a more individualist point of view. He takes things personally a lot more and though we're both awful at taking criticism, his reaction is hurt feelings whilst mine is more like curiosity or indignation if I perceive it to be inaccurate; his concern is to be liked, whilst mine is to be accurately perceived, not caring so much whether that then leads to someone liking or disliking me.

And yes, he can be much crueller than me and tends to be able to justify his own behaviour more easily, he can easily shake people off who attach to him if he doesn't like them or find them interesting, whilst I tend to feel a sorta duty to stick with them and work with them and stuff, regardless of whether I like them much.

I can't say how much of this is ENTP/ENFP and how much is just me and him.

 

[Xander]

I still disagree!!!

That's fine. It'd be impossible to sort anyway without large quantities of drinks and closer proximity.

Just as long as you recognise that you are in fact wrong, this will be proven at a later date. I mean it's obvious... you're not even an INTP or nothin

 

[SillySapienne]

I hope you find something out of this! I <3 ENFPs!!!!

Yeah, I'm like your long lost better best friend. Why am I better? Because I've got boobs.


Oh, and feel better soon.

sick nemo = sad Captain, and healthy nemo = happy Chick



... boobs

 

[zarc]

sick nemo = sad Captain, and healthy nemo = happy Chick



... boobs

How is it that I got so lost with that? I thought you were playing on Captain Nemo and then he turned into.. err..nvm... unless this nemo wakes up...erm nvm..

uhm... boobs. Baha-ha'i unity of boobs.

 

[SillySapienne]

What's all this, "ENFPs strive to be liked", business?

Having people like me has never been a goal, or pursuit of mine. Although I do like/enjoy quality attention from a select few, I cannot stand being center stage, or receiving unwanted attention.

And substitute, I relate more to your description of yourself, than that of your brother's.

 

[nemo]

Did someone say boobs?

(CC knows how to get me up. She must be telepathic.)

 

[Dom]

From my experience with both types, I would say that is dead on. ENFPs have ideas and they can be utterly cruel and heartless in the way they express them. ENTPs, on the other hand, share their ideas with a flair for tact and grace.

Only when i've had too, like having to turn my heart to stone to leave my ex-wife.

I've described it like this, ENFPs bend and blend to accomodate others, too much too esily really. Then when that accomodation intrudes into our values, we stop accomodating and people see this as harsh, a sudden cold change, when really it is a response to people continually not appreicating or not caring that we are compromising...

My experience of ENTPs and I'm including my other best mate here, is that they are cold calculating, heartless, guiltless, manipulative, and crafty... they will say something which you think is what you wanted/needed to say and then later you'll realise that in the exact wrods they left room for them to deny having made a commitment or some such...

ENTPs live by desperately wanting to be amazing, or viewed that way, and with the option of plausable deniability about all things especcially commiments that limit their freedom of action

 

[SillySapienne]

How is it that I got so lost with that? I thought you were playing on Captain Nemo and then he turned into.. err..nvm... unless this nemo wakes up...erm nvm..

uhm... boobs. Baha-ha'i unity of boobs.

Boobs, clitoris boobs boobs. Labia majora nipples boobs bush boobs. Mons pubis boobs pussy boobs boobs!!!

 

[zarc]

omgosh. I Ni-ed nemo into existence courtesy of CC's boobs! Did you sneeze yourself into a....?

Edit: CC You're derailing your own thread lol

 

[nemo]

What's all this, "ENFPs strive to be liked", business?

Having people like me has never been a goal, or pursuit of mine. Although I do like/enjoy quality attention from a select few, I cannot stand being center stage, or receiving unwanted attention.

And substitute, I relate more to your description of yourself, than that of your brother's.

My old boobless best friend was sort like this, sorta not.

I'd say he wanted people to like him just because it got him in the door, so to speak. If he was antagonistic with any group of people, they wouldn't open up. It helped in his goals to understand humanity and all that.

Actually, the people he was antagonistic with he had no desire to get to know/understand. And he never really cared about repairing those bridges.

But being liked was never the main objective. I don't think he got any big ego trips off that.