The Impeachment Thread

[Justin of Flavia Neapolis]

What is the ideal outcome of the impeachment proceedings?

.

 

[The Cat]

exoneration or a lynching depends on who you ask. Both will likely say justice...

 

[Jaguar]

The Evangelicals are after the filthy bastard:

It’s time to say what we said 20 years ago when a president’s character was revealed for what it was.
Trump Should Be Removed from Office | Christianity Today

"But the facts in this instance are unambiguous: The president of the United States attempted to use his political power to coerce a foreign leader to harass and discredit one of the president’s political opponents. That is not only a violation of the Constitution; more importantly, it is profoundly immoral."

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

The Evangelicals are after the filthy bastard:

It’s time to say what we said 20 years ago when a president’s character was revealed for what it was.
Trump Should Be Removed from Office | Christianity Today

"But the facts in this instance are unambiguous: The president of the United States attempted to use his political power to coerce a foreign leader to harass and discredit one of the president’s political opponents. That is not only a violation of the Constitution; more importantly, it is profoundly immoral."

Meh, if they objected to that kind of behavior to begin with, they wouldn't have voted for him in the first place. If they did care, they looked the other way because they thought it would help their political goals. I'm not sure why they wouldn't do so again.

How influential is that website among people Republican-voting evangelicals? I'd be willing to bet lots of them don't read it.

 

[Jaguar]

Meh, if they objected to that kind of behavior to begin with, they wouldn't have voted for him in the first place.

He wasn't bribing Ukraine at the time of his election. Goofball.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

He wasn't bribing Ukraine at the time of his election. Goofball.

But, um, were you surprised that he bribed Ukraine? Nobody who doesn't have a hard-on for authoritarian reality-tv show personalities (who don't believe it anyway) would be surprised by that.

 

[Jaguar]

But, um, were you surprised that he bribed Ukraine? Nobody who doesn't have a hard-on for authoritarian reality-tv show personalities (who don't believe it anyway) would be surprised by that.

That argument blows. lol.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

That argument blows. lol.

I just don't see why people who don't care about character or integrity would suddenly start caring about these things.

 

[Jaguar]

I just don't see why people who don't care about character or integrity would suddenly start caring about these things.

Is that a blanket jab at Evangelicals?

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

Is that a blanket jab at Evangelicals?

Well, the ones who voted for Trump.

 

[Jaguar]

Well, the ones who voted for Trump.

Did it ever occur to you some of them were just plain stupid? That's not the same as "not caring about character or integrity."

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

Did it ever occur to you some of them were just plain stupid? That's not the same as "not caring about character or integrity."

That's actually a salient point.

 

[Nicodemus]

Does anyone one know if this means he *has to* testify under oath?

No, he does not. Though it would certainly be spectacularly entertaining to see him melt and burst at the same time.

The Evangelicals are after the filthy bastard:

It’s time to say what we said 20 years ago when a president’s character was revealed for what it was.
Trump Should Be Removed from Office | Christianity Today

"But the facts in this instance are unambiguous: The president of the United States attempted to use his political power to coerce a foreign leader to harass and discredit one of the president’s political opponents. That is not only a violation of the Constitution; more importantly, it is profoundly immoral."

I take it this is a magazine of some importance? Would be nice if evangelicals managed to remember their faith before the Senate begins the impeachment trial.

 

[Totenkindly]

generalized interview with CT editor in chief:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/reli...ays-president-trump-should-be-removed-office/

They have actually been critical of Trump during 2016 and on/off again over the last few years, but this is the first real "dig in the heels" comments about removing him they've made, I think.

 

[ceecee]

No, he does not. Though it would certainly be spectacularly entertaining to see him melt and burst at the same time.


I take it this is a magazine of some importance? Would be nice if evangelicals managed to remember their faith before the Senate begins the impeachment trial.

Billy Graham started the magazine but I put no stock in it as they could have said this in the beginning and didn't and I guarantee they all voted for Trump. But I've noticed this about certain sects of Christianity and I think they stfu when they know they've gone almost too far into the political world as more and more people feel - churches want to participate in the political process, endorse candidates and influence voters - no problem. But you will lost all tax exempt status.

 

[Totenkindly]

Trump attacks Billy Graham's Christianity Today after editorial

Far left, trump calls them... dear god... yeah, so "far left" it spins all the way around to the right?

 

[Z Buck McFate]

This is just a bit promising, to learn there might be weak links in Moscow Mitch's fence. From Al Franken's blog: It’s in Roberts’ Court

John Roberts will preside over the impeachment trial of President Trump in the United States Senate. That’s because Roberts is the Chief Justice of the United States. That’s what it says in the Constitution. Not “Chief Justice of the Supreme Court.” He is the Chief Justice of the United States.

[...]

This is self-evident to a large majority of Americans. In a poll released this week, 71% of Americans want Trump Administration officials like acting White House chief of staff, Mick “Get Used to It” Mulvaney and former national security advisor John “Drug Deal” Bolton to testify during the Senate trial. That number includes 64% of Republicans and 72% of independents!

[...]

According to the Senate’s “Rules of Procedure and Practice,” as presiding officer, Chief Justice Roberts “shall direct all forms of the proceedings.” Which means he can make sure that Democrats are able to call for Mulvaney or Bolton or Pompeo to testify.

[...]Yes, McConnell will object. But it takes is a majority to override his objection. That means it will take just four Republicans to say, “Hey, if the President can stop any witness at any time from testifying before Congress, then we’ve fundamentally changed the balance of power that the Founders created.” Collins? McSally? Tillis? Ernst? All running for re-election? How many would defy 64% of Republicans and 72% of independents?

​

Trump attacks Billy Graham's Christianity Today after editorial

Far left, trump calls them... dear god... yeah, so "far left" it spins all the way around to the right?

I've kinda been wondering how long it would take before his tendency to compulsively smear anyone who says something he doesn't like would start to make a dent in his base. The stuff he said about this magazine was just the usual, completely predictable kind of pejorative he spews - and though his base might swallow it whole when it's about actual opponents, there's got to be a point where they feel too much cognitive dissonance to stay comfortable about the stuff he spews about those closer to home, right?

I mostly stopped getting my hopes up when I see indications like this that his "My kingdom for a horse!!" moment is coming. But yeah, "far left" and about Christianity Today (which is "doing poorly" - like everything/everyone he compulsively lashes out at) gave me one of these fleeting moments.

 

[Maou]

 

[Nicodemus]

You would do well in Russia.

 

[Totenkindly]

I've kinda been wondering how long it would take before his tendency to compulsively smear anyone who says something he doesn't like would start to make a dent in his base. The stuff he said about this magazine was just the usual, completely predictable kind of pejorative he spews - and though his base might swallow it whole when it's about actual opponents, there's got to be a point where they feel too much cognitive dissonance to stay comfortable about the stuff he spews about those closer to home, right?

I mostly stopped getting my hopes up when I see indications like this that his "My kingdom for a horse!!" moment is coming. But yeah, "far left" and about Christianity Today (which is "doing poorly" - like everything/everyone he compulsively lashes out at) gave me one of these fleeting moments.

Well, evangelicals are notorious for circling the wagons and punishing those who break ranks. I can't remember what the org name was, but the Christian ministry that prints the weekly "world news" fliers that get distributed in church. I think one winter they announced they would accept monogamous gay married people on staff and two days later walked it back because they were losing all their funding. It almost destroyed their ministry, which was more focused on providing goods and foodstuffs to needy overseas countries I thin k.

CT has had the same woes as many regular paper news mags, with everything going towards free and electronic. (I mean, Newsweek had to go virtual after getting bought by Daily Beast, years ago.) I did used to buy it from 1998-2006 or so. It tried to push boundaries in some respects but it's a hard row to hoe. When my favorite movie reviewer left, I stopped reading and instead followed his own personal blogging/website -- he was a guy who could see the good in something's essence regardless of where it fell on the doctrine scale. But those free thinker / fair-minded people struggle in that environment; you get haters, and you also get people who are simply steeped in that mindset as "truth" and thus out of sincerity also push back against what seems obvious to those outside the group.

Anyway, CT was actually running alternate opinion things in 2016 onwards (including why one prominent Christian was planning to vote for Clinton), and from time to time they have done slapdowns of Trump regarding immigration. But it's like talking to the deaf. This is pretty direct finally, and I think the EiC is retiring (so maybe he feels like he has capital to burn). I know their traffic has shot way up, lol.

But yeah, it's the big problem in that culture -- that when you DO speak up, you are pretty much immediately kicked to the curb. It's a huge commitment with great cost. Unless a bunch of them choose to do sacrifice their standing in that culture, nothing changes.