[MBTI General] Why NFs think that they understand NTs ?

[Virtual ghost]

First I will say that I am not posting this as a provocation I am really interested in this topic. Also I know that Fs and Ts are very wide groups. So I will generalize. SFs are free to join the party as well.



In many threads around this forum I have seen that NF claim soimething that goes in this direction and that they understand.
For example typical claim is that we don't understand our own feelings.
But in almost all cases you are "attacking" our feeling side or you just place focus on it. While you tend to overlook/ignore out thinking side on regular basis. Only if we have something interesting and/or controversial to show you will pay more attention.



But in general you are not too interested in our thinking side and even if you are you are still more interested in our feelings.
So I would really like to read your comments about this.


On the other hand how can you fully understand someone if you "ignore" the largest part of them? So even if you understand our feelings you can't clearly understand how they are related to our thinking side. What means that you don't understand much actually.




In real life it happened plenty of times that NFs are projecting their emotion on me since it seems logical that I am feeling the same as they do.
So when I say that they are wrong I get accused that I am lying to them and myself.
This does not happen always but it is not that much unusual. But if I start to explain myself I get something like "You need professional help."
However I admit that when it comes to me personally that is not so crazy idea.


Is it that really that hard to accept that a person does not feel over some period of time? (if we take classical everyday definition of feelings)

 

[runvardh]

Shit, I always thought their majority thinking was a good thing and appreciated them for that. Only time I get concerned about their feelings past just the basic politeness is when they get closer to me. The slight close off is frustrating at times, but I hardly have any real bitch about it. I do know, however, that most Fs have an issue where they overreact to their frustrations and perceptions of hurt, so it may just be that.

 

[Snow Turtle]

It may be a superficial post but.

Understanding feelings is understanding thinking.
The topic of interest is however a different matter. A clever person would not be selective as that does not give a holistic approach, however there are some things that simply are irrelevant.

 

[Lauren Ashley]

I've never noticed that NFs proclaim to understand NTs, as a whole. Got specific examples?

 

[Laurie]

NF's think they understand *some* NT's because.. they do. Lots of NF's have NT friends or romantic relationships. Why wouldn't they think there is an understanding?

Best friends for years with an NT when he told me very personal things about himself and his relationships. Should I think I didn't understand him because he is an NT? I've been good friends with many NT's. Why would I think I don't "understand" them?

 

[Synarch]

I don't think NF's claim to understand NT's. The question should really be "How do NF's understand NT's?"

 

[INA]

The projection is something NTs often complain about. The perspectives of this thread may help, especially the second half:
http://www.typologycentral.com/forums/nt-rationale/12136-hurt-feelings-nt-s.html

 

[ajblaise]

I guess the theory is that since NTs are emotionally handicapped, NFs are able to empathize and understand our feelings better than we can understand them ourselves.

 

[Litvyak]

I'm really curious about what the OP tries to prove/accomplish with all these topics...

 

[Virtual ghost]

I've never noticed that NFs proclaim to understand NTs, as a whole. Got specific examples?

Just take a look at at the post below yours.




I am well aware of the fact that the OP is shallow but I had to make generalizations. Since I don't want to make a huge post that no one will want to read. (and I have the tendency to do that)

 

[Laurie]

Just take a look at at the post below yours.

Can you address the questions in the post below hers?

eta: You also missed the "as a whole" in her post.

 

[Virtual ghost]

Can you address the questions in the post below hers?

Maybe I am wrong but I will take my chances. Are there any chances that you use slight sarcasms becuse you are slighty annoyed?

Since Fs in real life can get quite annoyed if I don't use names on communication.

NF's think they understand *some* NT's because.. they do. Lots of NF's have NT friends or romantic relationships. Why wouldn't they think there is an understanding?

Best friends for years with an NT when he told me very personal things about himself and his relationships. Should I think I didn't understand him because he is an NT? I've been good friends with many NT's. Why would I think I don't "understand" them?

That actually depends upon individuals since there are many possibe combinations. I am not saying that good amount of understanding is impossible but it is quite likely that some holes in key areas could remain.

This isn't that much about understanding how much it is about picturing the inner process of feelings and thoughts.

 

[Lauren Ashley]

Just take a look at at the post below yours.

Well, it makes sense that she would think she understands someone that she's known for years. Don't most people believe this, regardless of the person's type?

And yes, you missed "as a whole." Do NFs claim to understand NTs as a whole? Or just NTs that are well acquainted with?

 

[FemMecha]

I have strong doubts that it is possible for any person to fully understand another person (existential isolation and all that). People often compensate for that by making claims to understand, use self as the point of reference to project an understanding of people, use prejudices to simplify things, or just communicate with more certainty because it might make them feel understood when others do that. It doesn't affect everyone that way, it can easily make people feel more misunderstood. I'm not seeing this as a strictly NF-> NT dynamic.

People tell me I'm all kinds of things that I'm not. I've been called fragile, rebellious, judgmental, not normal for approaching emotional crisis in a detached manner, seemingly incapable, so talented, the sweet one, too involved emotionally with others, too distant, uppity, too low a self esteem, etc. I think this is common to the human experience. People of all types are going to project their own selves and their own fears onto others. It happens and the best way to stop it is to minimize doing it to others personally. I'm sure I've done it since I'm human, but I don't value it and would hope to stop if it were pointed out. I recently said in an attempt to compliment a family member that I know who they are, that I've seen them treat others kindly through the years, etc. After hanging up I felt a little distressed that I had worded it like that. I don't think I know her in any absolute way, but words are limited to communicate.

NFs as a category are plausibly more prone to analyzing people for the sake of it. I think though, that the ones who understand the nature of subjective information are going to realize on some level that when the information is approximate, so are the conclusions.

 

[Virtual ghost]

Here is my main problem with NFs.
All of this sounds quite well/nice on "paper" but in reality things are not that ideal. Since if you emotionally charge NF, their approach will change for quite a bit.


So once they are OK with it but tomorrow they are not. Also they can get angry at you because you don't follow their state of mind. Which is because NT was unafected by a course of events ? (at least not emotionally).

When I am dealing with NFs the only real problem is when they get emotional.
For example when they are angry they expect to argue you with you. But if you remain calm like nothing happened they will explode completely.


Why you can't use same logic/approach every day if you understand the person ?
Or this has nothing do with us since you are just venting or something like that?

I don't know about other NTs but I have experianced this more then once.



I am not saying that NTs don't do this sa well from time to time but this is much more expressed in NFs. Also I think that genders play a role in this.


Don't overlook the fact that many people don't know what MBTI is.

 

[FemMecha]

That does sound quite frustrating, but do be aware that your statements do not apply to everyone with an NF by their name. Assuming that is a kind of projection based on experience.

 

[Virtual ghost]

That does sound quite frustrating, but do be aware that your statements do not apply to everyone with an NF by their name. Assuming that is a kind of projection based on experience.

That is exactly why I said in the first post that I am generalizing. Since I don't know which people on this forum to this and which don't do this.
I know that there are NFs that don't behave like this in most cases.

 

[Tiny Army]

I am making an attempt to truly understand NTs. I use the information I already have (from the maddeningly large number of NTs I have in my life) to draw out more information from other NTs. If I am wrong surely someone will correct me.

I am always going to trust an NTs explanation of their own emotions over mine, but I do think that NFs an offer insight to aspects of an NTs personality that they themselves have not examined. We may not be right but we can at least get you thinking in the right direction.

 

[Laurie]

I don't think I understand YOU. I don't think, logically, you can deduce any conclusions about how I, or other NFs, understand other NTs. Or how other NTs feel about it.

You seem very close minded and frustrated with NFs. I think back on another thread where people were surmising that you aren't actually an NT at all. It puts an interesting spin on your threads.

 

[Athenian200]

We might sometimes think we understand NTs because their behavior is fairly predictable in some situations.

Do we think we understand their feelings? No, no one can really understand another person's feelings perfectly, so there are naturally going to be misunderstandings when we misread an emotional signal emitted by an NT.

We don't think we understand them, we just try to understand them using the tools we have.