[NF] why are nf's nihilists?

[velocity]

discuss.




but seriously, is this possible?
if so, in what form(s)?
are you? do you know one? is it contagious?

 

[Cronkle]

Say what you want about the tenets of national socialism, Dude, at least it's an ethos.

 

[speculative]

Is the popular notion that NTs (type 5s) are nihilists and NFs are not generally, and so this question is about those NFs who are against the grain nihilists, or those of us who have nihilist tendencies when it otherwise goes against our type?

 

[MrME]

Remember that everything has a beginning and an ending.

Work backwards from there.

 

[Kyrielle]

Remember that everything has a beginning and an ending.

Work backwards from there.

Not neccessarily so. There are feedback loops that have no defined beginning or ending because what could be the beginning is influenced by what could be the ending, and so telling the two apart is difficult/impossible/pointless.

I'm somewhat of an existential nihilist. In that I think that life, as a whole and as untouched and unconcerned with humans, does not have a meaning, it just is. However, that doesn't mean I think that everyone should just dissolve into apathy and say, "Well then fuck it, what's the point of it all?" Life only acquires meaning when you give it meaning. Life will not automatically hand you purpose. You have to find that for yourself.

There are a lot of other nihilist thoughts I have as I tend to think a lot of things we take for granted as inherent traits of humanity are actually things we are conditioned to think before we can even speak. It's not all doom and gloom though. It just means that we've crafted a complex system for ourselves, and I think that, if anything, is an inherent human tendency. To create complex systems to make life "make sense" and give it a guise of having a point.

 

[whimsical]

too positive/optimistic to be a nihilist

 

[cascadeco]

I just quickly browsed some of the definitions of nihilism on the web.

# Nihilism (from the Latin nihil, nothing) is a philosophical position that argues that existence is without objective meaning, purpose, or ...
# Extreme skepticism, maintaining that nothing has a real existence; The rejection of all moral principles
# nihilist - someone who rejects all theories of morality or religious belief

There seems to be a pretty broad array of definitions (and I only pasted in a few), so given that, I don't think as a whole it describes me. But certainly there are aspects of my beliefs that might be similar.

In that I think that life, as a whole and as untouched and unconcerned with humans, does not have a meaning, it just is. However, that doesn't mean I think that everyone should just dissolve into apathy and say, "Well then fuck it, what's the point of it all?" Life only acquires meaning when you give it meaning. Life will not automatically hand you purpose. You have to find that for yourself.

I've said/thought the same quite often.

To create complex systems to make life "make sense" and give it a guise of having a point.

I agree with this. Psychologically [most/all] people have a strong pull towards needing to have a purpose/point to their life, so in that sense it's almost inevitable on the individual level up to the societal level that people create a point - consciously or not. Religion is the traditional medium in which this is done (and maybe ism's like nationalism would also apply to a lesser extent?), and it is also trying to convey the abstract into the tangible - and in that translation things get royally messed up, since people latch onto the human-created tangible (in my opinion. Although, I don't even believe much of the abstract that the tangible is based off of..so that's another thing ).

 

[Athenian200]

In my case? Because there's nothing about the nature of reality that suggest to me that it has an inherent meaning other than the one people give it. To me, this means that meanings we define for ourselves are than much more significant... because there's no universal meaning defining everything for us, deciding what all our choices mean regardless of how we see them. It means that what we choose to value or not value matters more than it would if there were a universal value scheme that applied regardless of choice.

 

[tibby]

the moment you realize life is taking you nowhere is when life begins to have meaning.

 

[nanook]

nihilism = Ti (deconstructionism/relativism of moral leads to the assumption that no moral exists "for real", as moral is defined (mis-perceived) as construct, by the constructionist eye (Ti) of the deconstructionist, therefore aspects of moral that are not constructed are simply not recognized). to put it differently: Ti is moral autism. (if imploded). Fi is sometimes just as stupid. if it starts to play the pluralistic/relativistic game.

intuition=anarchy as attitude/platitude (as in: you wont be allowed to hold me accountable for my views (as you see them), because you cannot ever retrace/grasp them correctly)

 

[Stanton Moore]

Perhaps the nihilism you refer to is a product of fear and estrangment. NF's tend to feel estranged, and that might be turned outward as a disdain for social institutions.

Nihilism is a safe bet when enough estrangement has accrued.

 

[Splittet]

There is probably going to be more nihilists among Ns, because Ns on average are more into philosophy, and some of the people who are into philosophy will end up as nihilists. If you are not into philosophy you won't think too deeply about the meaning behind it all, and will take a lot of it for granted, while nihilism really is taking nothing for granted.

 

[MrME]

nihilism = Ti (deconstructionism/relativism of moral leads to the assumption that no moral exists "for real", as moral is defined (mis-perceived) as construct, by the constructionist eye (Ti) of the deconstructionist, therefore aspects of moral that are not constructed are simply not recognized). to put it differently: Ti is moral autism. (if imploded). Fi is sometimes just as stupid. if it starts to play the pluralistic/relativistic game.

What? I don't get this at all. Are you suggesting that there are moral underpinnings to the universe itself? Ti is moral autism? What does that even mean?

 

[Nonsensical]

I wouldn't consider myself a nihilist. Nor would I consider NFs to be nihilists, not even in any general manner, whatsoever. Did you mean to put this into the NT section?

 

[the state i am in]

the moment you realize life is taking you nowhere is when life begins to have meaning.

you have an understatedness that reminds me of my favorite author milan kundera. i think he too is an infj, i always describe him as a sleeker modernized more distilled dostoeyevsky.



i also sometimes describe myself as the most idealistic nihilist you'll ever meet. it has to do with having ideals and the painful memories of disillusionment, when you (your ideals!) in all your glory and splendor were the fateful day squashed like a bug on the concrete.

idealists go thru nihilistic phases when they shed their skin, evolve, and update themselves. liminality is a painful process where you atone for your sins and wait for your body to burn the waste and refuse and LIES out.

 

[Little Linguist]

discuss.




but seriously, is this possible?
if so, in what form(s)?
are you? do you know one? is it contagious?

1. Not me.
2. Not at all.
3. No. No. No idea.

 

[Xellotath]

I am a nihilist.

Not by choice but by logical conclusion.
It's a struggle, to be honest. As an ENFP, adopting that particular philosophy is hell.

Nihilism denies that fundamental connection and hope that I normally feel. Leaves me feeling, cold, useless and uninspiring.

Imagine having a mind wired to see webs of beautiful, emotionally-charged meaning between people.. placing all of your ego in these visions... only to completely deconstruct them the second your intellect kicks in. Absolutely -no- sense of right and wrong and that's final.

To be massively stereotypical:
-NTs see the world as a logical puzzle, so they are fine with nihilism. They will use rationality no matter the emotional "truth" of things.
-S types generally don't care about the meaning of life.
-NF's are divided in Fe and Fi users. Fe's emotional charge is directed towards others and not to values, these types have Ni somewhere, which focused on the self [They probably think, as long as I'm ok, its fine all fine.]

Nihilism attacks Fi, in a truly vicious manner because none of the usual tricks work. We can no longer say "Oh gee, the world is not -that- dark and meaningless", because it is. All hope is reduced to nothing.

Of course, it's no wonder Fi's generally go for new age nonsense, or probably try to comfort themselves with pseudo-spiritual, anti-deterministic extrapolations from quantum mechanics.

.....Whatever protects the ego, really.

 

[Little Linguist]

Nihilism basically goes completely against my view of the world!!!!

Nihilism (from the Latin nikhil, nothing) is the philosophical position that values do not exist but rather are falsely invented.[1] Most commonly, nihilism is presented in the form of existential nihilism which argues that life[2] is without meaning, purpose or intrinsic value. Moral nihilists assert that morality does not exist, and subsequently there are no moral values with which to uphold a rule or to logically prefer one action over another. Nihilism can also take the form of epistemological, metaphysical or mereological nihilism.
The term nihilism is sometimes used synonymously with anomie to denote the general mood of despair at the pointlessness of existence that one has when they realize there are no necessary norms, rules, or laws.[3] Movements such as Futurism and deconstructionism,[4] among others, have been identified by commentators as "nihilistic" at various times in various contexts. Often this means or is meant to imply that the beliefs of the accuser are more substantial or truthful, whereas the beliefs of the accused are nihilistic, and thereby comparatively amount to nothing (or are simply claimed to be destructively amoralistic).

This is complete bullshit!!!!!! :steam:

 

[the state i am in]

-NF's are divided in Fe and Fi users. Fe's emotional charge is directed towards others and not to values, these types have Ni somewhere, which focused on the self [They probably think, as long as I'm ok, its fine all fine.]

Fe feels cold and nihilistic when rejected, unloved, uninspired. the environment around us turns dark, there is no light to see/no light moving to connect. when the emotional current that runs thru our veins runs dry. then nothing means anything bc no one loves anyone. the world is cold bc the sun will never come out again and the earth will turn into black soot, dust, and ash.

we run on fuel produced in the burning of the beautiful too.

Nihilism attacks Fi, in a truly vicious manner because none of the usual tricks work. We can no longer say "Oh gee, the world is not -that- dark and meaningless", because it is. All hope is reduced to nothing.

Of course, it's no wonder Fi's generally go for new age nonsense, or probably try to comfort themselves with pseudo-spiritual, anti-deterministic extrapolations from quantum mechanics.

.....Whatever protects the ego, really.

yes, yes, and yes.

there is no relativity whatsoever in Fi. the only technique that truly works is the quarantine.

when it starts to go under nihilisms spell, it just starts exploding until nothing is left but silence, eery silence and the suffering faces peering out from the looking-hole posts. the whole way of existing in the world just goes up in smoke and turns to dizzy furiously churning non-existence and untruth. for Fi it's such a physical disease, and the body has to burn it out before it sinks into a hole from which it can never escape.

 

[BallentineChen]

Nihilism basically goes completely against my view of the world!!!!



This is complete bullshit!!!!!! :steam:

Can you at least substantiate your position. Not because I disagree with you, but because your post otherwise doesn't need to be shared.