The Walking Dead- CONTAINS SPOILERS!

[Totenkindly]

Okay, four episodes into the second half of season four and I thought they were all pretty strong character dev episodes, with some decent action sequences. Cray. See, though, what I hate is that this is what the show does -- I get excited when they have a few deeper episodes where things aren't just a hack writing job... then they turn around and blow the cliffhangers. They don't usually seal the deal.

At least we got to see Beth a little bit more, now that she's not just Maggie's little sister and is on her own with Daryl.

And the prior nailbiter episode with Rick trapped in the house with the other human scavengers was pretty awesome... really had no idea what would happen.

 

[Stigmata]

Okay, four episodes into the second half of season four and I thought they were all pretty strong character dev episodes, with some decent action sequences. Cray. See, though, what I hate is that this is what the show does -- I get excited when they have a few deeper episodes where things aren't just a hack writing job... then they turn around and blow the cliffhangers. They don't usually seal the deal.

At least we got to see Beth a little bit more, now that she's not just Maggie's little sister and is on her own with Daryl.

And the prior nailbiter episode with Rick trapped in the house with the other human scavengers was pretty awesome... really had no idea what would happen.

I thought the second half of the season thus far has been nothing more than a meandering plot snorefest. I have absolutely no problem with character development episodes, so long as I can see some sense of overarching plot still going on.

If I had to summarize this second season so far would be Andrew Lincoln's pseudo southern accent yelling "karllllll" with notable strain in his voice.

 

[Totenkindly]

I thought the second half of the season thus far has been nothing more than a meandering plot snorefest. I have absolutely no problem with character development episodes, so long as I can see some sense of overarching plot still going on.

It hasn't bothered me, as losing the prison can be expected to cause some chaos, regrouping, and lack of direction.

However, I would hope to see some more plot movement now in the last four episodes of the season.

If I had to summarize this second season so far would be Andrew Lincoln's pseudo southern accent yelling "karllllll" with notable strain in his voice.

Sometimes I wander around my apartment after my cat, yelling "Kiiiiitttyyyyy" in my best approximation of that voice. The cat usually hides under the bed.

Another great one is that line from "Face/Off" where Nicholas Cage says, "I'm tired, Eve," but it comes out in some bizarre fakish southern accent as "Ahm tarred, Ehveh."

 

[Ivy]

LOL y'all. CAURRRLL!

I've been okay with the meandering, because it's (as silly as this seems now that I am getting ready to type it) realistic. I do hope and expect the season will have more direction soon. I'm assuming most of them will find their way to Terminus.

I might have already said this in the True Detective thread, but we typically watch both those shows back to back on Monday nights after recording them Sunday, and lately we've been watching TD first. This week I remarked to Noah that you know a show is dark when Walking Dead is your palate cleanser.

 

[SensEye]

I thought the second half of the season thus far has been nothing more than a meandering plot snorefest. I have absolutely no problem with character development episodes, so long as I can see some sense of overarching plot still going on.

If I had to summarize this second season so far would be Andrew Lincoln's pseudo southern accent yelling "karllllll" with notable strain in his voice.

It's been a bit of a snooze fest. This series is having a hard time getting the balance right between character development and plot. Plus at some point, they need to move on from the "every stranger is a self interested barbarian thug" motif. That's getting a bit stale.

It was refreshing to see the red haired army guy (hanging out with Lara Croft no less) be helpful instead of harmful. Of course, Glen ("I want my mommy Maggie") pitched a fit and made a mess of things. But that's Glen for ya.

Anyways, all roads seem to be leading to that sanctuary place. Which probably has to turn out to be another wolf in sheep's clothing for the sake of the show's future.

 

[Stigmata]

It's been a bit of a snooze fest. This series is having a hard time getting the balance right between character development and plot. Plus at some point, they need to move on from the "every stranger is a self interested barbarian thug" motif. That's getting a bit stale.

It was refreshing to see the red haired army guy (hanging out with Lara Croft no less) be helpful instead of harmful. Of course, Glen ("I want my mommy Maggie") pitched a fit and made a mess of things. But that's Glen for ya.

Anyways, all roads seem to be leading to that sanctuary place. Which probably has to turn out to be another wolf in sheep's clothing for the sake of the show's future.

I guess my boredom as of late arises from a sense of "Well, what next?", as we've generally explored all of the themes(well, all the themes I believe a show of this nature could have to offer): displacement, manipulation, loss, hopelessness, loneliness, desperation, the survival instinct overthrowing any sense of morality and ethics that were only ever afforded to us due to the luxury of a comfortable lifestyle.

I guess to me the show has conveyed everything it needed to thus far, and now they should look perhaps toward ending it (which possibly is what they're looking to being towards doing with the sanctuary for humans), as anything other than a fitting end would just serve to be in some way a rehash of said already explored themes.

 

[Totenkindly]

I might have already said this in the True Detective thread, but we typically watch both those shows back to back on Monday nights after recording them Sunday, and lately we've been watching TD first. This week I remarked to Noah that you know a show is dark when Walking Dead is your palate cleanser.

For some reason, this makes me picture a Walking Dead zombie bloodbath with all the characters dancing around with big smiles while butchering (and getting butchered) while singing the Monkees "Daydream Believer" a la Glee.

 

[Totenkindly]

It's been a bit of a snooze fest. This series is having a hard time getting the balance right between character development and plot.

In general, they haven't managed to integrate anything smoothly. It tends to be too much of one thing, then too much of another. WTF were they in the prison a season and a half anyway, without really doing much interesting and varied with it?

Plus at some point, they need to move on from the "every stranger is a self interested barbarian thug" motif. That's getting a bit stale. It was refreshing to see the red haired army guy (hanging out with Lara Croft no less) be helpful instead of harmful.

I think he's a good addition to the cast.

Of course, Glen ("I want my mommy Maggie") pitched a fit and made a mess of things. But that's Glen for ya.

Yeah, I couldn't see him abandoning Maggie even if rationally there's a good chance (from his perspective) that she's dead and/or he'll never find her.

Still, it was momentarily amusing to see him sucker-punch a guy about 6" taller and with 75-100 lbs on him.

Anyways, all roads seem to be leading to that sanctuary place. Which probably has to turn out to be another wolf in sheep's clothing for the sake of the show's future.

I hope they can manage to make it different than the Guv'nor's facility. Don't wanna sit through another season of THAT again.

 

[EffEmDoubleyou]

I think the character development episodes have been hit and miss. The best one by far was the one with Michonne and CORRRALLLL. The rest have been meh. I'm sure having dedicated episodes to certain splinter groups of characters looked great in the writer's room, but it's hard to do that and still have narrative momentum when you're only making 8 episodes at a time.

One thing I am looking forward to, however, is what the deal is with Eugene. I'm thinking that a borderline moron with a mullet isn't exactly humanity's scientific salvation, but I don't know what's going on there. I'm also interested in what happens with the younger of the two girls (can't remember their names) - I swear we saw one of her boots amid that mess of a feeding site we saw in a flash forward (was it Glenn who found it? Can't remember.)

 

[Totenkindly]

I guess my boredom as of late arises from a sense of "Well, what next?", as we've generally explored all of the themes(well, all the themes I believe a show of this nature could have to offer): displacement, manipulation, loss, hopelessness, loneliness, desperation, the survival instinct overthrowing any sense of morality and ethics that were only ever afforded to us due to the luxury of a comfortable lifestyle.

I guess to me the show has conveyed everything it needed to thus far, and now they should look perhaps toward ending it (which possibly is what they're looking to being towards doing with the sanctuary for humans), as anything other than a fitting end would just serve to be in some way a rehash of said already explored themes.

The comic book itself is still being written, so I doubt that's going to happen at the moment. Besides, they're making too much money off TWD.

TBH, there is no satisfying conclusion. Either the leads all get eaten and/or willingly kill themselves to embrace the futility of their existence; or they find a safe place to hole up with nothing resolved. The only other conclusion is to find a cure for the zombie infestation, but that seems unlikely.

I think if the current state of the world has worn out its welcome, it was due to the fault of the writing staff in past seasons. But I think giving them an actual MISSION other than survival would help. The thought of getting that doc to Wash DC is one "quest" idea. Basically, they need a quest beyond just surviving, to make things interesting. Maybe they might not survive it, but it gives direction as well as reasons to die versus attrition from getting eaten.

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

As much as I enjoy the Daryl character, I found this latest episode something of a letdown. I don't know why, it just didn't do it for me. Usually I can't watch without sitting on the edge of my couch and biting my fingers to nubs.

Perhaps its the way they've handled Beth's character development up until now.

I'm most interested in seeing where the Rick/CAURRRL/Michonne and Carol/Tyreese/kids story arcs go at this point.

 

[Totenkindly]

Yeah, I'm waiting to see what happens when Tyresse finds out what Carol did.

The shyte better hit the fan or I'll be disappointed.

 

[Totenkindly]

Based on yesterday's conversation, I'll share this -- found it today.

http://www.fool.com/investing/gener...-walking-dead-spinoff-kill-the-franchise.aspx

AMC Networks' (NASDAQ: AMCX) The Walking Dead continues to be the top show on cable, and much like its zombies, the franchise...just...doesn't...stop. There are video games, comic books, novels, action figures, a talk show, and even a companion spinoff in the works. Will it succeed where others have failed?

What's the franchise worth?

In late 2011, 24/7 Wall Street and NBC News estimated the size of the "zombie economy" to be nearly $6 billion. Blockbuster movies like 28 Days Later and Zombieland accounted for about half of this figure, while the remaining dollars were split mostly between games, comics, and television. Assuming reasonable growth over the past two years, aided by World War Z, and Dead's rising popularity -- season four viewership is double that of season two -- $7 billion isn't out of the question.

But what's The Walking Dead franchise worth? As fellow Fool Tim Beyers writes, international distribution and "the richest content wellspring in all of entertainment" indicate it could be ten figures. A billion-dollar valuation would rival what some think James Bond and Iron Man are worth, and while that seems a bit high, AMC's Dead still has a long way to go.

The current series has covered about 40% of Robert Kirkman's ongoing comic book storyline, meaning there's potential for at least six more seasons. Given that Kirkman himself has already revealed plans for Issue number 200 (78 issues from now), the television show could last well beyond 10 seasons. Perhaps there is some truth to jokes made by AMC CEO Josh Sapan last year, who remarked that the show could still be on the air in 2022.

And then of course, the spinoff:

But that's not even the most intriguing aspect of The Walking Dead. AMC has also announced a companion series, or spinoff if you will, that Kirkman says, "will be another group of characters, surviving in another part of the world," according to ComicBook. He adds, "The [primary] show will continue uninterrupted, as if the other [spinoff] show doesn't exist." A target date of 2015 is about all else that's known at the moment.

 

[Stigmata]

Based on yesterday's conversation, I'll share this -- found it today.

http://www.fool.com/investing/gener...-walking-dead-spinoff-kill-the-franchise.aspx



And then of course, the spinoff:

So, basically...

 

[SensEye]

As much as I enjoy the Daryl character, I found this latest episode something of a letdown. I don't know why, it just didn't do it for me. Usually I can't watch without sitting on the edge of my couch and biting my fingers to nubs.

Me too. I think it's just too much of the same thing (hopping between these small groups of characters wandering aimlessly and "getting to know each other"). It gets boring after a while. Zombie atmosphere aside, the last episode could have just been any two strangers sitting in a coffee shop discussing their past lives for an hour.

A couple of episodes of that nature, after the not particularly compelling guv's revenge story arc in the 1st half of the season were OK as a change of pace. But that's been done now, and we need some story arc action now. But I get the feeling it's more of the same for the rest of this season, with maybe a re-uniting taking place at season finale.

I watched a lot of that last episode on double speed. I'm out of patience for interpersonal blather. After 10 mins, all the conversations sound the same.

Interesting to see how the show is still a money machine. For me personally, while I am still a fan, this show has dropped from watch it as soon as I can, to watch it when I've got nothing better to do. I watched the last 2 episodes back to back about 10 days after the first of the pair went to air. That's not a good sign if I am any reflection of viewers in general (which admittedly, I am probably not).

 

[Totenkindly]

TWD slid back on my must-watch list, to about the degree of The Following or right under...

... which admittedly the latter is not a great "dramatic" show in the least, but at least it gets my curiosity up as to what crazy stupid over-the-top things might happen this week. It's basically high-octane popcorn/bonbon drama, but it knows it and it owns it and thus has a lot more leeway.

 

[Stigmata]

The show took a massive nosedive after season 2, and it just seemed like they didn't really pace the plot out that well in the conversion from comics to television.

 

[Totenkindly]

The show took a massive nosedive after season 2, and it just seemed like they didn't really pace the plot out that well in the conversion from comics to television.

Yeah, I think it got sporadic in quality duiring Season 2 (the Shane plotline was great, but the Farm dragged out too long), and especially Season 3 and beyond.

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

I think the problem with the current season, as some of you already mentioned, is more of the same character development for characters that we've already gotten to know or that aren't really interesting characters to begin with. Pair that with the fact that, contrary to Season 2 (where the show meandered until the final few episodes which were pretty balls to the wall action heavy), a lot of tense, nail biting action and suspense in the first half of the season has been followed by a somewhat meandering second half. The Governor story arc was interesting until the writers took it to the all too predictable big revenge/showdown. But that's what most fans wanted, so it was the safe choice for Kirkman and co.


In terms of solid story and steady pacing, I think season 3 was the show's apex.

 

[Totenkindly]

Well, Episode 14 was pretty amazing. Sometimes you feel like characters are introduced simply to die, and you recognize those redshirts when you see them. Or someone seems pointlessly wiped out after you think they will be major characters. This episode was more along the lines of a culmination of a developing storyline that we all knew would eventually resolve, and tonight it did. The last 15 minutes was riveting.

Also, the pieces worked together very very well. I don't think the final resolution between the two adults would have turned out as it did, if the immediately preceding incident with the young 'uns had not turned out as it did. The past incident was reflected in the current incident, they played off each other; and the current incident provided an experiential empathy with one of the adults for the other, that hadn't yet been grasped by that person.

The other major aspect of this plot turn was the moral ambiguity. There were no clear-cut answer, no "perfect solution" to the dilemma. It was more about deciding what one could afford to risk and how to provide the best outcome for the most people. But it was still devastating, and I'm probably gonna take awhile to fall asleep tonight because my mind is cycling through this one over and over. I don't honestly know what I would have done in that situation; I just don't. The course of action taken was logically the most prudent, and maybe even the most merciful, but.... but... sigh.

I think when the show faces ambiguity head-on, that's when it is at its best.