Symbolism in Tarot

[rivercrow]

Oh sure, that's an obvious sort of connection -- I'm wondering more about the context in which that first manifested itself. I think the ubiquity of knives/daggers/swords in the past gave the association a little more oomph than our modern day abstractions -- I just can't quite determine the flavor of the ancient oomph, though.

*chuckles inwardly at all this mental hamster-wheeling and layering of meanings*

The beauty of symbolism.

I'm still kicking around grad school, you know.

 

[raincrow007]

The beauty of symbolism.

I'm still kicking around grad school, you know.

I almost talked myself into going for a PhD in semiotics, but then I realized I had other shit to do that was somewhat more gratifying than becoming another stuffy member of academia.

Besides, all that paperwork sucks ass.

I'm curious -- how do you construct symbols in literature [prose, poetry, whatever]? I imagine it's an entirely different process than making a visual construct, and yet I can see it as being very similar. [For example, a similarity perhaps being the use of a recognized object as a symbol, and then deviating from the audience's expected context that the object is found in, thereby adding another layer of meaning -- or at least leaving room for reinterpretation?].

That's the only really obvious one that I can think of that the moment, though.

 

[rivercrow]

I almost talked myself into going for a PhD in semiotics, but then I realized I had other shit to do that was somewhat more gratifying than becoming another stuffy member of academia.

I am glad now I did not go the semiotics/semantics route. A little sad I didn't pursue Middle Eastern Art in Chicago, but the right things seem to have happened anyway.

Besides, all that paperwork sucks ass.

That's a major bugaboo.

I'm curious -- how do you construct symbols in literature [prose, poetry, whatever]? I imagine it's an entirely different process than making a visual construct, and yet I can see it as being very similar. [For example, a similarity perhaps being the use of a recognized object as a symbol, and then deviating from the audience's expected context that the object is found in, thereby adding another layer of meaning -- or at least leaving room for reinterpretation?].

That's the only really obvious one that I can think of that the moment, though.

That's how I've done it in the past, although I've started getting very thoughtful about avoiding activating people's internal schemas too soon. You saw that in my novel, where the discussion of the protagonists was cloaked and delayed. I liked that -- making the reader use senses to engage with the thing before any cultural implications / biases were triggered.

Introduce the image and let it roll around and get comfy before making the connectoids. Or ghosting the connectoids -- I hate pedantry unless it's absolutely required.

Or, can a symbol or motif be introduced by its conspicuous absence? I think so, but requires more awareness. We are not the New Readers of TSE-TSE's age, equipped with a predictable repertoire that can be activated. I think this is what still fascinates me about deconstructing texts -- it's not as dependent on connections. Or deliberate misreadings of texts....

 

[raincrow007]

Introduce the image and let it roll around and get comfy before making the connectoids. Or ghosting the connectoids -- I hate pedantry unless it's absolutely required.

Or, can a symbol or motif be introduced by its conspicuous absence? I think so, but requires more awareness. We are not the New Readers of TSE-TSE's age, equipped with a predictable repertoire that can be activated. I think this is what still fascinates me about deconstructing texts -- it's not as dependent on connections. Or deliberate misreadings of texts....

Yeah, I think that's a luxury writers have sometimes over visual artists -- direct [or indirect ] narrative. Paintings and other static images require a different sort of work from the audience [as well as the creators]. Sure, it's the same subjective interpretive dance that's done on literature, but I think something about the concreteness of a work of art is a bit more visceral somehow. Maybe intuitive or instinctual is what I mean... more Cups than Swords, let's say.

I like the idea of a symbol resonating through its absence. It seems so very non-Western and mysterious. But you're right -- few pull it off well, and even fewer appreciate it when it happens. At least in literature. I think the absence of something works better visually. It's one of the easiest hooks a visual artist has at his/her disposal to generate mystery: "What's behind that closed door?", "Why is that girl looking out of the picture plane?", etc.

Perhaps it's no more than ghosting connectoids in another fashion. *shrugs*

 

[rivercrow]

I was speaking to a friend this afternoon and we ended up discussing The Hanged Man.

Some images I found:

View attachment 409
From Marita Liulia

This series -- what there is of it, as it's a work in progress -- is promising.

 

[PuddleRiver]

You scored as Empress: 100%
Strength: 81%
Death: 81%

 

[C.J.Woolf]

Which Major Arcana Tarot Card Are You?

You scored as a XIX: The Sun

This is the happiest card in the deck. It is full of joy and optimism, everything is right with the world. We are as innocent children playing in the fields without care. The Sun brings success, well-being and happiness in all spheres - material, emotional, spiritual -wherever our desires lay. When this card appears in a Tarot spread it indicates success, joy and happiness. Obstacles will be overcome, goals achieved.When badly aspected, it can indicate a stagnation through over-indulgence, too much of a good thing.

XIX: The Sun 75%
II - The High Priestess 69%
XVI: The Tower 63%
XIII: Death 56%
0 - The Fool 56%
VI: The Lovers 50%
VIII - Strength 44%
X - Wheel of Fortune 38%
I - Magician 38%
XI: Justice 31%
IV - The Emperor 31%
III - The Empress 19%
XV: The Devil 13%


I've been fortunate in life. I've been very lucky in love; much of my happiness comes from that. On the other hand, I have a history of choosing goals that are readily achievable, and not challenging or testing myself.

 

[raincrow007]

This series -- what there is of it, as it's a work in progress -- is promising.

That one *is* interesting.

Vaguely reminds me of Kahlo crossed with McKean. Or something.

 

[Sahara]

I am really into the Luis Royo tarot deck at the moment:

Labyrinth deck

The Black Tarot deck

I prefer the softness of the first pack, but I really bought them for the images, more than the actual meanings. I tend to play around with my basic decks when doing a reading. (a reading I don't believe in, keep hoping I will be convinced somehow )

 

[Blossom76]

i have a tarot pack never used them wouldnt know how!

 

[Noel]

You scored as a XVI: The Tower

If badly aspected this can be the worst card of the Tarot deck. The Tower always indicates upheaval, possibly chaos, loss and destruction. Its effects are never pleasant and can be painful. The card illustrates lightning striking the Tower. The lightning cannot be avoided, the destruction it brings is inevitable. All we can do is attempt to survive and rebuild. The Tower brings sudden, severe change. When the Tower appears in a Tarot spread it represents sudden and possibly violent change, disruption or loss.

XVI: The Tower 81%
II - The High Priestess 69%
XIX: The Sun 69%
VIII - Strength 69%
XIII: Death 63%
0 - The Fool 56%
I - Magician 56%
III - The Empress 50%
VI: The Lovers 44%
XV: The Devil 38%
IV - The Emperor 31%
XI: Justice 31%
X - Wheel of Fortune 25%

I suppose time will tell.

 

[mystery]

I've been threatened with bodily harm, so I am starting this thread.

Help yourself with silly comments--what I like about Tarot is the symbolism. I'm not a big fan of the Stick Figure Tarot deck and the Thoth deck leaves me wanting something less structured.

RC007 wants a fun thread. Not sure what that means exactly--let's find out!

:hi: i feel the same ...symbolism is very important....and a connection with the pack you use ....i find the dark cards that are quite harsh with the way they are drawn off putting...it took me a search for many years to find the pack for me ... and i love them

 

[Athenian200]

Which Major Arcana Tarot Card Are You?

You scored as a II - The High Priestess
The High Priestess is a card of intuition, instinct and hidden knowledge. She knows all your secrets, you can hide nothing from her. Yet you will never know the secrets she herself protects.If well aspected in a Tarot spread, this card can indicate the use of intuition to solve problems; trust to your instincts. If badly aspected, it can mean suppression and ignoring of such instincts - following your head at the expense of your heart.

Anyway, based on what I've read, here's my guess:

Ne: The Magician, The Fool, Wheel of Fortune, The Tower
Ni: The High Priestess, Death, The Hermit, The Moon
Te: Justice, The Emperor
Fe: The Empress, The Hanged Man, Judgment
Fi: The Star, The World
Si: The Hierophant, Temperance
Se: The Lovers, Strength, The Devil, The Sun, The Chariot

There don't seem to be any cards representing Ti.