[NT] Structured versus Unstructured thoughts

[Lexlike]

Iq tests, chess game etc are good for people with structured thinking but in which fields is unstructured thinking prefered?? In which situations are structured thoughts preferable and in which the opposite?

 

[Mighty Mouse]

Creativity is the epitome of unstructured. It literally means the brain doesn't have to follow certain "rules of engagement". It is free to go where it will to come up with ideas.

 

[Xander]

You need an unstructured mind to see what lies beneath. Too much structure and it all relies upon your origional foundations being correct. The unstructured mind is usually the one to critique the foundations and move things forward... they're rare though.. it takes an epiphany. The structured ones are those who move things forward in the day to day tasks... that don't require imagination

 

[mlittrell]

there can be creativity in structure. look at a novel for example. creativity, in my mind, can come in structured and unstructured ways.

 

[mlittrell]

You need an unstructured mind to see what lies beneath. Too much structure and it all relies upon your origional foundations being correct. The unstructured mind is usually the one to critique the foundations and move things forward... they're rare though.. it takes an epiphany. The structured ones are those who move things forward in the day to day tasks... that don't require imagination

as usual, very well put

btw if you could, please define what you mean by an unstructured and a structured mind

 

[Mighty Mouse]

I wasn't clear.

I didn't mean that creativity is random. There is a context.

Creativity however looks for new ways of understanding and conceptualizing. As far as the brain is concerned whatever is new to it is unstructured.

The structured portion would be anything the brain has learned to understand and do already because it has done it before.

 

[mlittrell]

ahhh thank you for clearing that up. ok, we are on the same page now. good call

 

[Xander]

as usual, very well put

btw if you could, please define what you mean by an unstructured and a structured mind

A<B therfore C=A versus "oo what happens if A is 5 and C is 4??"

 

[mlittrell]

lol reminds me of discrete mathmatics, that was a fun class

 

[FDG]

An unstructured thought process is best whenever the necessity is to deal with reality in an immediate, raw way.

The first situation that comes to my mind, in which I really needed unstructured thinking (I personally think I'm equally adept (or equally bad) at both modes) was when I was free-climbing.

By the way, I don't think IQ tests rely exclusively on structured forms of thinking. At the very least, the visual part does not.

 

[entropie]

I constantly use unstructured thinking with woman. Main problem is, it really never gets structured

 

[Lexlike]

By the way, I don't think IQ tests rely exclusively on structured forms of thinking. At the very least, the visual part does not.

True. i really tried to give an example, could not think for any better...

I constantly use unstructured thinking with woman. Main problem is, it really never gets structured

hehe, i see what you mean

 

[Mighty Mouse]

I constantly use unstructured thinking with woman. Main problem is, it really never gets structured

What do you mean by this?

 

[BlackOp]

As a professional artist....I think they both come into play. I start with random and chaotic ideas then refine into a specific, stylized ..even linear output. It doesnt have to be perfect...just close to individual sensibilities and tone. Perfect (premeditation) sucks the life out of it. Kubrick (INTJ) comes to mind...he would experiment and keep what worked (to him). The 2001 end tunnel scene was born from "what if" and experimentation. You have to know what your looking for in order to find it.......

 

[Angry Ayrab]

I don't get what you mean by structured vs. unstructured. My thought process when observed from the outside seems really random and even when I explain everythought that went into how I jumped the idea to the next level, people will respond with... oh ok I get it but WTF how the hell do you do that.

Anyway, what I wanted to ask is if pattern recognition falls under structured thought sphere. Why I ask this, is that personally I am a very very very dangerous chess player and the only reason that is because I can always tell by a persons move what they want to do through pattern recognition. Also, I do very well on standardized test because I can always pick up on what they are looking for by observing the patterns through a few practice tests. What does this make my thought process, just curious?

Now mind you, I am not saying I am smarter than others at all, I just find that my Ne helps me out alot and I do rely on it heavily.

 

[mlittrell]

I think most of this can be explained really well with functions. And Angry Ayrab...I know exactly what you are saying and being that Ne is your primary function, you would rely on it heavliy. Remember ENFP's have Te as their tertiary function so if developed enough, ENFPs can wallow in the Te realm a little bit...If you learn to use it to your advantage, which it sounds like you have, it can be quite helpful.

 

[Maabus1999]

Creativity is the epitome of unstructured. It literally means the brain doesn't have to follow certain "rules of engagement". It is free to go where it will to come up with ideas.

I disagree with this completely.

 

[Jack Flak]

I disagree with this completely.

+1 Am I sleeping? Have I slept?

Creating something out of nothing is not unstructured. It is the opposite.

 

[Mighty Mouse]

I don't get what you mean by structured vs. unstructured. My thought process when observed from the outside seems really random and even when I explain everythought that went into how I jumped the idea to the next level, people will respond with... oh ok I get it but WTF how the hell do you do that.

Anyway, what I wanted to ask is if pattern recognition falls under structured thought sphere. Why I ask this, is that personally I am a very very very dangerous chess player and the only reason that is because I can always tell by a persons move what they want to do through pattern recognition. Also, I do very well on standardized test because I can always pick up on what they are looking for by observing the patterns through a few practice tests. What does this make my thought process, just curious?

Now mind you, I am not saying I am smarter than others at all, I just find that my Ne helps me out alot and I do rely on it heavily.

Figuring out patterns is interesting to this thread because it is a perfect example of how our brains are capable of marrying both structured and unstructured thoughts to produce results.

What I mean by this is that in order for you to see a pattern the brain first must think unstructurally. It must be open to what is possible. Then it must take that information and interpret it through structured channels such as chess moves. To recognize a pattern the brain keeps going back and forth until it hits structure it understands which is the pattern. Once you have the pattern you have the structure.

If you want to try something new you will bounce over to the unstructured and back to structured once you figure out how that changes the pattern...

Bottom line: your left and right brain hemispheres have good communication at least as far as chess and standardized tests are concerned.

Does that make sense?

It is actually a good skill to have in many instances.

 

[BlackOp]

Creativity is the epitome of unstructured. It literally means the brain doesn't have to follow certain "rules of engagement". It is free to go where it will to come up with ideas.

The masters had definitive convictions...thats why their bodies of work have a distinct temperament and tone. The biggest secret is they never show you their mistakes....which often is 90% of the work.

I mixed 30 hours of real-time visuals to a DVR...kept less than 12 minutes of content, The end result looks totally insane and chaotic. There was a method to the madness that no one will ever see...its deliberate. No one cares about your mistakes... So it is a balance of both......IMO.