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Random Movie Thoughts Thread

Jaguar

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.

Ali-MacGraw-cover-Harpers-Bazaar-October-1972-1-750x500.jpg


She's now 81. *passes out from shock* Whatever happened to Ali MacGraw's acting career?
 

Totenkindly

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I kinda felt that way about Katherine Ross -- the first place I saw her (don't slap me) was in Donnie Darko in 2001.

Then I realized a few years later that she had actually done a lot of notable stuff in her earlier career, lol.
 

Jaguar

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How can that be? You've never watched Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid?


And The Stepford Wives.

I love this crazy scene:

 
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Brace yourself Tactical Turtleneck.

I find Legend unwatchable with the Jerry Goldsmith soundtrack. I tried. I honestly did. However, I first saw it in the 80’s with the Tangerine Dream score. The TD score is just so wildly different from the formulaic orchestral fantasy soundtrack that it made the movie somewhat alien in feel, which I loved.

Try watching the scene where Darkness (Tim Curry) steps through the mirror and compare both scores and tell me the TD version isn’t perfection.

Edit: I should add that this is said with no intended disrespect aimed at Jerry Goldsmith as I like a lot of his work.
 

Totenkindly

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Despite being an avid movie watcher and with an early love for scifi and fantasy, there's some films from my earlier days that I never really watched, so I've starting picking some of them up.

One was "Willow" which I need to finish after watching half of it about two months back or more. (I'm kind of indifferent to it, honestly. It's just too Disney / goofy, rather than feeling real to me. Like, someone's idea of how a fantasy tale should unfold, down to the cutesy little quirky people. Madmartigan is the most interesting character so far.)

One I started last night and will definitely finish today is "The Neverending Story." Obviously i know the title track really well, it was all over the radio at the time and will show up on 80's compilations albums, but I had no actual idea of the film except for the flying dog creature in the promo materials (who now I have learned is a "dragon" of sorts). Somehow I have dodged spoilers for a few decades as well. I was expecting myself to be bored and it was more of a checklist item for me -- but despite the 80's sensibilities artistically and story-wise of the film, I actually have found it a bit more powerfully done than expected. I mean, it should be cheesier than it is, but the way it is acted and shot, it does set up its own particular tone, and it's a sincere movie that believes in itself. So even the cheesy effects early in the film don't bother me.

I did see the one actor (the guy riding the snail) and I'm like, "Holy, crap, that's the oompa loompa guy in the remake of Chocolate Factory..." and I was correct. And Gerald McRainey was the dad -- I didn't even recognize him, he was so young. But boy that was a terrible "speech/talk" that opens the movie. Reminds me of the connection between the father/son in "Inception." It's obvious he cared about his kid, but he also had no idea how to talk to a boy about loss.

I'm interested in seeing where the film ends up.

The bully motif shows up in a lot of movies. Bullying exists. Did any of us ever get thrown into dumpsters, though? I don't know about that, usually the films take it further than real life or at least provide these extreme clear-cut examples. Usually (in my experience) it's about getting your books knocked on the floor in the fall or shoved up against lockers, or having an audible whisper campaign by your classmates, or items stolen and circulated around so you cannot get a hold of them again, or being excluded from the circle. I don't remember being chased or many physical fights -- although you might get punched hard in the arm in the chaos of the hall or other one-offs. I remember only two actual physical altercations - and one was when I was standing up for someone else being bullied so I became a target, and the other, I stood up to the bully and they quickly chose to leave after a few punches were leveled.

Anyway, my head is trying to figure out where the film is going, and I'm not sure. It's giving definite vibes of "A Monster Calls" though.

 

Doctor Cringelord

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Crazy theory: What if the events of Star Trek V are all in Kirk's head? The mountain climb was real, but at some point he knocked his head, fell unconscious, and his dream starts with him talking to spock on the mountain, then falling. This could explain why certain characters feel a little off in this movie. Scotty is way more bumbling and incompetent than normal, Uhura does a fan dance, Sulu and the rest of the crew are easily brainwashed into following space Jim Jones, etc.

The whole thing is a weird power fantasy in Kirk's head.

There's no way they'd send him in a subpar, dis-repaired and aging vessel to a major diplomatic crisis in the heart of the neutral zone. They'd either lend him another ship or send another ship like the excelsior.

The whole thing with Sybok is probably rooted in Kirk's own subconscious. He went vacationing with his work buddies because they're essentially his only real family, and then in his knocked out state, he has a vision of his de facto brother Spock having a half-brother who comes along to fuck everything up.

The crazy Klingon captain Klaa, who is obsessed with Kirk in a weird fanboy love/hate kind of way, is Kirk's own racism for Klingons playing out in his dream. He hates them for murdering his son and dreams up the most over-the-top klingon captain I think we've seen yet. Kirk pictures them as crazy wild eyed murderous warriors, but he also wants to be respected by them as a warrior in his own right. So Klaa is the ultimate representation of Klingons in his own mind.

The "God" entity, well that's just the sort of shit Kirk dealt with all the time anyway--fake gods like Apollo in that one episode of TOS. So of course he'd dream up some ridiculous fake god alien and have a power fantasy about it being blown the fuck up by a Klingon bird of prey with spock at the motherfucking gun controls.

Plus this could explain a lot of other surreal or weird details, like how the rocketboot scene involves them flying up a turboshaft past decks numbered in the 70s...there's like 20 something decks at most on the enterprise. Or the fact that if Spock caught him falling at the distance and speed he was falling in the beginning, he'd have died even without hitting the ground. Physics, baby

Even better, what if it was all dreamed up while he was in that prison in star trek VI? It might just be Kirk dreaming of a good old adventure with his two buds by his side, wishful thinking while stuck in a shithole prison.
 

Doctor Cringelord

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on the other hand, I really want Sybok to remain a real, canon character

I had hoped they'd find a way to work him into Discovery but not sure how they really could do that at this point, but maybe it will happen in the Pike show if it ever gets made.

There was an episode of Enterprise where they encountered a cult of Vulcans who had embraced both emotion and logic. I though that was a cool premise, and wondered if they eventually were the same group discovered by Sybok. That would be interesting to follow up on since a Pike show would actually be a true prequel to TOS and the Kirk era.

Canonically Pike commanded two 5 year missions before Kirk, and supposedly there was even a Captain April who had a 5 year mission prior to Pike. When you think about it, Kirk was really only in command for a short time. He's already an admiral after his first 5 year mission, then in most of the movies he's still an admiral and technically not the captain of the ship. Then it could have only been a handful of years after he was demoted to captain that he was officially in command. So at most, he was probably the captain for 12 years total. Versus 15 years of April and Pike, PLUS however long that Spock was the Captain. I like the idea of the enterprise being an older ship with some history to it. Practically a dinosaur by the time of the movies, like a wooden frigate in the days the ironclads and steam powered battleships started appearing
 

Doctor Cringelord

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regarding the questions of "where's the enterprise E in Picard and why wasn't Riker using it in the finale?"

I doubt that one would be decommisoned after just 25 or so years of service. generally it seems Starfleet likes to refit and extend ships' lifetime as long as possible. I would wager the enterprise E is STILL in service, and maybe under some other captain, out doing exploration type stuff way on the frontier. I mean, we saw the Enterprise A remain in service even when there were better ships like the excelsior class, and then the excelsiors remained in service well into the dominion war. That has a basis in real world history. Navies have often refitted and continued using ships for decades and in some cases centuries, simply changing their roles as technology progressed and they were no longer suited for front line combat or other purposes.

So the enterprise E is probably no longer the best ship in the fleet, but she is likely still a decent vessel and doing something that fits her capabilities. I mean maybe there's an enterprise F by now, but even then, I imagine the sovereign and galaxy classes are still in service in some parts. They weren't THAT old, and they were likely designed with a long lifespan in mind, being able to be reftitted with better warp drive and weapons as time progressed. Defiant class are probably doing escort work and acting as local planetary defense/patrols. Any remaining excelsiors are likely just doing transport ship stuff in the central regions, away from the frontiers. Intrepids were actually designed for long-term exploration, kind of a budget, compact galaxy class. I like to think they remained in service for a good while.
 

Doctor Cringelord

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I could see Wesley showing up. Maybe he's a Captain by then

- - - Updated - - -

I think Worf is probably serving as a governor or ambassador in the Klingon empire right now. and martok is still chancellor
 

Totenkindly

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Finished The Neverending Story.
It was a case where the journey was better than the final ending.
The girl playing the princess was mesmerizing.
I read yesterday she left acting (after her parents started to get some shitty/questionable job offers for their daughter -- wth is wrong with people???) and went into dancing instead, where she still is active.

I just ordered the book, maybe it'll be more consistent.

Still, it makes one thing about the passive vs active participant role, and how our own internal landscapes are often formed around the personal heroic narrative.

I've just been advised too that Ready Player One is worth reading, even if the movie is one of Spielberg's most uninspired films and sometimes misses its own point.
 

Lexicon

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Morla the turtle is my spirit animal. Sometimes.
 

Doctor Cringelord

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Liam Neeson seems to be taking a Charles Bronson career trajectory.
 

Doctor Cringelord

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I saw a documentary on Susan Oliver (Vina from the original Star Trek pilot). Remarkable woman.
 

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I have been trying to remember the name of a movie I wanted to discuss as I loved the concept and I haven't been able to figure it out until just now! as Vitam on Netflix very thought prevoking
 

Totenkindly

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I have been trying to remember the name of a movie I wanted to discuss as I loved the concept and I haven't been able to figure it out until just now! as Vitam on Netflix very thought prevoking

Do you mean the Ad Vitam tv series on Netflix? Not sure what you're referring to.
 

Totenkindly

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How The Black Cauldron Nearly Killed Disney Animation | Collider

I finally watched this film last year. One of the most boring pieces of film making I'd ever seen. It honestly felt like animators showing off (and not even that well) their animation skills, but without decent dialogue/script and without much of a story. "Hey, let's just have things dance around the screen for 80 minutes." I mean, just ignore the darker subject material; it was basically an animated film without a real story or detailed plot.

Kind of crazy that they optioned a five book series, made the dumb decision to try to "condense" it into a single animated film with shorter run time than conventional films, and now we can see all the politicking and lack of communication and lack of leadership that was occurring behind the scenes. It was definitely the last dying gasp of the Disney "Old school" before its renaissance at the end of the 80's and taking things in different directions.

What they needed to do was take a part of the story arc that was self-contained and focus on that, so they'd actually have "story," and then make sure that the script contributes to plotting while fleshing out characters visually. They lost so much of the story from the book that they had dead space, which they then filled with frolicking stupid characters. In shorter film, every word and action has to contribute to the bigger picture, but this felt like about ten minutes of plot with an hour or more of meaningless fluff.

What I think is interesting is that I know a lot of the names involved (I tracked them separately in their individual careers in the past, out of interest) who basically had their paths modified by this slow-burn disaster at Disney -- either leaving the company to start their own thing, or revitalizing it a decade and more later. So it did serve the purpose, like a fire burning out all the dead wood so new brush could grow. I think I didn't realize that SO many people either tried to change things for this film but were stymied / kicked off the project, or were warning everyone what a cluster it was going to end up.
 

Totenkindly

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Yeah, commenting on the first five minutes of that video...

- the Road to El Dorado is a film I didn't like when it came out. it's still pretty flawed, however it is worth seeing just for the perfect trope of "What happens when a D&D bard and rogue team take their scam, errr, show on the road." Like, literally, in that light, it's so freaking perfect... But otherwise it's kinda average. Maybe better than Brother Bear, but not top tier.

- I missed How to Train Your Dragon in the theater, which is a shame -- I didn't grab the quality of the film compared to the title. Once I saw it (and even rewatching repeatedly), it's one of my favorite animated films of all time. I just feel like the story was perfectly told, and it deals with important themes throughout in this day and age, and even how one can be both humanitarian while possessing great courage and loyalty to one's people -- it's not exclusive. The latter two films of the trilogy are not as good; it feels like they felt like they had to tell more stories without having a clear impetus of the stories they wanted to tell. But they totally nailed the ending of the trilogy, the last 10-15 minutes are perfect.

- I think Despicable Me might be the more polished of the two (compared to Megamind), and has better funny beats around the entire cast. But I totally agree that once the film made it big, they kind of gave up and/or rode on their coattails. I don't know how else to explain it. The first film was really good, and the rest was just a rehash of the visuals and character without really having a compelling story -- it was more a narrative exercise for both films. Don't get me wrong, I love the minions, but they're basically an idea that they milked for three further films (at least).

- Megamind is just a really great story and on an adult level, about figuring out who you are and what you love, being willing to change when you're unhappy, not being fixed in place, and how we've constantly recreating and reinterpreting ourselves. Also, how society can shape what we think of ourselves and even dictate its expectations to us of who we have to be, but we don't. (Note how both arrived like Superman, but their environments were very different and shaped how they grew up and what society thought about them.) I still get shaky every time I remember Roxanne telling him that how much she admired him for his willingness to fight even when he knew he had no chance of winning -- "it's your best quality!" And then he just makes that hell of an entrance. It might be my favorite moment of the film in general. Of course... Will Farrell, Tina Fey... yeesh. David Cross is well-cast too.
 

Totenkindly

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haha, watching the rest of the video currently... yeah, he explains the bit about Metro Man and how the movie refuses to shoehorn him either way, while still making it clear how egotistical he is (I would commented on the baby thing + the walking on water too). I liked that, ultimately. I remember when I first saw it, I was a bit confused because it wasn't playing into the patterns I was used to; and then I really started to love it.

And now about Hal -- they showed a clip from the musical of Hunchback that never got to Broadway (it reached pre-broadway -- the revised musical soundtrack for it by Alan Menken might arguably been the best thing he has done in his career, IMO), the guy playing Frollo there (his voice is pitch-on for Tony Jay's from the film) is Patrick Page with a huge musical/Shakespeare resume and who has been married for years to Paige Davis, who was/is the well-known host of TLC's Trading Spaces. Yes, I am Random Trivia Queen!


EDIT: Decent video -- and he captures the element of story that keeps Megamind current for me that I hadn't quite put into words -- like when he and Roxi have the falling out, it is totally justifiable from both of their perspectives, they both have expectations contributing to it that are realistic and fair, and neither of them is actually being a jerk about things, it's just brutally honest and vulnerable. And then Metro Man offers Megamind a chance to free himself of social expectations in the same way that he freed himself previously, he gives him a chance to be something more than what society has labeled him as. And of course at the end, when Roxi figures out what just happened, she doesn't allow him to pretend to be someone else, she shows her faith in him by letting him know she now accepts him.. and she actively acts as a cultural reference for everyone else to know how to respond to his identity. She's a true ally.

I never saw Shark Tale, but never cared to. I did see Monsters vs Aliens but it was entirely forgettable, I remember nothing about the film nowadays.
 
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