Post Philosophies or Religious ideas that are true, but shouldn't be implemented.

[GarrotTheThief]

LMAO

edit...sorry, that was funny to me. S humor I guess.


edit again...I get what your saying, I really do, but ideas are a figment of our imagination and without us our imagination doesn't exist

edit again again again...I hear the damn The Twilight Zone music in my head now. Damn transference of ideas...your evil damnit...stop throwing ideas at me

edit: That was a lot of damns in one edit

edit one last time: So if an idea is an object it must have a weight, and if it has a weight, it must be able to be measured, if it can be measured it should be able to be seen(if not with a microscope of some sort)....soooooo.....nah, disagree, ideas are nothing more then a figment of our imagination. Unless your one of those people who steals other peoples ideas, therefore ideas don't actually live within you, they live within others. Trying to think this out...I am an S here and must make concrete of this.

I think our divergence in conclusion is a result of the definition of an object. I do not ascribe to the scientific definition of an object which is subjective to that field of study. I take the more universal concept of an object which is a thing that can exert force and change or be changed by that which we define as having mass.

My idea of an object isn't necessarily more abstract than yours, and I can see the S vs. I or T here, which is quite insightful on your behalf.

My idea of an object is just less defined. I simply see that people are moved by ideas - literally, like a tornado moves people, but in a different pattern and with different accelerations and what not...if you fastforward a persons life you will see them moving faster pulled by ideas such as making money, going to church, and then you can actually see that a church, bank, etc...mathmatically is like a magnet...and the architecture of the buidling a product of the idea of belief..

ideas are what shape our reality, the social hierarchy, etc....they are more powerful than life itself, ideas lead to things that can annihilate matter...speaking in terms of degrees of freedom, we are like waves off a rock(ideas) dropped into water(time/space)...the ideas continue to exist and evolve, where as we die and vanish for eternity.

 

[Nicodemus]

I allude to the footprint abstractions leave behind through us to know of their existence. It is like this - if a person steps in the sand and leaves a footprint then we know that whatever put that print there exists.

It is the same with an idea. You and I have ideas, but really, we discover ideas, because ideas are non-temporal objects - if we define objects as things that can act or act upon rather than a person, place, or thing...

IF we are the prints in the sand, then the idea is the shoe or the person.

This is the reason why some believe that archtypes are preset and evolve as we do...this is the argument for a mythological reality which parallels our own and influences it...only if we are speaking from the perspective of power, a myth affects our reality more than any single or group of individuals, albeit, not as powerful as the sun, but more powerful than anything else we can conceive.

Ideas are powerful but we don't feel them this way because they outlive us by 1000's of years.

But even if idea's are not objects, they are something which exists and remains partially affected and partially unaffected by time. The essence of an idea is eternal...it's implementation by a life form at any given moment subjective and subject to distortion.

For example, there is a universal equation for a net, and there are distortions and filters and alterations of the equation depending on the type of net - neural net, galaxy, internet, etc...

but there is one underlying universal equation which is the basis for them all...this equation exists outside of time and is a truer reality than the permutations of time waves...if we define truer as that which does not change.

When a man or woman internalizes this sort of thought process...nothing seems insignficant. Smallest act of kindness is part of an eternal motion of love wave which one becomes a part of. Walls break down, barriers are shattered, and the psyche begins to see that more is possible than once was thought...

That is why, [MENTION=10757]Nicodemus[/MENTION], I gaze at the sun and let it melt my wings, then fall into the water and swallow myself like a great Leviathan, because we are one.

As befits Platonism, you have turned it into a religion. Well done. There is no debating it now.

 

[GarrotTheThief]

As befits Platonism, you have turned it into a religion. Well done. There is no debating it now.

OOOOOOOOh my skittles...I'm so excited (slaps hands together)...I've been waiting for nearly half a year to post this semi-relevant scene from game of thrones...I'm Petyr and your the Eunich...if this metaphor is to be correct....

to be serious though...i do not ascribe to plato or existentialism...I am a post modern thinker and therefore know that both are true and wrong concurrently - reality is a blend of the two.

 

[Passacaglia]

I wouldn't go in so far as to say history has proven it. I think the value of life is a rather subjective thing. It does make for a difficult mess to sort through, but everyone values life differently, and most are valid in their own right for one reason or another. It's just a matter of what their requirements are.

I look it more as live hasn't proven itself to have inherent value. Part of the reason for my stance is I see it as "when you're gone, your gone, and since your gone you can not regret, miss, or have any sort of thought or opinion on the matter, cause you're gone". The end game is where I derive a lot of value from. Since the end game to me is essentially deletion, there isn't much value. I mean, there is, but it's produced, not inherient.

Fair enough; I'm personally confident in saying that life has no inherent value because if it did, I'd expect us to have seen some evidence of it by now.

 

[Beorn]

Fair enough; I'm personally confident in saying that life has no inherent value because if it did, I'd expect us to have seen some evidence of it by now.

So why do you pretend that life has value?

 

[Nicodemus]

OOOOOOOOh my skittles...I'm so excited (slaps hands together)...I've been waiting for nearly half a year to post this semi-relevant scene from game of thrones...I'm Petyr and your the Eunich...if this metaphor is to be correct....

to be serious though...i do not ascribe to plato or existentialism...I am a post modern thinker and therefore know that both are true and wrong concurrently - reality is a blend of the two.

I am unable to see the point the scenes are supposed to make.

Your take on ideas is virtually identical to Plato's. No ascription necessary. Not that it matters, since you obviously have no interest in taking your philosophical musings to a serious level, but your use of the word 'existentialism' seems to differ from its usual meaning as well. But, hey, perhaps that is the case with lots of your words and you are not actually 2,400 years too late.

 

[GarrotTheThief]

I am unable to see the point the scenes are supposed to make.

Your take on ideas is virtually identical to Plato's. No ascription necessary. Not that it matters, since you obviously have no interest in taking your philosophical musings to a serious level, but your use of the word 'existentialism' seems to differ from its usual meaning as well. But, hey, perhaps that is the case with lots of your words and you are not actually 2,400 years too late.

existentialism opines that there is no pre-existing form and that only the persons experience later leads to some idea of form.

Platoism stands on the other side of the continuum. I differ from plato...plato says that forms precede reality, existentialism says reality gives the illusion of form, and I believe there is a third medium which neither touches upon.

IS that serious enough?

for example...this reality is not a veil of some series of forms only, but it is a veil for something else, and in turn that is a veil for this...like the two Michael Escher hands that draw each other...form draws tangible reality and tangible reality draws form...as Foucault says, "the general changes the specific and in turn the specific changes the general" and we know based on quantum physics that sometimes time isn't even of the issue so that a specific from a while ago changes a general from the future and vice versa?

Does it not make sense that reality be fractalized? Using fractilized mathematics we can predict the number of twigs on a tree with seemingly u unrelated variables like the probability distribution of trees based on height and the moisture in the atmosphere...

Why can the part no reflect the whole and vice versa...both existentialism and platoism are opposites in that regard...although there are similarities. I chose neither opposite...I chose the middle path...because...well I am a ninja.

So if two things are changing each other, then there must be a third thing upon which the two dwell...and that is super-space...as we will soon discover...a space that surrounds space that isn't what we call space but what we imagine as something existing in every point and place in time..that is where ideas exist..beyond the tangible reality, but the tangible reality, the one the senses observes, exists beyond that point too..

hence...gods desire to be mortals and mortals desire to be gods...

 

[Evee]

Ideas are not thoughts...hence not actions. Ideas are objects in themselves which exist whether we do or do not....

Thoughts can shape an idea's implementation or discovery....but hence we say, "We invented or we discovered an idea or technology" we don't say...we say we thought of an idea...we don't say...I ideas...we say I had an idea...an idea is an object outside of ourselves and we unconsciously know this if not conscious of it.

....two people can have the same idea, in fact they always do, separated by time and space...they exist outside of us.

But who is interpreting these Ideas? Who is disclosing them? Who is making these ideas "unhidden"?

 

[GarrotTheThief]

But who is interpreting these Ideas? Who is disclosing them? Who is making these ideas "unhidden"?

They come from the mental plane of reality. We exist on all planes...but we seek to return to the divine source - that is the belief of the man writing (but who that mans is?)