MBTI, Authority and Control

[Mole]

I suspect that those with controlling or authoritarian parents are attracted to mbti.

For mbti provides an authority and a way of controlling ourselves.

So mbti is a substitute for our controlling parents.

On the other hand, those with helping parents, parents who help their children achieve their life goals, produce empathic and creative personalities.

And the empathic and creative are not attracted to the control of mbti.

 

[Alea_iacta_est]

Poster with helping parents who was attracted to MBTI, Socionics, and Enneagram here. Creative: yes Empathic: no

I'm heavily independent and don't like people controlling me so maybe that is the case.

 

[Galena]

Not me. Both of my parents were gentle and encouraged me to be less strict with myself, but I was born with it in my veins.

 

[Mole]

Poster with helping parents who was attracted to MBTI, Socionics, and Enneagram here. Creative: yes Empathic: no

I'm heavily independent and don't like people controlling me so maybe that is the case.

Yes, mbti is based on the fear of freedom.

 

[five sounds]

hm, pretty controlling parents. neither of my sisters give a rip about MBTI though.

 

[Mole]

Not me. Both of my parents were gentle and encouraged me to be less strict with myself, but I was born with it in my veins.

Do I understand you to say you were born with mbti or control in your veins?

I have noticed that those who fear freedom give up their freedom to institutions like the girl guides or the boy scouts.

 

[Alea_iacta_est]

Yes, mbti is based on the fear of freedom.

I'm assuming you are referring to the fact that mbti is almost like a caste system waiting for rarer types to take over more common types based on superiority complexes?

I like MBTI for the self-discovery part, and I honestly think it isn't correlated with freedom at all, just because something organizes people into types doesn't mean that it is immediately trying to control people and put them in their place. MBTI only tells you how you probably perceive the world, Socionics only tells you how you probably interact with others, and Enneagram tells you what you probably want in life and/or afraid of in life. I can see the connection you are making and it is a very valid point, but I think that these systems are to help people find themselves in a way.

 

[ndovjtjcaqidthi]

I cannot confirm, Mole. My parents have always been very progressive and not controlling at all. You're implying heavily that most people are here because they want to control instead of simply using MBTI as a tool to help understand themselves and others.

Where's your theory now?

 

[Mole]

I'm assuming you are referring to the fact that mbti is almost like a caste system waiting for rarer types to take over more common types based on superiority complexes?

I like MBTI for the self-discovery part, and I honestly think it isn't correlated with freedom at all, just because something organizes people into types doesn't mean that it is immediately trying to control people and put them in their place. MBTI only tells you how you probably perceive the world, Socionics only tells you how you probably interact with others, and Enneagram tells you what you probably want in life and/or afraid of in life. I can see the connection you are making and it is a very valid point, but I think that these systems are to help people find themselves in a way.

Of course this is the propaganda: these categories are here to help us discover ourselves, to understand others, and form harmonious relationships.

And the first mistake an amateur propagandist makes is to believe their own propaganda.

And this is the mistake we make here.

 

[Galena]

Control. And if you mean I fear freedom, I fell out of girl scouts because it was too social for me to fit into or enjoy at the stage of development I was stuck in. Not a communal bone in my little body. Also, their shitty fashion sense. But seriously, that fear is something I've contemplated. I do have a core fear of what will break loose if I stop inhibiting myself.

But I have zero conscious interest in controlling others. Just nope. Too busy.

 

[Mole]

I do have a core fear of what will break loose if I stop inhibiting myself.

I have the same fear, and I have discovered what I am afaid of: I have a high response to stimulae which others find overwhelming, so I have learnt to inhibit myself, just as you do.

So I am looking for safe and social ways of enjoying my high response.

 

[Alea_iacta_est]

Of course this is the propaganda: these categories are here to help us discover ourselves, to understand others, and form harmonious relationships.

And the first mistake an amateur propagandist makes is to believe their own propaganda.

And this is the mistake we make here.

I'm extremely cynical, but that statement even bothers me a bit; who would use this faulty, obscure, and incomplete system to actually take advantage of others outside of ego-boosting? You act as if everything about a person is contained within a simple string of numbers, wings, and letters and that classifying them will only serve to divide the gap farther. If anything, 16 MBTI, 9 different enneagram numbers with 27 tritypes and countless other stackings and sub-tritypes, 32 SLOAN types, and 16 Socionics Types, which if you only calculate those numbers even without the various subtypes, stackings, and other personality tests (just the multiplication of these 5 numbers) leads to 1,990,656 different combinations. Now if we were to go through ever personality test made in existence and all of their subtypes that number would surely pass the 7 billion people that live on this Earth today.

 

[five sounds]

Of course this is the propaganda: these categories are here to help us discover ourselves, to understand others, and form harmonious relationships.

And the first mistake an amateur propagandist makes is to believe their own propaganda.

And this is the mistake we make here.

who are these propagandists? what do they gain?

sure, people can abuse MBTI, like anything, for manipulation, ego stroking, belittling others, whatever they'd like. whatever they need.
those who want to control others will find a way to do so. those who want to better understand themselves and others will also find a way to do so.

i think the locus of control lies within the individual user, not the system or its designers.

i, for one, do not wish to control anyone. i do wish to control myself, and MBTI has helped me to recognize weaknesses and strengths within myself to help me do so.

 

[Mole]

who would use this faulty, obscure, and incomplete system to actually take advantage of others?

Well, the USA military uses mbti to take advantage of recruits.

And mbti was invented to induct women into the USA war machine in WW II.

And USA business uses mbti to take advantage of employees.

 

[Alea_iacta_est]

Well, the USA military uses mbti to take advantage of recruits.

And mbti was invented to induct women into the USA war machine in WW II.

And USA business uses mbti to take advantage of employees.

You have a very valid point, and I acknowledge the second point, but in modern times, the USA has become a corporation, if it has employees, it can do whatever they want with them because the government pays them. Corporations do it all of the time, but then again, people are hired by them to do what they ask.

Our government is definitely a tyrannical system, but they technically do possess the right to use MBTI to organize their employees who actually volunteered/applied (this excludes military drafts, which I highly doubt will happen again) to do work for the government. When the government starts applying this system to the public, then I will join you in condemning those who use it, until then, it's not harming anything. Welcome to Federal Capitalism. (bitterly says the free-communist)

 

[Mole]

who are these propagandists? what do they gain?

Edward Bernays was an American propagandist. He was one of the most important Americans of the 20th century, yet you never learn about him in class.

Edward Bernays wrote the book called Propaganda and he was employed by the USA Government and top USA companies to teach them the techniques of mass propaganda.

Edward Bernays was enormously successful and gave mass control to the USA Government and USA business and enriched himself.

But of course the myth is that America is the land of the brave and the home of the free, and not the land of mass propaganda - heaven fobid!

 

[Honor]

 

[Mole]

C'mon dear Honor, you have the revolutionary lexicographer, Noah Webster, on one shoulder, and the mass propagandist, Edward Bernays, on the other.

Atlas shrugged and the world collapsed, but if you refrain from shrugging, America will remain safe for the brave and the free.

 

[Alea_iacta_est]

oh, hello honoR, it's good to see yoU on this Nice thread, WHat are your opInions on this LovEly thread. YOU should definitely voiCe AN opinion.
(capitals)

 

[Honor]

C'mon dear Honor, you have the revolutionary lexicographer, Noah Webster, on one shoulder, and the mass propagandist, Edward Bernays, on the other.

Atlas shrugged and the world collapsed, but if you refrain from shrugging, America will remain safe for the brave and the free.

Haha ok ok, I'll tell you what I think. Hold on.