Is MBTI a Cult?

[Salomé]

@Victor: Evidence or STFU.

Someone as gifted as you think you are, should be able to present a coherent argument in support of your claims.

So far your score is 0/10.

Try harder.

 

[ragashree]

So, Victor, here's the deal - every time you feel like mentioning your opinion that MBTI is a cult, post HERE. Okeedoke? It can be your blog of opinion.

LOL I enjoyed this decision. Much better than just putting it in the graveyard. Now people can see it, and Victor has no excuse not to come up with a reasoned argument to substantiate his point of view. I will enjoy seeing such a thing. I would like to believe that Victor is a real person who actually is capable of formulating a coherent opinion on something. Now is your chance to prove it. IF you want to.

What you have done is to compromise my liberty by marginalising me.

No, she gave you a legitimate thread on the main forum, related to the opinions you were expressing. It's not exactly the graveyard. Stop being a whinging Aussie.

 

[Sniffles]

@Victor: Evidence or STFU.

That's pretty much what I would say.

 

[Mole]

*Victor has surrendered two pieces of personal information in this thread.*

That may be a first. In my experience anyway.

This is interesting, isn't it?

In a site explicitly devoted to narcissism, I don't obsessively talk about myself.

But why does a site devoted to narcissism, not seem odd, strange and spare?

And why do I, on this site, seem so odd, strange and spare.

And the answer lies in the narcissistic culture of our environment.

And our culture is the Culture of Personality.

And MBTI lies at the very heart of this culture - and so seems entirely normal.

The culture of narcissism produces the culture of personality which produces MBTI.

Look around you we worship the personalities of Celebrities and obsess about our own personalities.

 

[ragashree]

You're not making a very good case for yourself. Do you posess any other method of argument, other than the repetition of the one-line platitiude?

 

[Synarch]

I would like to believe that Victor is a real person who actually is capable of formulating a coherent opinion on something. Now is your chance to prove it. IF you want to.

His goal is not to formulate a coherent opinion. If you read his other posts, you will see that he tends to join up into various groups or causes (IIRC) and then later repudiates them after an initial romance, which leads inevitably to disillusionment. Now he needs to be rejected, so he becomes more vocal in repudiation. I just want you to say what you really mean.

 

[Eileen]

Honestly, I think that one could totally make a case for Jung's typology being quasi new-age spirituality, and I think that if Victor really wanted to think an argument through for his "culture of personality" thing, he'd have something interesting here.

This is an invitation for him to do so.

 

[Tigerlily]

@Victor: Evidence or STFU.

Someone as gifted as you think you are, should be able to present a coherent argument in support of your claims.

So far your score is 0/10.

Try harder.

Does he have to?

 

[FemMecha]

Where is MBTI functioning as a cult? Here? Some of the defining attributes of a cult include its members separating themselves from society by holding extremist positions and the veneration of its leader as having power to dictate and control all aspects of their life. It has to do with giving over one's will to another person.

There are people who take MBTI as absolute truth even though it is a constructed theory that is not regarded as fact in psychology found in academia. It is considered pop psychology, and some people treat it as scientific fact. The problems that result from an unquestioning approach to it are worth exploring, but to overstate it to the point of being false makes such an argument inaccurate and ineffective. It's like shooting yourself in the foot.

The theory is developed without the use of the scientific method and does not correlate specifically to the study of the brain. The poles that are devised in it seem to have some validity in that some people think linear vs. global, structured vs. non-structured, concrete vs. abstract, etc. It is certainly more relevant than the system based on medieval concept of bodily fluids (choleric, melancholy, sanguine, and phlegmatic). I am not presently aware of a way of deconstructing personality that seems more reasoned than MBTI, but that certainly does not mean it is a flawless or even a correct system.

 

[Synarch]

This is interesting, isn't it?

In a site explicitly devoted to narcissism, I don't obsessively talk about myself.

Correct. You share little about yourself, yet you obsessively attract attention through provocation. Which approach is more narcissistic?

 

[Sniffles]

Yeah really. I myself have noted that MBTI can be seen as part of the general "culture of narcissicism", when used for those kinds of purposes. But I'd argue that the true purpose of MBTI is furthering the cause of geniune self-understanding, not narcissicism.

 

[Mole]

If you want to walk into the Methodist Church and tell them they're a cult it's just as sensible of a move, you know

A cult is characterised by a guru and followers. As distinct from a philosopher who needs no followers because he teaches us to think for ourselves.

Now Jesus Christ was guru of some note who deliberately sought followers. And so was a founder of cult.

Of course if I walked into a Methodist Church and told them they were a cult, I would get exactly the same response as I get here.

Because just as the Methodist Church is a cult, the New Age is a counter-cult.

And it is very plain that the Methodists do see the New Agers as fully fledged competitors.

 

[ragashree]

His goal is not to formulate a coherent opinion. If you read his other posts, you will see that he tends to join up into various groups or causes (IIRC) and then later repudiates them after an initial romance, which leads inevitably to disillusionment. Now he needs to be rejected, so he becomes more vocal in repudiation. I just want you to what you really mean.

That's the impression I get too . The guy does seem to have the beginnings of a sense of humour, and a certain amount of insight, but spoils any possiblity of engaging meaningfully with people by his incredibly defensive outlook. The disjointed lists of platitudes are actually a good way of providing something that is not really an argument, and cannot therefore be argued against. My suspicion is that Victor is so unsure of himself, despite his posturing, that he does not actually want to have to establish a solid position that he would then have to defend, because he lacks the confidence to deal with the consequences of actually losing. But as I said, I would like to see him do so. It would help to convince me that there's actually a person behind the intellectual posturing. He can be entertaining, but if what he's showing of himself is really all there is...

 

[Eileen]

A cult is characterised by a guru and followers. As distinct from a philosopher who needs no followers because he teaches us to think for ourselves.

Now Jesus Christ was guru of some note who deliberately sought followers. And so was a founder of cult.

Of course if I walked into a Methodist Church and told them they were a cult, I would get exactly the same response as I get here.

Because just as the Methodist Church is a cult, the New Age is a counter-cult.

And it is very plain that the Methodists do see the New Agers as fully fledged competitors.

Well, the Methodists probably also use MBTI in pre-ordination processes and such. Most churches do.

 

[miss fortune]

So would you say that any group of people with a common beleif is a cult? I've spoken to cult experts on the topic before and according to them cults generally are much smaller, more secretive about beleifs and rituals and usually have an aspect that's harmful towards its beleivers. I don't beleive that the MBTI or the Methodist Church would fall into these descriptions.

You would receive a very different reception from here at any church in my hometown- you would probably get thrown angrilly into the street or physically harmed by people. Don't mess with a person's God- the MBTI is merely an intellectual toy or hobby There's a difference.

I don't see organized religion sweating the existance of new agers in the least, though I live on the tail end of the Bible Belt. Organized religion has itself to worry about- not new agers.

 

[Synarch]

A cult is characterised by a guru and followers. As distinct from a philosopher who needs no followers because he teaches us to think for ourselves.

Now Jesus Christ was guru of some note who deliberately sought followers. And so was a founder of cult.

Of course if I walked into a Methodist Church and told them they were a cult, I would get exactly the same response as I get here.

Because just as the Methodist Church is a cult, the New Age is a counter-cult.

And it is very plain that the Methodists do see the New Agers as fully fledged competitors.

Do people here really talk about Jung and his infallible wisdom?

 

[SillySapienne]

Correct. You share little about yourself, yet you obsessively attract attention through provocation. Which approach is more narcissistic?

Yeah, Victor, answer the good man's question, please!!!

And... yeah, yeah, I am a cunning, vacuous, temptress fill-in-the-blank, so you can kindly skip divulging that irrelevant and offensive part in your response, k?

 

[Mole]

Well, the Methodists probably also use MBTI in pre-ordination processes and such. Most churches do.

Yes, it is a world wide cult. It is even used at my Catholic University.

I have noticed it is very popular with rebellious nuns who can't quite bring themselves to abandon Catholicism, but smuggle MBTI and the New Age in the back door.

You may be surprised how many New Age workshops are conducted at my Catholic University.

And I can tell you there are no workshops on doubt and dissent. And skeptical inquiry is unknown.

My University has been dumbed down by the New Age and is really no more than a theological college.

It seems people hate learning for the same reason they hate exercise - so we become obese and dumb.

 

[miss fortune]

I first read Lao-Tzu while staying in a convent- the two do not conflict, merely complement.

The world is not made up of oppositions- nothing is black and white. There's no reason to condemn one of the foundations of a site which you frequent. This would be cutting off your foot to make a point. All that would stick in our heads would be the foot removal (which makes me think of Kathy Bates in Misery )

 

[Eileen]

Come on, man. Write us a BlueWing-style essay with arguments and evidence. Don't give us these one-liners with charged language. Give us something real. I think it's possible, and you are not delivering. And that makes this a very lame exercise indeed.