[MBTI General] Intuitards: Do all Sensors suck?

[wildcat]

No, global warming is more a concern for SJs, methinks. Think of those old SJs who bitch about the youth. I'd say that sort of thinking could extend to global warming, the fear that the world is suddenly going to end.

I personally don't think global warming exists. I think it's yet more junk science to keep the public afraid.

An N probably wouldn't even care about global warming because they're big picture oriented -- and the big picture is that we're all gonna die anyway so why bother trying to save the world?



I enjoy eugenics, which is only pseudoscience to appease the PC crowd.

I believe that certain races are inferior and certain races are superior. It's the same principle as certain breeds of dogs being more intelligent than other breeds. But once again, that's dismissed to appease the PC crowd who are just too afraid to handle the sad, sad reality.

Bladderdash.

 

[booyalab]

Maybe ISFJs aren't tyrants but ISTJs are.

I disagree. ISTJs play by the rules too well to get into high positions of power that often. SJs can be annoying but they're usually harmless. NTJs are the ones you have to watch out for.

 

[Roger Mexico]

.OP.

Really? I guess I hate ESFP's, especially female ESFP's, but I don't have issues with the others, unless we're talking extremely anti-intuitive people that have no interest in conceptual thinking and do things like vote for George W. Bush.

My fantasy alter-ego is an ISTP. The smarter ones I know are people I have a deep respect for. They're ass-kickers who don't tolerate bullshit, and generally the most reliable and trustworthy people I know. Our dominant Ti quickly establishes common ground for my Ne to exchange information with their Se. What the hell could you have against someone who knows physical, practical reality? Maybe not ideal partners for philosophical discussion, but that's what INTJ's are for.

The S/N gap has never been a problem for me. Honestly, compared to ENTP's or INFP's, my issues with ST's are tiny and trivial.

 

[CzeCze]

Really? I guess I hate ESFP's, especially female ESFP's,

Hahahaha - DANG, that is harsh!

Why the antipathy against female ESFPs?

 

[Magic Poriferan]

I generally try not to be prejudicial, but I think the type I'm the least tolerant of is the ESTP.
Maybe my mind will be changed someday, but right now I just expect them to aggrivate me.

 

[Spartan]

Most people here are iNtuitives and don't seem to think much of Sensors and I thought that was a bit harsh. Today it occured to me that most of the S types do acutally suck.

There are 4 SJs (tyrants ) and 2 ESxPs (loud ) not to mention the overlap of ESxJs .

So that's 6 out of 8 Sensors with the potential to be very annoying people. That Leaves the ISxPs, who I don't think would be exceptionally annoying since the ISTPs would be off by themselves tinkering and the ISFPs would be alone doing creative ISFP things. None of this is to say that Ns are the pinnacle of human evolution or anything. I shouldn't have to remind you that the ENTJ Evil Overlord is in your camp.

----------

<--- I recant. I withdraw my withdrawal.

The only thing I want to say is that I have been able to succesfully get along with all types except one. I even have a great ENTP friend, my polar opposite. But I cannot stand the ENTJ. My father is one. He is very loving, smart, and likes to teach. However, he is very critical, rudely sarcastic, manipulative, and a perfectionist who criticizes others. I am barely able to appreciate his hard work because he expects me to be able to do the exact same thing in the exact same way he did.

 

[Roger Mexico]

Hahahaha - DANG, that is harsh!

Why the antipathy against female ESFPs?

We're almost complete opposites, for one thing. (except the P thing, which doesn't do much to ingratiate me)

They just kind of annoy me. They're the "ask a stupid question..." people. They're the chicks that have gotten used to men carrying things for them and don't see why they shouldn't. They're the girl on the bus talking at full volume into her cell phone--"Oh, my, GAWD! No, she, did, NOT!" The ones who play Michael Jackson songs on the jukebox. In fact, I suspect they're responsible for 90% of the shitty music playing at every bar, pool hall, and house party I've ever been to--Me: "God this sucks. Why would anyone listen to this?" ESFP girls: "Ooh, put on Thriller! I love that song! Let's dance!" The ones that flirt with me for five seconds then walk away as soon as they see a guy who looks like he has more money/connections/whatever.

I tend to like ENFP women, romantically and otherwise--we seem to have some kind of connection on a very deep level that belies the chirpy, slutty persona they present and draws me to try to penetrate that exterior (pun only intended after the fact). ESFP chicks have the same chirpy, slutty demeanor, but in their case it's masking this cold, reptilian thought process that thinks of nothing but its own gratification.

Groupies, beer sluts, gold diggers, shameless social climbers. Come on, you have to know what I mean.

 

[CzeCze]

We're almost complete opposites, for one thing. (except the P thing, which doesn't do much to ingratiate me)

They just kind of annoy me. They're the "ask a stupid question..." people. They're the chicks that have gotten used to men carrying things for them and don't see why they shouldn't. They're the girl on the bus talking at full volume into her cell phone--"Oh, my, GAWD! No, she, did, NOT!" The ones who play Michael Jackson songs on the jukebox. In fact, I suspect they're responsible for 90% of the shitty music playing at every bar, pool hall, and house party I've ever been to--Me: "God this sucks. Why would anyone listen to this?" ESFP girls: "Ooh, put on Thriller! I love that song! Let's dance!" The ones that flirt with me for five seconds then walk away as soon as they see a guy who looks like he has more money/connections/whatever.

...ENFP women...belies the chirpy, slutty persona they present and draws me to try to penetrate that exterior (pun only intended after the fact). ESFP chicks have the same chirpy, slutty demeanor, but in their case it's masking this cold, reptilian thought process that thinks of nothing but its own gratification.

Groupies, beer sluts, gold diggers, shameless social climbers. Come on, you have to know what I mean.

....



HAHHHAHAH.

Followed closely by --

Wth?

OMG, I will have to reply materially to this later, unless someone else beats me to it.

Roger, are you having a bad day today?

 

[Roger Mexico]

....



HAHHHAHAH.

Followed closely by --

Wth?

OMG, I will have to reply materially to this later, unless someone else beats me to it.

Roger, are you having a bad day today?

Been a while since I had a really good day, but actually I'm in a relatively good mood.

Common misperception: people think I'm angry when I'm happy and they think I'm happy when I'm angry. I don't get it, can't explain it, beyond saying that my sense of humor tends toward the sardonic.

You asked for more information, so I gave it to you.

But check the INTPc thread about ESFP's for more where that came from.

Like I said, come on. You know what I mean.

 

[quietgirl]

I understand where the martyr/tyrant concept for [male] ISTJs came from, at least in regards to the ones I have had as friends and/or acquaintances.


I cannot describe female ISTJs too well because I have only really known one in real life, and known OF another... and I think the female brain and socialization helps them to better mediate between the internal and external worlds and communicate better. The men tend to think more just in terms of power ("Do I assert myself, or do I just sit passively and hold my tongue?"), whereas the women are more willing to not internalize the entire thing.



.

My aunt is more of the "martyr" ISTJ. She fulfills her duty to the family & takes on the martyr role. She is the woman who will fix you a 5 course meal at midnight if you show up & remotely complain of hunger. She will sacrifice her own needs for the good of the family. She also worries about the family a lot. Let me check my call log to see just how many times she's called in the past hour...

My father is more of the "tyrant" ISTJ. He has a rigid view of what everyone's role should be in the family and will criticize you for your "foolishness" if you do not obey that role. He also has the habit of worrying and when we used to still speak, he would call me at least 4 times a day.

 

[quietgirl]

No, global warming is more a concern for SJs, methinks. Think of those old SJs who bitch about the youth. I'd say that sort of thinking could extend to global warming, the fear that the world is suddenly going to end.

I personally don't think global warming exists. I think it's yet more junk science to keep the public afraid.

An N probably wouldn't even care about global warming because they're big picture oriented -- and the big picture is that we're all gonna die anyway so why bother trying to save the world?

.

Yea? I would think global warming was more of an NF's bag. I mean, think of the animals & the people who would be harmed if the earth overheated?
(I'm kidding! I'm an INFJ who's actually studied global warming! )

I think maybe an NT would agree with your view of what an N would think of global warming, but the whole "saving the world" shtick is kind of in line with an NF's need for a purpose.

 

[quietgirl]

As for the original topic...

First of all, am I the only one who got the humor in the original post? I thought it was hilarious. We DO have the ENTJ...

I, personally, am a fan of sensors. Particularly SP's - even the ESFPs. If it weren't for them, I'd never have any fun. I tend to date SP's (ISTP currently!), hang out with SP's, and have an SP mom. My childhood was a bunch of games, pretending we all lived in a musical (seriously - mom's way of getting us to do chores), and random days trips to everywhere. My social life would've probably been much less exciting had it not been for my close ESFP friends... and lord knows my love life would be lacking if I dated someone who DIDN'T think setting up a snowboard park in the backyard was a great idea! (I'm in for a long winter...)

As for the SJ's... I can complain all I want, but there's nothing like pulling up to my ISTJ's aunt's house and getting taken care of the entire time I'm there....

 

[CzeCze]

But check the INTPc thread about ESFP's for more where that came from.
Like I said, come on. You know what I mean.

Hmm...no I actually don't. And I'll take your word for it about the INTPc thread (any more than 1 online membership on personality type, and my dork meter would expire, and well, we just can't have that now, can we?)

Let me try to word my thoughts carefully:

I tend to like ENFP women, romantically and otherwise--we seem to have some kind of connection on a very deep level that belies the chirpy, slutty persona they present and draws me to try to penetrate that exterior (pun only intended after the fact).

Oh dear lord, I am so glad to be a lesbo when I hear guys talk like this. This is not a diss to you personally, but the fact that this is how guys actually think. I'm not sure how I am not supposed to take exception to the fact you refer to me via my type as having a 'chirpy, slutty persona'. I actually think I have a very bubbly as opposed to chirpy slutty persona, thank you.

In fact, I suspect they're responsible for 90% of the shitty music playing at every bar, pool hall, and house party I've ever been to--Me: "God this sucks. Why would anyone listen to this?" ESFP girls: "Ooh, put on Thriller! I love that song! Let's dance!"

I'm not sure what I'm more insulted by, the fact you called me slutty or the way you are bashing my taste in music. I loooooove me some Thriller.

---------------------------------------------------

They're the "ask a stupid question..." people.

In fact, I suspect they're responsible for 90% of the shitty music playing at every bar, pool hall, and house party I've ever been to--

ESFP chicks have the same chirpy, slutty demeanor, but in their case it's masking this cold, reptilian thought process that thinks of nothing but its own gratification.

Groupies, beer sluts, gold diggers, shameless social climbers. Come on, you have to know what I mean.

Alright, in all seriousness, those are 4 sweepingly deragotory and stereotypical and may I say a smidgen sexist descriptions you just gave of ESFP women. There is an obvious negative bias not bordering, but solidly in the realm of antipathy here.

Do I know what stereotypes you speak of? Sure, because I see them as one-dimensional characters in movies and tv shows and music videos all the time. Do I agree with your assessment of the ESFP female type? That's not the issue here.

See, I don't have a problem discussing shortcomings or blind spots of type, or even friendly banter, but I do have a problem with straight up type bashing. And since there are no other ESFP people, let alone ESFP women on this forum, let alone this specific thread, I'll just point that out.

I also don't get how people who decry other people bashing their type with stereotypes (i.e. 'mean/cold/unfeeling NT') can turn around and bash another type with stereotypes.

And now, I will stop derailing this thread unless you or other people want to continue the conversation.

But, I hope I made myself clear.

 

[Roger Mexico]

Hmm...no I actually don't. And I'll take your word for it about the INTPc thread (any more than 1 online membership on personality type, and my dork meter would expire, and well, we just can't have that now, can we?)

Let me try to word my thoughts carefully:



Oh dear lord, I am so glad to be a lesbo when I hear guys talk like this. This is not a diss to you personally, but the fact that this is how guys actually think. I'm not sure how I am not supposed to take exception to the fact you refer to me via my type as having a 'chirpy, slutty persona'. I actually think I have a very bubbly as opposed to chirpy slutty persona, thank you.



I'm not sure what I'm more insulted by, the fact you called me slutty or the way you are bashing my taste in music. I loooooove me some Thriller.

---------------------------------------------------



Alright, in all seriousness, those are 4 sweepingly deragotory and stereotypical and may I say a smidgen sexist descriptions you just gave of ESFP women. There is an obvious negative bias not bordering, but solidly in the realm of antipathy here.

Do I know what stereotypes you speak of? Sure, because I see them as one-dimensional characters in movies and tv shows and music videos all the time. Do I agree with your assessment of the ESFP female type? That's not the issue here.

See, I don't have a problem discussing shortcomings or blind spots of type, or even friendly banter, but I do have a problem with straight up type bashing. And since there are no other ESFP people, let alone ESFP women on this forum, let alone this specific thread, I'll just point that out.

I also don't get how people who decry other people bashing their type with stereotypes (i.e. 'mean/cold/unfeeling NT') can turn around and bash another type with stereotypes.

And now, I will stop derailing this thread unless you or other people want to continue the conversation.

But, I hope I made myself clear.

Um, OK, I didn't callyou anything. I don't even know you. I'm not even anything close to an expert on this MBTI stuff, so I'm still kind of skeptical about how well I can "type" people. I know exactly one person who's told me what type he is; the rest is a combination of conjecture and sarcasm. I can't tell you where one starts and the other begins, as I don't really know myself, but I think you're taking this a bit too seriously. Not to mention personally. If you posted on here tomorrow identifying yourself as an ISTJ, I wouldn't feel qualified to tell you you were wrong.

Not to mention that this whole business inherently lends itself to stereotyping. "Are you not entertained? Is this not why you are here?"

Relax.

Grain of salt.

I meant "persona" in the sense of what a person projects to others. I'm actually a very compassionate person who's spent a lot of my life engaged in social-justice activism, but you'd have to know me personally to pick up on that. "Cruel" and "cold" and perhaps even "arrogant" would not be inaccurate descriptors of the "person I pretend to be" (persona) around those I don't know well. If you fall down, I'll help you back up, but I'm far more likely to laugh at you than try to soothe your wounded pride. I didn't know that this was because I'm an INTP until a few weeks ago. It does, however, make sense.

Likewise, I've interacted with a reasonably wide variety of people in my life, and I'd say most of us have aspects of our personality that we don't project and/or work to conceal through the personae we adopt. I didn't say ENFP's in general are slutty, much less imply that it's a universal characteristic of your personality type. People I know who exhibit behaviors that would seem to mark them as ENFP's do tend to project a persona that's, well, more welcoming of physical and emotional attention from a wider variety of people than I am. I'm not addressing anyone's actual sexual proclivities; I'm just saying that the (apparent) ENFP's I know seem to be flirting just a little with everyone they meet. Just as I imagine I seem to be suspicious or contemptuous of everyone I meet.

So, I'm not saying ENFP's are slutty, or chirpy for that matter. And neither are all ESFP women gold-digging beer sluts. What I was getting at, actually, was precisely the opposite--similar outward behavior simultaneously reflecting and concealing very different inward thought processes. ESFP thinking, I believe, tends toward the ephemeral--"I know what I want, and I want it now." Women who appear to me to be ESFP's project a persona that's warm and friendly and welcoming as long as the other person is providing something desired or valued, and cold and dismissive if/when this ceases to be the case. That kind of behavior irritates me, so, yes, there's a little bit of antipathy toward what I would now say are SFP-like personality traits. Behavioral manifestations of these traits will be experienced differently by me, as a heterosexual male, depending on gender. The undercurrents beneath the surface are as off-putting as the outward behavior. With ENFP's it's a different story--there's a connection there with
the inquisitive "inner child" that underlies the party-girl persona.

Ehh, I'm tired, so I'm just going to stop writing. But the INTPc thread was full of stories from men about being screwed over in various ways by ESFP women. The ephemeral sense of what is or would be enjoyable can override considerations like appropriate ways to treat other people. ENFP's, I think, are simply unaware of it when it happens; I can more easily see an ESFP just not caring.

Again, grain of salt. Just my personal observations, and the thread subject was NTs' problems with SP's.

Although Michael Jackson does make exactly the kind of music I can't stand. Pop music in general is like fingernails on a chalkboard to me.

 

[CzeCze]

"Are you not entertained? Is this not why you are here?"

I meant "persona" in the sense of what a person projects to others.

Again, grain of salt. Just my personal observations, and the thread subject was NTs' problems with SP's.

Although Michael Jackson does make exactly the kind of music I can't stand. Pop music in general is like fingernails on a chalkboard to me.

I see...so personality vs. personae...hmm...I give you 'A' for effort. Do I agree?

Am I entertained? Well this forum is infinitely more appealing to me then the eternal battle of me vs. blank screen. The blank screen kicks my ass everytime. And you can only imagine the boxes of pens I have ravaged, carelessly and callously spilling their lifesblood in my insatiable quest for 'story'.

And I have to admit, whenever I read "slutty...women" anywhere online, I'm there!

The original thread was about wha?? Seriously, I don't really keep track of such inconsequential things, it reminds me of doing parliamentary debate. And those cats are so square.

It's a shame you don't like MJ though. Do you not like to dance dance for the revolution??? What do you dance to? Or do you not like to dance?

I have no beef (or vegan tempeh) with you. For now.

Muahahahahaa.



And now I'm going to bed.

:hi:

(Everyone, you may continue with your thread.)

--> me walking away gracefully, clearing the board for others to share and hash out their views

 

[Roger Mexico]

The original thread was about wha?? Seriously, I don't really keep track of such inconsequential things, it reminds me of doing parliamentary debate. And those cats are so square.

Hey now, I did Lincoln-Douglas, but watch it.

It's a shame you don't like MJ though. Do you not like to dance dance for the revolution??? What do you dance to? Or do you not like to dance?

OK, I'm a proud member of a Facebook group titled "When people say DDR, I assume they're talking about East Germany."

Do I dance? Yes, and I'm reasonably good at it. Dance for me is a way to use bodily movement to further explore the complexity of the rhythms in the music I like to listen to (INT thing, maybe you don't understand). Reggae and ska music gets me moving, as does head-banger death metal. I'll pretty much be anywhere there's a circle pit. Some hip-hop, but only the more advanced, interesting stuff. I'm not into "ass-shaking."

"Dance" is not a style of music. People that like poppy 3-chord music with 4/4 timing because they "can dance to it" are shallow and have poor taste.