[INTJ] INTJ and teaching

[Grace]

Hi!

I am a teacher and HATE IT. Just wondering if there are any other INTJ teachers out there?

What I don't like about it:

When I taught 6th grade there was so much drama and "bullying" and I couldn't deal or relate. A girl is crying in the bathroom and I just want to roll my eyes. I never went through that drama phase.

It's like your extroverting (what would be the actual word for this?) and putting on a performance all day.

I am teaching 1st grade now and it's probably the worst of all grades I've taught. They are so needy. My version of hell is being surrounded by 1st graders who all want me in some way and are tugging on my elbows and trying to each get my attention.

It's difficult for me to focus on multiple things at once. So, for example, if I'm working with a small group, I hate that I also have to be focusing on what's going on with the other students in the class who are working independently. I just want to concentrate on my group and give them my all instead of having to split my attention.

Teaching requires your brain to always be on and observing what's going on around you. You can't take a second to just think or analyze something.

Needless to say, I am leaving teaching after this year.

I'm finishing my masters this year and have an internship in the career center at my university. I think working with college students on practical issues, like building a resume, setting up an internship, etc. will be a better fit for me.

If you aren't a teacher, what jobs have you found that you loved and excelled in?

 

[INTJMom]

Well, I'm glad your story has a happy ending!

I have read that INTJs, if they teach, prefer teaching older students, like a college professor,
so it sounds like you're on the right track with working with college students.

Your experience in 1st grade reminds me of my experience as a stay-at-home mom,
and I concur that it is EXHAUSTING!

My choice of work is based on my limited skill-set, but I have always had an aptitude for business and good customer service. I have no college education. I only type 20 wpm. When I entered the work force 7 years ago, I had been a Microsoft Office nerd for years, so I very familiar with Word and Excel, had some training in Access and could find my way around in PowerPoint. I've had even more training since then.

I have been the personal assistant to a curator for a small museum. We did a lot of research, which I loved, I learned to develop photographs from glass plates, we wrote a newsletter. Some of what we did was investigative, a bit like being a detective. I really loved that job, but it was only temporary.

I was an Office Assistant to a woman who owned a small business. She trained me for 6 weeks and then went to FL for 10 weeks in the winter, leaving me to hold down the fort. I was very proud of the quality of my work that I did for her. A lot of it was opening mail, answering email, taking care of incoming checks. I liked that job too. I was the only person in the office, so I was by myself, which I enjoyed.

Currently, I am a clerk. I answer email, send out email, scan, upload and download documents, maintain Excel and Access databases, use organization and time-management skills. I pride myself in the fact that I have never missed a deadline in 7 years. I proofread and edit documents; write technical how-to documents. I provide excellent customer service. Whenever someone contacts me with a request, I do my utmost to fulfill their request quickly and with quality. I often get very positive feedback from the people I have helped. I do other stuff, too.

I enjoy my work because I enjoy the challenge of meeting a deadline. I like using my organizational skills to keep track of all my tasks. I like helping people and receiving positive feedback. I work in a big building with about 600 people, but my group is about 15 people. My cubicle is in a corner, so I have some much-desired privacy.

If I didn't have this job, I wouldn't be able to afford to keep my house and live alone, so I don't allow myself the luxury of hating my job or dwelling on the things I dislike about it. Overall, it suits me very well and I love most of what I do. Every now and then I am assigned a task I don't like. Usually they are the ones that seem like an overwhelming mountain or like it will "take forever" but some of my SJ co-workers have shown me that if you just keep whittling away at it, eventually you will finish, so I try to learn from them in places where I am not naturally gifted.

 

[AntonKucinski]

Hi!

I am a teacher and HATE IT. Just wondering if there are any other INTJ teachers out there?

What I don't like about it:

When I taught 6th grade there was so much drama and "bullying" and I couldn't deal or relate. A girl is crying in the bathroom and I just want to roll my eyes. I never went through that drama phase.

I am teaching 1st grade now and it's probably the worst of all grades I've taught.

Hi! I taught K-12 for 12 years. 6-8th grades (middle school) are the worst, IMO. They have the hormones of teenagers with the mental processes of elementary school children. K-3rd grade you have to be a combination of a shepherd and a drill sergeant to get anything done. High school is immeasurably easier.

What I found much harder than dealing with the students was dealing with administrators and their arcane and inane policies/procedures that changed far too often for me to keep track of, much less follow. There was also a major shift in the whole approach to teaching. When I started, non-pedagogical paperwork was at most 10% of my workload. When I left it was about 40%. To be quite blunt, an amazingly high percentage of administrators seemed to have cognitive issues of one type or another. Most were unable to answer even the most basic questions I might ask, regardless of topic.

I'm now interpreting in a college and am much happier.

To answer your question: One thing that helped me was figuring out what made me nuts in a classroom. For me it was noise. The quieter it was, the better able I was to monitor what was going on. Yes, you have to be 'extroverting' or putting on a show. I also made no attempt to be a regular teacher. I would roll my eyes when the situation warranted it. When a student came in late and claimed to have been meeting with a teacher who was not in the building, I'd send him out and tell him he needed to think up a better lie. I'd then put my lesson on hold and have my class figure out how it was I knew the late student was lying. I trusted my students until they gave me reason not to. I deliberately left money in my desk and it never got stolen; lol, students would literally push the dollar bills aside in their search for pens. i also learned how to assert my authority in the classroom. If I tried to be tough or strict, students would giggle at me and ignore me. However, if I acted like I was their uncle or older cousin I had little problem getting compliance. i also built up 'credit' by never lying to them, always admitting when I was wrong, and answering their questions honestly. It paid off because twice I was able to de-escalate a violent situation by following up a request with, "Please? For me?"

All of this, however, took me 5-6 years to learn and apply.

Ask me any question you like

 

[Coriolis]

Hi!

I am a teacher and HATE IT. Just wondering if there are any other INTJ teachers out there?

What I don't like about it:

When I taught 6th grade there was so much drama and "bullying" and I couldn't deal or relate. A girl is crying in the bathroom and I just want to roll my eyes. I never went through that drama phase.

It's like your extroverting (what would be the actual word for this?) and putting on a performance all day.

I am teaching 1st grade now and it's probably the worst of all grades I've taught. They are so needy. My version of hell is being surrounded by 1st graders who all want me in some way and are tugging on my elbows and trying to each get my attention.

It's difficult for me to focus on multiple things at once. So, for example, if I'm working with a small group, I hate that I also have to be focusing on what's going on with the other students in the class who are working independently. I just want to concentrate on my group and give them my all instead of having to split my attention.

Teaching requires your brain to always be on and observing what's going on around you. You can't take a second to just think or analyze something.

Needless to say, I am leaving teaching after this year.

I'm finishing my masters this year and have an internship in the career center at my university. I think working with college students on practical issues, like building a resume, setting up an internship, etc. will be a better fit for me.

If you aren't a teacher, what jobs have you found that you loved and excelled in?

I have taught in two types of situations, and generally enjoyed it. Neither is like your job with elementary kids.

1. I do STEM educational outreach volunteering. I visit classrooms, usually grades 3-8, and do hands on science activities with them. I have it easy. I am there one time, maybe twice. I bring cool stuff with me, some of which the kids can keep. It is different from the daily routine. I usually have their attention and cooperation/participation readily. I enjoy the interaction: asking them questions, responding to their interest, getting them to figure out their own questions, getting them to see everyday things differently. It takes alot of energy and I am wiped out when finished, especially if I have to do 3 groups in one day. I would NEVER want to do this all day, every day.

2. I occasionally teach college classes, intro physics at a local university. It is sad sometimes how not much beyond elementary school these students can be, at least in attention span, work habits, and expectation of entertainment. Still, they all want to be there and are basically good kids. The subject can be a challenge and I enjoy speaking one on one with them, to help them figure out how to understand it in their own way. Unfortunately very few come to office hours to try to do this.

For my "day job", I am an experimental physicist. I like it as a career very much, though my present position has become intolerable due to excess administrivia and regulation. I am trying to move to a university full-time.

 

[Despotic Ocelot]

I am a teacher and HATE IT.

LOL!!!

Well this was a sentence I'd never thought I'd read lol. Since, well... it's not like teaching is something a person just 'tries out' suddenly one day because they need a job. They have to, like, go to school for it... there's training, the person is predisposed to liking it already, etc... so for a person to get through all of those hurdles, and then be like "I'm a teacher and HATE IT" is just... hilarious lol.

A girl is crying in the bathroom and I just want to roll my eyes.

Awwww!!! Oh my god lol. I just got the feeling someone gets when they see an animal video of a kitten or puppy or something, and a person is being really mean to them.

I am teaching 1st grade now and it's probably the worst of all grades I've taught. They are so needy. My version of hell is being surrounded by 1st graders who all want me in some way and are tugging on my elbows and trying to each get my attention.

This is simultaneously the funniest fucking thing I've ever read, and the most disappointing thing I've ever read lol. But being of the comedy world, the funny of it is slightly standing out more... mostly due to how freaking unexpected and unorthodox this whole situation is lololol. This is literally the basis for a good sitcom, or a movie... like Kindergarden Cop lol.

(Arnold's head spinning around) "Everyone... shut..."

"SHUT UUUUUUUP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Honestly though, this is kind of sad too. Sad enough to probably knock the INTJ down a couple of pegs in my estimation (checks)

Sigh, nope, still intellectually delicious, walking talking orgasm on two legs.​

 

[Despotic Ocelot]

I am teaching 1st grade now and it's probably the worst of all grades I've taught. They are so needy. My version of hell is being surrounded by 1st graders who all want me in some way and are tugging on my elbows and trying to each get my attention.

Well of course they're needy. They're practically brand new people who were just thrust into this world!! They're still getting acquainted with reality, their worlds are their understanding of life is completely different, and they just learned to use English enough to be able to hold some kind of conversation with you!!

Man, this whole thing is making me rethink this. Before, I had no interest in teaching, but I wasn't turned off by it... I just had no feeling toward it either way, but I knew it was something that was so specialized and difficult that only the proper people could even attempt to undertake it. Somewhat akin to astronauts, heart surgeons, and cowboys.

But now, after reading this, I'm like... well shit, I know all the things you've expressed not knowing, things about human interactions and tendencies that I took for granted as just universal truths. If a 'proper teacher' didn't know them, then hell... surely I would make at least a somewhat satisfactory teacher!! lol. Their mind is in the most formative stage of their whole lives... of course they're 'needy' lol. If anything, this can be summed up as necessitating the kind of relationship you'd have with your own children; they are your children one step removed from their own parents.

Stuff that seems insignificant or like no big deal at the time, fast forward 20 years... it actually is a big a deal most of the time. It's so common, and people so easily forget this. Like the girl you said you saw crying in the bathroom over some 'drama' that happened, and you rolled your eyes at her. This stuff is critical and important. 20 years later an incident like that is likely to stand out like a sore thumb to the person. Where it's like "and it was at this early age that I realized... the world was a dark, cold, empty place, and no one really gives a shit about you"

People would be amazed at the 'little things' that are big deals to the person. Everyone has a handful of incidents that they could relay that had a big affect on them, that to you, would seem inconsequential. Why... because you only saw that part. You're not them, and aren't privy to everything that happens to them. So you have the tendency to think "what's one shitty event/incident, it's only one". You're not privy to the aggregation and accumulation.

Now I can see you saying "but the world is hard, and we shouldn't make kids think it isn't". I agree. But that's not what I'm saying.

What is hard? Unfair rules and social norms in life; random tragedies like a deadly sickness or natural disaster; liars and gossip making life problems; all things that make life hard, which people should know about and prepare for, not shielded from.

But one time loooong ago when you were six... and while crying over the group making you an outcast in kindergarden, your eye caught the teacher rolling her eyes at you... later, her annoyed dismissive attitude came through loud and clear underneath her hastily put-together veil, when she reprimanded you (for a separate, unrelated issue); and in your mind, you connected that to the earlier eyeroll as the the reason she sounded that way (even though it may not have been)...

Why does this stand out 20 years later to that person?

Because the teacher was supposed to be on my side. Yea, the 'world' is hard... but the teacher is on my team. Yet at a time of deep hurt for me, she was so annoyed by my existence that she rolled her eyes at me. My head was buried in my arms, she didn't know I could see her, but I saw her. Why would someone do that? Unless I don't mean a thing to anyone. I mean, at worst you'd do a 'mental' eyeroll... she did it physically. And it wasn't even inconveniencing her, I was in the bathroom. It was my personal issue. Why would you do that... unless I don't mean anything. My mere existence is a bother... and if I dare feel hurt by anything, and show that hurt, then I'm really a bother because it'll make people notice me when they'd rather never notice me. Even if I'm hidden in the bathroom, it'll bother them... god I, specifically me, must really be meaningless.

I mean (x, y, and z in the world) happened, but the world is hard, it's to be expected... but if someone on my team showed such dismissiveness, and I wasn't even in their way... the reason must be because I don't mean anything. That explains (connects dots from other bad incidents) I knew there was a reason this thing was gnawing at me in the back of my head. It's because it was at this time... that I noticed the world was a dark, cold, empty place, and no one really gives a shit about you. Others, sure, but not me... I'm especially meaningless.​

This is the kind of thinking someone at that age will do with an incident like that. In a way, it's priming...

Priming (psychology) - Wikipedia

... them to rationalize things that way, when it might not actually be the correct/objective way to comprehend an incident. Like I said earlier... they are brand new people. They just came into the world. They have no foundation or frame of reference for things... you are the foundation layer, you are the frame of reference. Something that seemingly inexplicable (the annoyed eyeroll when they're not in your way) has to be processed some way, and at an age like that... that is how it will be processed. And then, should their personal life not be the best... then the incident with the teacher is just priming them to see reality in the way I put forward as just... objective reality.

That's how that will happen; that's why teachers are like second parents, guiding these brand new people through the world.

Yes, you'll prepare them for dealing with a hard world. But what necessary to make a sturdy foundation, is for them to not have a warped view of objective reality. Which is what they will have when they are treated that way at an age like that, by people on their team.