Eric B
ⒺⓉⒷ
- Joined
- Mar 29, 2008
- Messages
- 3,621
- MBTI Type
- INTP
- Enneagram
- 548
- Instinctual Variant
- sp/sx
That was Lenore's way of putting it [he asked, Jag!
], and from the contexts, it would mean the behaviors or skills we have come to associate with the functions. The things we actually "use". So for Se; it would be current sensory input. Everyone uses this every minute of every day, yet we distinguish SP types as particular "Se users". What really is the difference between them and evey other type? With them, Se denotes a particular perspective where current senses are their preferred input method. For others, it is what is called "undifferentiated" as far as being such a specific perspective.
So then "experiencing the current senses" then, which often is used as the definition of "Se", can be thought of as a product of the function, as distinct from a differentiated Se perspective. All people use the product; only for some is it apart of a preferred perspective that defines their type.
Otherwise, we run on all the problems many confused about type have, where they thnk they "use" a function too much to be a certain type. Or we would wonder how NP's and SJ's could see, hear, smell, etc. or try to force those activities into an archetypal role (demon, opposing, etc).
It would be these "products" we can become more aware of, and the archetype/complex perspective that lies in the shadow.
I'm not sure that when Beebe says the 7th function develops right behind the tertiary, whether he meant the specific Trickster archetype, or just the undifferentiated function the Trickster sometimes encases. On the other hand, Lenore says the Trickster manifests only in very special cases. So I'm taking sort of a middle view.
I can give my own example: When I internalize the principles of how something works (anything in the environment), I can then lock onto it with a perspective of memory, and ignore other possibilities. That way; I maintain a purely internal outlook. Ti-Si. To allow awareness of other possibilities is to pay attention to the external auxilary perspective.
I don't quite understand the point. People like Lenore probably think that MBTI and others' use of of the concepts are often flawed by virtue of straying from their Jungian moorings.*giggles* I might have noticed the Lennore thing as well...but I figured it was Ti hard at work.But you have very good ideas and I find your ref suggestions very helfpul. Jag I must say I do adore the tert function alert. That is hysterical.
Eric, on this note, jag does have a good point. MBTI has some very apparent flaws. From a marketing perspective to admit your entire system has flaws would be a pretty bad move, given revenue and established if questionable pool of data. You would have to build another test, gather many more stats and data, totally re-market it and end up competing against yourself. But once past that it all becomes theoretical...so open to a lot of room for reinvention and new thought.
That's the "tertiary defense". It's to maintain the dominant perspective.
The complexes we often project onto others, and when you learn to recognize them in yourself, you will withdraw the projections, and become more open to the related perspectives.
In other words, an ENFP, who sees the theory through the lens of Fi, will use it primarily for NeFi purposes, such as possible ways to understand and improve one's self. A Ti perspective which dwells on the logical frameworks for their own sake he might distrust.
Like I had one ENFP tell me that "all the stuff about witches triggering puers is excuses for bad behavior". This in response to an explanation of a conflict using the framework of the eight-functional intertype dynamics (the stuff of Ti). The person saw it as if it were being spoken by a bad child making excuses for his mischief. This is the Trickster archetype they are seeing in someone else. However, when they react to it, they themselves might end up acting like bad children. They are projecting a complex onto others that is in their unconscious. If they stop projecting, it will more likely be brought under some conscious control.
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