[INTJ] Any INTJs match with the SLE profile?

[527468]

The socionicists matched up the INTJ with the SLE profile the most, so I'm wondering if anyone relates, or is an SLE. My shadow is an MBTI ESTP, but I don't relate to SLE as much as LII. I know a lot of INTJs that are probably SLEs.

Introduction into Socionics

Other matches were LIE, and then ILE. It's trying to say that INTJs are actually extroverts (if INTJ is the best 'word' for the statement).

Also SLEs are matched with duality the IEI (INTJ matched with INFP.) I don't think I'm an SLE though.

I'm an INTJ/LII, and that is a bit odder according to this exersize. These are supposedly real socionicists deliberating, and I do see the connections between these 'different theory' types. I've always thought Socionics put it a little better.

E is different in Socionics and in MBTI. In socionics E stands for outward seeking, initiative driven, and in MBTI E stands for energized by people. I see a contradiction as I've pointed out time again. Wikisocion is a great resource. I come close to E, but I'm mostly I. My intrapersonal intelligence is the strongest, so that likely indicates introversion.

Another thing is I don't find INTJ as a misrepresentation of my type. The profile sounds the most like me. I just don't trust how MBTI is organized. If the INTJ was a misrepresentation, say this, because of a faulty framework, all can be criticized, then it is not up to anyone to say INTJ = SLE. But If INTJ hadn't existed in the first place due to incorrect terminology, given information provided by this exersize, then one would assume to start with SLE. Who is to say SLE Se is not related to INTJ Ni?

What do you think of this comparison, and where do you stand, INTJs?

 

[01011010]

Mostly ILI, on occasion LII.


How many SLE, INTJs do you know?

 

[527468]

I know several INTJs personally, who seem to reflect the SLE profile of socionics, and that is where they differ from me. I can't prove that they're all SLE, because two of them are undecided under my terms (one I think is an LIE, so I don't think they're LIIs). We all scored INTJ in the testing portion and agree upon the profiling. One INTJ I know is my good friends wife, and I see her quite frequently, but I am the most unsure about her socionics type. We seem to have a lot in common, except she is annoyed by our musical intelligence, when we appreciate coarser key tones, midi synths, etc. She is quite intelligent, but not in the technical or scientific aspect. (INTJ artist) She also seems a lot more serious, and this is where my knowledge of socionics seeks growth. I can't tell the E/I difference, because she is not very talkative, so it's hard to really grasp what she's thinking about. Upon asking questions I receive undefined answers from her. They seem to be very basic, as a matter of fact. The process of typing isn't usually difficult for me. I probably need to compare my model to her tendencies in a direct manner, and I'll get finer answers. So I'll likely bring my notebook with me, and she will undoubtedly ask what I'm doing with it.

She's married to an INFP if that says anything (SLE dual IEI ?)

Also according to this exersize, I am most likely the same personality type as the INTP (LII subcategory you could say.) I have reason to believe that half of them are ILI, and that MBTI can have two differing profiles for this type. One is usually more LIIish, the other more ILIish. Yet none of them are as spot on as in Socionics. I'm not going farther than "according to this exersize" until I can examine others analyses on this data.

Mostly ILI, on occasion LII.

Do you base this typing on the profiles you read? I have a hunch that it's not the best thing to do, even though there are some well constructed profiles. Some don't really cover the objective truth, thus another type profile can seem like a best match even though its a replacement. Aside from that, take a look at the subtype profiles if you haven't already:

Category:Subtype descriptions - Wikisocion

From solely these descriptions, I am an LII, T subtype.

 

[CJ99]

These results are very interesting i would be interested to see some typology experts views on them, especially Keirsey's!

 

[527468]

I really want some INTJs to tell me what they think. (If the typical INTJ would fit the SLE attitude) I think that a problem exists where people's current understanding of typology gets in the way, and they think there is no way they could be an E or P, or even an S.

Keeping in mind that all the preferences in MBTI are different than in Socionics. The most in common for both theories is probably the N/S difference.

I/E and P/J are pretty different.

SLE values:

Se
Ti
Ni
Fe

I know that I value Ti and Fe. I'm unsure about Ni/Se. I think I lean more towards the Alpha values most of the time (Ne/Si)

These results are very interesting i would be interested to see some typology experts views on them, especially Keirsey's!

I'd love to hear Keirsey's opinion of Socionics.

 

[01011010]

I know several INTJs personally...
D
o you base this typing on the profiles you read? I have a hunch that it's not the best thing to do, even though there are some well constructed profiles. Some don't really cover the objective truth, thus another type profile can seem like a best match even though its a replacement. Aside from that, take a look at the subtype profiles if you haven't already:

Category:Subtype descriptions - Wikisocion

From solely these descriptions, I am an LII, T subtype.

Interesting observations. I'm surprised you know that many. What is your method for deciphering types under socionics?

I took a test about 3 times. I didn't read descriptions until after my first test. ILI fits better than any of the descriptions. Yet, some of LII fits as well. I have the same issue with MBTI. I score INTP far more than I do INTJ. 90% of the time. However, INTJ fit the best out of that system.

I really want some INTJs to tell me what they think. (If the typical INTJ would fit the SLE attitude) I think that a problem exists where people's current understanding of typology gets in the way, and they think there is no way they could be an E or P, or even an S.

Keeping in mind that all the preferences in MBTI are different than in Socionics. The most in common for both theories is probably the N/S difference.

I/E and P/J are pretty different.

SLE values:

Se
Ti
Ni
Fe

I know that I value Ti and Fe. I'm unsure about Ni/Se. I think I lean more towards the Alpha values most of the time (Ne/Si)

How would extraverted Se manifest itself in SLE? Don't worry. I know extraverted functions in socionics is nothing like MBTI. I actually think the lineup might work, but I'm unsure about what role Se will play.

 

[Kalach]

SLE is something like ESTP? I vaguely believe I can come off like an ENTP sometimes, but not really.


Love to help, but Socionics has mumbo jumbo and pictograms. It isn't just post-modern MBTI?

 

[entropie]

That are nice numbers. I am also a fan of socionics. I did not know that INTJ mistype themselves as ESTP or vice versa. Thats pretty intresting.

I saw a correlation in the table to mistypings I witnessed first hand in the forums. It seems to be quite accurate.

 

[Halla74]

I've checked out the Wikisocion pages a few times. I am ESTP and see much validity in the SLE profile, and male type description:

Sensing logical extrovert - Wikisocion

SLE male and female - Wikisocion

My wife is INFJ, and she is fairly accurately represented by the EII profile, and corresponding type description:

Ethical intuitive introvert - Wikisocion

EII male and female - Wikisocion

I personally cannot say that my INFJ wife is represented by the SLE profile, at all. We are polar opposites in many ways. I am not represented at all by the EII profile either.

 

[Kasper]

I did not know that INTJ mistype themselves as ESTP or vice versa. Thats pretty intresting.

I still don't know that they do. The chart was an experiment where 108 socionists read each one of the 16 Keirsey type descriptions and tried to identify which socionic types each one matched up with. I believe what it clearly showed was that the two systems should be treated as two separate systems and not to be used one on top of the other. Keep them separate people!

 

[maliafee]

SLE is something like ESTP? I vaguely believe I can come off like an ENTP sometimes, but not really.


Love to help, but Socionics has mumbo jumbo and pictograms. It isn't just post-modern MBTI?

Socionics was developed much more scientifically than MBTI, actually. It developed over in Russia completely separately from MBTI, still based, of course on Carl Jung's function theories.

In my personal opinion, MBTI types and Socionics types are largely interchangeable in the way that if you are INTP in MBTI you ought to be INTp in socionics. Now, as we're trying to look at the mind and personality scientifically, this OUGHT to be the case, if you think about it.

I know that some MBTI types do not directly translate to their socionics counterparts, but in my opinion, this has to do with flaws in the MBTI testing.

Just some socionics mumbo-jumbo for ya.

 

[527468]

Socionics was developed much more scientifically than MBTI, actually. It developed over in Russia completely separately from MBTI, still based, of course on Carl Jung's function theories.

In my personal opinion, MBTI types and Socionics types are largely interchangeable in the way that if you are INTP in MBTI you ought to be INTp in socionics. Now, as we're trying to look at the mind and personality scientifically, this OUGHT to be the case, if you think about it.

I know that some MBTI types do not directly translate to their socionics counterparts, but in my opinion, this has to do with flaws in the MBTI testing.

Just some socionics mumbo-jumbo for ya.

Yes, but from what I recall the "Americans" use the four letter system, so its like copying MBTI. But that the 4 dichotomies are different by definition. Extroversion/Introversion is defined differently etc, so the tests need to change to reflect that.

 

[527468]

Interesting observations. I'm surprised you know that many. What is your method for deciphering types under socionics.

It's odd out of all the people I know, the NTs seem to find their way to me the most. Socionics typing people is like matching them up from instant hints to profiles I've read. Once I get a clear direction, I can question upon them functions and element values. Quadra values too.

 

[01011010]

That are nice numbers. I am also a fan of socionics. I did not know that INTJ mistype themselves as ESTP or vice versa. Thats pretty intresting.

I saw a correlation in the table to mistypings I witnessed first hand in the forums. It seems to be quite accurate.

Yeah.

Something about INTJs/INTPs/ISTPs, often mistyping themselves as one another. INTJs seem to type more as ENTP in Socionics than ESTP. Lemons is the first one to even bring that kind of info to the table. Plus, it's all based on his view. While ENTP results come from many different, individual perceptions.

 

[527468]

Ok binary. I think I found our her type. She fits a lot of ESFp profiles, and especially this one: Definitive Socionics Info: ESFp "Ambassador"

Her husband is likely an INTp then. He is an INXP in MBTI.

So there's an INTJ who probably fits best into ESFp in Socionics. Opposite letters, not opposite personality.

Based on your previous question, I got to this solution by comparing my values to hers. The 8 functions. INTj values Ti, Ne, Fe, Si. She is the opposite of all of those. Interesting how well we can get along. We both are in fact reasonable human beings.

 

[Lauren Ashley]

How is it possible that an INTJ would match with SLE or SEE? The two systems aren't that disparate. If an INTJ would relate with SLE, Se would be their dominant function. Se, of all the functions, is the function that is pretty much defined the same way in Socionics and MBTI. INTX I can understand, but generally I think the types match up.

 

[527468]

No, socionics Se and MBTI Se aren't the same. They have commonalities since MBTI Se goes partly into both Socionics Se and Si. Socionics Se is much more authoritarian and tactical. Where as socionics Te is about making things simpler and more efficient (in case there was some confusion between those two).

An Se valuer will have strong Si, so they have the strong ability to perceive physical sensation, pleasure and dissonance of it, but they count on it less because its not valued like Se is. It's more of a friendly notice lol. When their Se plans might go astray because of some Si limitation.

 

[527468]

This girl who always tests as INTJ on the MBTI, I am absolutely positive she is an ISTp in socionics. What an odd difference, although the Te is there for both.