AlieNs in a crowded eStablishment

[SillySapienne]

So, yeah, reading through the birth order and type thread, a recurring thought of mine was triggered, yet again.

I am and have always been an extreme N-ish person, big into theories, abstractions, and meta-everything.

Compared to my two older sisters, well, actually, compared to most people, my N seems to set me apart, my N seems to engender within me and reflected, or should I say, rejected by others, the fact that I am in fact, well, "different" than "them", ("them" being most people, and "different" from them by what they think about as well as what they enjoy thinking about).

I can't type other people for shit.

And I tend to think most people are S types, and by most, I mean damn near everybody.

I think I inherited my N-ishness from my father, who was a text-book hardcore intellectual, though his Rainman fact-retaining/regurgitating tendencies often seemed to be quite S-ish, he was a man who lacked and loathed any real life experience and preferred, rather, to live and seek out facts, ideas and a catalogue of information/data.

Blah, rant.

So the question is, the more your "N" happens to be, do you find the less you fit in???

I do.

Thoughts?

Please share!!!

 

[spirilis]

It always seemed to work that way for my N-type friends during grade school, and college to a certain extent.

 

[pure_mercury]

I have low- to moderately-expressed S, and I never really fit in growing up. I floated between groups, but was a major individual. Of course, I am a very expressed E, so I never had a problem meeting and interacting with people; I just was quite unusual in my attitudes and behavior. I would venture to guess that the vast majority of people would have be in the low-to-moderate S range, too.

 

[Totenkindly]

It depends on the person's total personality, as well as social factors (upbringing, social skills, positive environment), as well as the society itself and its specific values, as to how disorienting the N is to the other people and how well someone can integrate.

I don't think N itself (whether Ne or Ni) is really the issue, and often S people admire N stuff from afar. When N causes trouble or friction or a disconnect is when S people get frustrated with it.

 

[runvardh]

This is the sort of thing that causes most of us to seak out personality theory. Back in elementary school I felt so much like an alien I gave up fitting in and played one. I wonder if my grade 3 teacher got worried about me...

 

[SillySapienne]

It depends on the person's total personality, as well as social factors (upbringing, social skills, positive environment), as well as the society itself and its specific values, as to how disorienting the N is to the other people and how well someone can integrate.

Good point.

The high school I happened to have gone to was, get this, predominantly composed/comprised of N-types.

:sad:

Those were the good ol' days.

Where discourse and debate were highly present, and engaged in and upon a daily basis.

I don't think N itself (whether Ne or Ni) is really the issue, and often S people admire N stuff from afar. When N causes trouble or friction or a disconnect is when S people get frustrated with it.

Lol, S-type people think I am a bit zany, brainy or, "out there" but *they* are not the ones who are getting frustrated in this situation, *I* am.

 

[Totenkindly]

...Lol, S-type people think I am a bit zany, brainy or, "out there" but *they* are not the ones who are getting frustrated in this situation, *I* am.

What, the inability for people to follow the N thought pattern or see what you're getting at when you say something... or having to justify any intuitive leap you could make?

 

[colmena]

I suspect the sheer majority of Ss causes Ns to repress their Nness.

You being aware of it; being very outgoing; free thinking; and independent, will have you showing it off and make you stand out.

 

[The Ü™]

Well, the S-dominated world seems to generally look down upon my unconventional look at the world.

I can remember even as far as back as elementary school, where I frequently engaged in fantasy play on my own and didn't understand or even care about the games the other children played. Hence, I was frequently a victim of bullying.

My S was always very underdeveloped, and so I was always physically uncoordinated. I never liked gym class and I had very poor motor skills. I wasn't good at playing team sports that required me to keep an eye on what's going on directly around me.

Back then, I was, of course, believed to have ADD not because I was impulsive and couldn't sit still (I was never a physical type), but because I couldn't concentrate on the here-and-now.

I think because of my imaginative nature during childhood, I was perceived as a bit strange, maybe even crazy, and that, in turn, deepened my isolation from others. Most of my attempts to fit in were either unsuccessful or just uninteresting, because I didn't share the interests of other people my age.

I also liked pushing buttons and seeing how other people would react. It was always my nature to play those "What would happen if" games. Coupled with my misanthropy, this manifested in a desire to shock my peers and make them feel uneasy.

I tried fitting in with others by showing off the things that interested me. Unfortunately, others were more often than not bored with all the kinds of roller coasters, movie special effects, and my fanciful ideas. I also tried fitting in by sharing dirty jokes with others that I looked up on the Internet, but I am absolutely terrible at telling dirty jokes.

I was mostly perceived as stupid by others and I was uninterested in the things most people did for fun (partying, sports, going to the movies, etc.) so I was pretty much always a loner. (Where most people liked going to the movies to be entertained, I went to the movies to be creatively inspired and to analyze them.)

I think N types can feel more isolated because they are the kinds of people more motivated to change things and shake things up while the S types are more oriented to enjoyment of the here-and-now. I mean, let's face it, people bent on changing things are generally frowned upon.

But I think, as a side effect, this leads N types to potentially be more isolated.

 

[SillySapienne]

What, the inability for people to follow the N thought pattern or see what you're getting at when you say something... or having to justify any intuitive leap you could make?

Lol, yes, totally, but that's when I get lucky enough to be with people who at the very least are down to wax-politic.

Most of the time, I am around or surrounded by people who prefer to discuss things that are, blah, boring and entirely uninteresting to me.

I am very quiet and reflective when with S-types, believe it or not.

And when with them, my E just wants to scream and let my stifled N out.

Ho-hum.

 

[substitute]

yeah in general chick, I agree. it's why when you get a question like "which is the most crazy-seeming type", the ENxP's are usually the favourite, cos although other types can be just as wacky as us, I think we put more of our wackiness on display than the Ni primaries or whatever else.

But I relate to what you just said about being quiet around S's, and feeling stifled/gagged etc.

 

[miss fortune]

I'm going to agree with Jennifer here and say that it depends a whole lot on the person's entire personality instead of just the N/S dichotomy here. I've always fit in fine wherever I went because of the ability to talk about any subject, even those that I don't know all that much about and had to draw from other knowlege to chat. I've always been regarded as a bit strange by people, but they generally like me (except those who take an immediate hatred of me, but those are fortunatly few and far between }

My friends growing up were a mix of N and S, and I always got along with all of them fine, barring spats with the ESFJ, but I'd blame the EJ behavior more for that one than the Sishness.

Of course, I'm an Enneagram 7w8 so/sp, so that may have something to do with all of this as well

 

[substitute]

What, the inability for people to follow the N thought pattern or see what you're getting at when you say something... or having to justify any intuitive leap you could make?

Yes, the having to justify it painstakingly, that's extremely tiring. And also something I can't always do - something many N's can't always do, resulting in you just looking like a schmuck when you know damned well you had a great idea/the truth/whatever.

It's a bit like being that Cassandra character in many ways...

But I have no trouble with ISTP's for some reason.

 

[Atomic Fiend]

And people wonder why I'm such a private person. I seem secretive, but really I don't disclose my thoughts to anyone who can't understand them, or won't accept them.

If you are able to grasp my thoughts, ideas, and can accept my eccentric personality then, you'd believe me to be an extravert.

 

[Totenkindly]

Yes, the having to justify it painstakingly, that's extremely tiring. And also something I can't always do - something many N's can't always do, resulting in you just looking like a schmuck when you know damned well you had a great idea/the truth/whatever.

I guess for a long time I just avoided it by creating my own little pocket universe. (The joys of being an introvert.) But it robs the world of our imagination if we always retreat; I usually would feel out a situation to see if it was worth bringing intangibles into it.

But I have no trouble with ISTP's for some reason.

really? Depending on how cynical they are, they can piss me off. It's like we ALMOST connect (same hard logic)... but then they get stuck in the mud and refuse to budge...! (And then I'll feel like they think I'm being silly or stupid for focusing so much on the possibilities and not the typical realities.)

 

[SillySapienne]

It's a bit like being that Cassandra character in many ways...

Wow, totally, totally, totally!!!

 

[MacGuffin]

Moved from Bonfire.

 

[Angry Ayrab]

Most of the time when I am carefree with my group (mostly severe S types, because I can't find any of you damn N's), I find that I have a nack to somehow make the subject more interesting to me. For example, I know jack-shit about football (american) yet, I know a little bit here and there and a couple of player names, to be able to change the topic from talking about some dipshits stats, to how the game actually works, or strategies of certain formations etc...

I used to be very into fantasy video games like final fantasy, knights of the old republic, Resident Evil mainly for the story (actually Halo was only to kick everyones ass, I am anally competitive). So I can find topics to talk about in this realm too, even though the conversations aren't that stimulating, I can always find a way to shift it to analyzing how the game was setup or the hardware differences and advantages of different systems, or how to hack different systems etc...

In cars, I could care less if you have this piece of shit on it or that piece of crap under the hood and what not, but I find a way to involve myself by having them explain how different upgrades work to influence the cars performance, as opposed to just how pimp the dudes new rims are. Most people enjoy showing off the knoweledge they acquire, and I don't mind learning.

Mind you, this is only when I am in a healthy energetic (normal me) mood. When I am kinda having a bad day, I can have zero to no tolerance for conversations about what the Eff lebron james did, or who the mavericks beat etc... I won't even try, and I will try to sway the topic really off spectrum by talking some major philosophical ideas or politics and everyone kinda doesn't respond or such, and look at me as if I they just saw a ghost.

I didn't know (actually I understand it now) that S personality helps you in body coordination, like uber mentioned. I have a really weak S and I guess the only time where I am in total S mode is when I am playing soccer. The second I am out on the field, and I have the ball, everything really does go into hyper focus and I can see just about everyone around me and I know what people are going to do befoer they do it and I am just in the zone. If that is what is like to be an extreme S that is a cool feeling, if not than what the hell did I just describe?

 

[substitute]

really? Depending on how cynical they are, they can piss me off. It's like we ALMOST connect (same hard logic)... but then they get stuck in the mud and refuse to budge...! (And then I'll feel like they think I'm being silly or stupid for focusing so much on the possibilities and not the typical realities.)

Well I'm pretty damned cynical too. My best bud, an ISTP, can be a bit 'stuck in the here-and-now mud' at times, but once we got to know each other and I came to respect and rely on his observation and practical mindedness, he also now says to other people if they comment on my wackiness (and I heard him say this the other day when I was in a different room) "Sometimes you know, it doesn't hurt to hear him out, and if you do that and get your head round what he's on about he usually has a good point."

He's also said that my ability to see around the present obstacle to solutions has got him out of many a black hole of "oh it's all useless" type depression. He's called me "the nil desperandum guy".

 

[Ilah]

I suspect the sheer majority of Ss causes Ns to repress their Nness.

You being aware of it; being very outgoing; free thinking; and independent, will have you showing it off and make you stand out.

I completely related to this. I am not sure if Ni (my primary) is completely to blame for my eccentricness or not. I know that both my N and my eccentric tendancies were heavily repressed.

I wasn't able to repress them completely, but I toned them down quite a bit. I realize now that it caused me quite a bit of stress to partial repress who I was. I am in the process of trying to be more myself, but always it seems like a balancing act. I still tone it down a bit, but less heavy handed and more selectively. At home and with a select group of friends - and at science fiction or game conventions - I am pretty close to my true self. At work I tone it down a bit.

One annoying factor about being introverted and high N, is that people always act like your unusual taste in clothing (or other unusual things) are done just to get attention. "Why else would you be wearing it?" Umm....no, I didn't really want the attention.

Ilah