2020 Democratic Party primary thread

[Nicodemus]

Bernie is the one who had a recent heart attack; that's more of a concern to me than merely age.

Bernie had a heart attack and Biden has trouble keeping his thoughts together. They are both infinitely preferable to Trump, but neither is a particularly good choice.

By the way, ever hear of a V.P.?

You mean people like Andrew Johnson, Dick Cheney, and Mike Pence?

Granted, it would be a neat way of maneuvering somebody into the presidency who could lead the next generation. If it turns out Biden or Bernie win the nomination, I would very much hope they pick a promising successor as vice president.

 

[SearchingforPeace]

[MENTION=20113]Tellenbach[/MENTION]

A childhood friend from Pennsylvania just made me aware of this:

Trump privately obsessed with Bernie Sanders Popularity and socialism's appeal



I'm actually not sure it's the best idea to cancel student debt, even though I have plenty of it. Wouldn't this prevent any incentive from giving out student loans in the future? The cost of college would have to drastically lower for that to work as intended, and that seems like a very tall order.

However, my top priority is defeating Donald Trump. I also happen to be very tired of mainstream Democrats obsessed with norms, bipartisanship, and compromise, seeing all these things as ends in themselves. It's time for the center of gravity in American politics to shift, and I think Bernie, if successful, can pull that off.

Trump should roll out Medicare for All and a student loan debt jubilee. Then he would get even more crossover voters.

Both are smart policies anyway.

 

[Nicodemus]

Trump should roll out Medicare for All and a student loan debt jubilee. Then he would get even more crossover voters.

Both are smart policies anyway.

Being Trump, he could simply pretend he has already done it...

 

[Jaguar]

How is someone who backed Vietnam 2.0 (despite him now claiming he didn't) qualified to be the commander-in-chief of the most powerful military in the world? Do you realize that Iraqis are having a massive protest right now for U.S. troops to leave? Few openly now claim that the Iraq war was a good decision. Given that, why would we have someone in there equally likely to make shitty decisions like that in the future? Joe Biden's "foreign policy experience" means nothing if that experience consists of terrible decisions and subpar judgement.

I think you should be posting that to the person who was quoted in the article and quit wasting my time with the endless whataboutery.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

I think you should be posting that to the person who was quoted in the article and quit wasting my time with the endless whataboutery.

You disagree with the quote you pulled?

I noticed that the person quoted in the article is a Hillary supporter. Hillary's judgement on foreign policy is also shitty despite the supposed virtues of her "experience."

 

[Jaguar]

I noticed that the person quoted in the article is a Hillary supporter. Hillary's judgement on foreign policy is also shitty despite the supposed virtues of her "experience."

Fuck Hillary.

 

[Virtual ghost]

Curious, how many of you would take Bloomberg over Biden as a candidate ?

 

[Jaguar]

Curious, how many of you would take Bloomberg over Biden as a candidate ?

He is one seriously short shyster.


AP FACT CHECK: Bloomberg says he's killing coal. He's not

 

[Virtual ghost]

This is really getting boring, it is time for the only polls that really matter.

 

[Doctor Cringelord]

This is really getting boring, it is time for the only polls that really matter.

Fuck polls, look at the Iowa electronic markets

 

[Maou]

Bloomburg is a complete fucking hack. He is just trying to ride the coattails of Trump. Id take fucking Bernie over him.

 

[Jaguar]

Bernie Sanders Campaign Calls New Debate Criteria a 'Rigged System' After DNC Removes Donor Threshold

The presidential campaign of Senator Bernie Sanders denounced a Democratic National Committee rule change that eliminates the individual donor threshold for candidates participating in debates, possibly opening the door for billionaire former New York City Mayor Mike Bloomberg at future debates.

 

[SearchingforPeace]

Bernie Sanders Campaign Calls New Debate Criteria a 'Rigged System' After DNC Removes Donor Threshold

The presidential campaign of Senator Bernie Sanders denounced a Democratic National Committee rule change that eliminates the individual donor threshold for candidates participating in debates, possibly opening the door for billionaire former New York City Mayor Mike Bloomberg at future debates.

I read today TPTB in the DNC are meeting and planning to change the convention rules.

 

[Bush]

I read today TPTB in the DNC are meeting and planning to change the convention rules.

Here's to hoping they don't.

DNC members discuss rules change to stop Sanders at convention - POLITICO

In conversations on the sidelines of a DNC executive committee meeting and in telephone calls and texts in recent days, about a half-dozen members have discussed the possibility of a policy reversal to ensure that so-called superdelegates can vote on the first ballot at the party’s national convention. Such a move would increase the influence of DNC members, members of Congress and other top party officials, who now must wait until the second ballot to have their say if the convention is contested.
[...]
“There’s talk about somehow trying to change this rule at this convention — just casual conversation, and I have participated in it some,” said Don Fowler, a former DNC chairman from South Carolina who opposed the DNC’s decision in 2018 to strip superdelegates of much of their power in the presidential nominating process. “But I want to be clear that I would not be a party to any effort to do that in the 2020 convention … It’s bad sportsmanship.”

Fowler said, “I think it would be not in good faith if those of us who lost that fight in committee would somehow regenerate that fight in a national convention.” If they did, he said it would result in “the most hellacious fight you’ve ever seen at the Democratic convention.”

Fowler declined to identify members participating in the conversations, and the DNC itself dismissed the idea.

It'd be nice if they learned literally anything from 2016.

 

[Nicodemus]

Bloomburg is a complete fucking hack. He is just trying to ride the coattails of Trump. Id take fucking Bernie over him.

I would love to hear the reasoning behind that bizarre notion. Ride the coattails? Bloomberg got into politics before Trump did, he is much, much wealthier than Trump, and he actually puts his money where his mouth is.

 

[Virtual ghost]

Here's to hoping they don't.

DNC members discuss rules change to stop Sanders at convention - POLITICO

It'd be nice if they learned literally anything from 2016.

The funny thing is that this could tilt even more people towards Bernie, especially in none voter group. Which isn't small group of people at all.
With this you basically admitting and publicly showing that the game is rigged.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

Here's to hoping they don't.

DNC members discuss rules change to stop Sanders at convention - POLITICO

It'd be nice if they learned literally anything from 2016.

The Democratic establishment would rather blame Russia and Sanders (evidently he was too mean to Hillary) than attribute anything to their own incompetence.

 

[ceecee]

The funny thing is that this could tilt even more people towards Bernie, especially in none voter group. Which isn't small group of people at all.
With this you basically admitting and publicly showing that the game is rigged.

lol Exactly. The DNC is beyond stupid, hopeless and idiotic.

 

[Jaguar]

On the eve of the Iowa caucuses, a bit of Iowa history to keep you warm tonight:

In 1988:

1. Senator Bob Dole of Kansas 37%
2. Pat Robertson, the former television evangelist 25%
3. Vice President George H.W. Bush 19%


1. Representative Richard A. Gephardt of Missouri 31%
2. Senator Paul Simon of Illinois 27%
3. Gov. Michael S. Dukakis of Massachusetts 22%

#3 from each party ended up in the national election and GHW Bush won.

In 1992:

1. Tom Harkin 76.4%
2. Uncommitted 11.9%
3. Paul Tsongas 4.1%
4. Bill Clinton 2.8%

Unopposed GHW Bush faced #4 in the national election and Bill Clinton won.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

Appropriate, because I still have no idea how these caucuses actually work.

On the eve of the Iowa caucuses, a bit of Iowa history to keep you warm tonight:

In 1988:

1. Senator Bob Dole of Kansas 37%
2. Pat Robertson, the former television evangelist 25%
3. Vice President George H.W. Bush 19%


1. Representative Richard A. Gephardt of Missouri 31%
2. Senator Paul Simon of Illinois 27%
3. Gov. Michael S. Dukakis of Massachusetts 22%

#3 from each party ended up in the national election and GHW Bush won.

In 1992:

1. Tom Harkin 76.4%
2. Uncommitted 11.9%
3. Paul Tsongas 4.1%
4. Bill Clinton 2.8%

Unopposed GHW Bush faced #4 in the national election and Bill Clinton won.

If Biden wins Iowa, I'm accepting Trump's re-election as a given. All the political stuff I do is at the state and city level, anyway. If I end up being wrong about Biden, I get a pleasant surprise. I'm a big believer in the wisdom of low expectations. I just don't see how Biden can succeed where Hillary failed when he will run the exact same campaign.

I'd place Bernie (and perhaps surprisingly to you) and Buttigieg as the best bets in the general. Warren might make a good president but is seen as too inauthentic (a big no-no). Yang, I think has a surprising crossover appeal that could work in the general, but I'm not sure that he has traction in the primaries. If Gabbard is still running, her failure to vote for impeachment would be a huge dealbreaker (it even turned me against her), so she's dead in the water in these primaries. Everyone else, I think, is a disaster that Trump would run circles around. Unsurprisingly, my top picks all have a core base of supporters who are passionate about the candidate, which I think is more important than "electability" (which was something Trump and Obama lacked, remember). Biden's supporters only support him because they think he has the best shot to beat Trump; they're not actually for Biden himself, which is why he will be a disaster. Hillary even had a stronger base than Biden because of 90's nostalgia and feminism. Biden has none of that; people don't feel nostalgic for a recession.