Fictional is easier. I like Luke Skywalker, he is on the idealistic side I guess. I think I lean to the reluctant hero or the anti hero.
Who are some antiheroes? Sometimes I like the villians...
I like antiheroes. They are more entertaining than the "good guys."
As an example, the Phantom is far more interesting of a character than "good guy" Raoul.
Who are some antiheroes? Sometimes I like the villians...
i like antiheroes also, and reluctant heroes.
i like the John McClane type of reluctant hero - "i do this because there's nobody else to do it." the heroes who want to be left alone.
flawed heroes are a lot more interesting, i especially like self-important and egotistical heroes. like Jimmy McNulty in The Wire. or Han Solo, he is a lot more interesting to me than Luke Skywalker.
some anti-heroes are: Robert DeNiro in Taxi Driver, Cool Hand Luke, The Man With No Name, Harry Callahan from Dirty Harry, Tyler Durden in Fight Club, Charles Bronson in Death Wish.
So what makes them antiheroes?
I like the mysterious characters, the ones you're never quite sure what side they're on but you hope that when the shit hits the fan they'll step in on your side. I can't think of any examples though.
In wrestling they're called Tweeners.
I like both but Luke resonates more with the way I am. In a way, I like that he really was not sure over a lot of things, reluctant. In himself and his calling as a Jedi. I could relate to that in the story. Han Solo was more confident and cocky, he wasn't turned in on himself enough. I like it when the hero loses a bit too. That is one of the main reasons The Good and the bad is my favourite western. Blondie gets lost in the desert and almost hung. But Blondie is pretty confident, when the hero doubts themselves and overcomes that. That is the most interesting.
It interests me more when the hero needs to overcome himself.
when the hero doubts themselves and overcomes that. That is the most interesting.
It interests me more when the hero needs to overcome himself.
i resonate more with Han - how he isn't driven by a purpose or his ideals or fighting for his beliefs like Luke.
Han takes up the causes of other people, he fights for people but he never really fights for a cause. that is what i relate to.
i like the heroes who doubt themselves and overcome it-
they are the hero with a purpose who has to find their inner strength.
then there is the hero who has confidence and doesn't doubt themself-
they are the hero who has strength but needs to find their purpose.
they are both pretty interesting.
i think different heroes have very different parts of themselves they need to overcome.
i am thinking of the brothers in 8 Diagram Pole Fighter - they both fight with themselves but in very different ways.
I like it when something or somebody turns the hero on. maybe I am idealistic in a way, as much as I like Han, I like that Luke comes from a place that never changes. I think that is the best way to put it.
It isn't the external cause that I like in the Luke character, it is his cause within himself that I like.
It is pretty interesting how people see heroes. What aspects resonate most. Interesting!
yeah, i like heroes like that too. like Sergeant Elias in Platoon, he has an unshakable set of principles that guides everything he does. he has a real clear and solid internal focus.
it is! i always like that different people see characters and heroes in such different ways.
I want to know more about idealism in sfp. I really think that idealism for me meant authenticity in what I was doing. And was built from what I had experienced through my life. It was an experiential idealism not an abstract idealism.
I don't know, I am trying to understand that.
Yeah, it is kind of unrelated but that reminds of the way I think extroverted thinking and all that it represents can help isfp.
i think you are right that it is experiential.
i don't know what idealism is. i am trying to think of what it is and i can't do it. i think part of it is a belief that there is good in things.
what do you mean by idealism means authenticity in what you're doing?
Quality
"Quality," or "value," as described by Pirsig, cannot be defined because it empirically precedes any intellectual construction of it. Quality is the "knife-edge" of experience, known to all. "What distinguishes good and bad writing? Do we need to ask this question of Lysias or anyone else who ever did write anything?" (Plato's Phaedrus, 258d). Equating it with the Tao, Pirsig postulates that Quality is the fundamental force in the universe stimulating everything from atoms to animals to evolve and incorporate ever greater levels of Quality. According to the MOQ, everything (including the mind, ideas, and matter) is a product and a result of Quality.
how do you mean? the organization of it?
Introverted Feeling in tandem with Extraverted Thinking..
We can get impressive results using introverted feeling in tandem with extraverted thinking. We can stay true to our beliefs by structuring our lives and standing firm on whats important. We might decide against purchasing a particular product that harms the environment and then arrange our lives or the organization we lead to make do without it. We might refer to evidence and empirical reasoning to support what we believe is true. Maybe we hold fast to the idea that all people bring useful gifts to society, then construct a metric and gather data to demonstrate this value. Or we might use time management and spatial organization skills to better follow through on important commitments and worthwhile projects.
Extraverted Sensing in tandem with Introverted Intuiting
We can get powerful results using extraverted Sensing in tandem with introverted Intuiting. We can be very tuned in to the surrounding environment, with anticipation of whats coming next. We may constantly read our industrys current news to be sure to catch the next wave of innovations. Or we can engage people in fun activities, drawing them out and helping them transform themselves. We might pull a shy person onto the dance floor, convinced that there is an inner dancer waiting to be released; that person experiences his or her potential firsthand. Or we might shape the current context to what we envision it can be, like a sculptor who can see the final statue within a chunk of marble and sculpts everything else away to get to it.
Its aim is not so much to accommodate to the objective fact as to stand above it, since its whole unconscious effort is to give reality to the underlying images. It is, as it were, continually seeking an image which has no existence in reality, but of which it has had a sort of previous vision. From objects that can never fit in with its aim it seems to glide unheedingly away. It strives after an inner intensity, to which at the most, objects contribute only an accessory stimulus.