[MBTI General] INFx lack of ambition?

[mwv6r]

I'm surrounded by a lot of SJs and SPs at work (and throughout daily life for that matter), and I'm often struck by how much more ambitious they are than me career-wise. I work hard, am good at my job, and take my work seriously, but I have zero interest in moving up the ladder because I don't want it to cut into my personal time, which I like to spend with family and friends as well as reading/other nerdish pursuits. Many of my girlfriends say they couldn't imagine being a stay-at-home mom, but to me that sounds pretty awesome. Sometimes I wonder if I ought to have more ambition, but moving up the ladder just kind of seems like a rat race to me. Any other NFs experience this? My suspicion is that ENFJs won't because most of the ones I know in real life have an insane resume and are involved in a million things. But who knows... Let me know if any of this resonates with you NFs... Or maybe I am just unusually lazy

 

[Thalassa]

Hmmm...I have ambition to live an "interesting" life, but that doesn't translate into the mainstream kind of corporate ladder ambition. I would rather have less money if it means I have more free time and a better quality life. I've quit jobs to move across the country more than once. I've jumped at chances to take even short trips to places in the US and Canada. I have ambition, but it's not linear, dedicated, or disciplined in the slightest. In fact, I'm getting toward the end of college, and while I've been an excellent student, I've totally waned into slack-ass mode now that I'll be a senior in January. I've just totally lost my drive for it, and while I'll probably stick with it and get my degree, if I'm not feeling it I will devote myself to other things.

My "ambitions" in life have actually seemed fairly ENFP instead of INFP, and I question it all of the time. But I am extremely lazy and considered a fucked-up failure probably the eyes of many J types. I've had a really interesting life, though...and with some necessary exceptions I do what I want with it.

 

[mwv6r]

Ps sorry to post twice.... Damn iPhone and its tiny screen

 

[Scott N Denver]

Ps sorry to post twice.... Damn iPhone and its tiny screen

oh, I'll move my post then

 

[Scott N Denver]

moving my response from the other thread:

I thought lack of ambition was more of an NFP thing and/or SFP thing. I know I've seen plenty of MBTI book references to "lack of work ambition" amongst INFP's. I'd expect INFJ's to more likely have other major interests or goals in life, as you described, than to "have work ambition." Time to go see the INF thread on this topic...

 

[musttry]

I was very ambitious during my twenties in that I worked hard at three jobs in order to get through grad school and found a job in a decent firm. I even got used to working 45 to 60 hour weeks (and a few 70 hour ones) but realised that I had to pace myself cause no one was going to fast track me.

Now, I've slowed down but that has brought about discovering that there was no real point. So I've lost a lot of ambition. I think I need a new goal and project.

 

[Fidelia]

I think INFJs are quite ambitious, but it isn't always defined by climbing the ladder of authority at work. They tend to enjoy exerting influence from behind the scenes. They also choose to sink their efforts into a variety of different pursuits. In my case, I am too diffused in focus to climb up the ladder. I know a lot about many different areas, but don't focus on most of them with laser-like intensity. I don't want to remain doing exactly the same line of work within my profession for my whole career. The SJs I know tend to do well in climbing the ladder at work because they want to please those in authority, they find their identity in a doing a job thoroughly and well, they are competitive, and they prefer to know where they stand in the hierarchy of those they work with. These qualities make for a more rapid assent and interest in management, than some NFs pursue.

 

[the state i am in]

i have a lot of ambition but again it's not in any way shape or form that is even halfway legible or intelligible to st or sf types.

i am extremely organized when it comes to learning. i like to do new things. i want to go to new places, see new people, absorb as much of the world as possible and then process it to my liking, until i can articulate big chunks of it in a way that is revealing and useful and appealing and meaningful to others.

plus, i like to master things. i don't ever just love the challenge for the sake of a challenge like many T types, but i do love perfection when it counts for something special to me, when it accompanies a message that i believe in and think is big/great enough to be worth the continued attention.

like a smoked and deep fried turkey on thanksgiving.

 

[OrangeAppled]

Hmmm...I have ambition to live an "interesting" life, but that doesn't translate into the mainstream kind of corporate ladder ambition. I would rather have less money if it means I have more free time and a better quality life. I've quit jobs to move across the country more than once. I've jumped at chances to take even short trips to places in the US and Canada. I have ambition, but it's not linear, dedicated, or disciplined in the slightest. In fact, I'm getting toward the end of college, and while I've been an excellent student, I've totally waned into slack-ass mode now that I'll be a senior in January. I've just totally lost my drive for it, and while I'll probably stick with it and get my degree, if I'm not feeling it I will devote myself to other things.

This applies to me also.

My goals are part of some idealized picture I have for an exciting and fulfilled life. It's very broad and generalized, which allows me to keep my options open. I too have different priorities from many people, and am not very concerned about keeping up with the Joneses. In some ways, these pie in the sky ideals keep me grounded in what is really important.

Like many INFPs report, I don't seek opportunities so much as they happen to come to me, and I am relaxed enough to just go with it and see what happens. I would pick up and move to the other side of the world in a heartbeat if an opportunity came and hit me in the head, but I probably won't make some grand plan to do it myself. Questions like "where do you see yourself in 5 years?" make my head spin, because I can imagine endless situations that I'd be thrilled to be in.

So, no, I am not ambitious. I think it's a good thing though. There's something about ambition that is competitive and vain and that makes it ugly sometimes.

 

[LotsOfHeart]

I'm surrounded by a lot of SJs and SPs at work (and throughout daily life for that matter), and I'm often struck by how much more ambitious they are than me career-wise. I work hard, am good at my job, and take my work seriously, but I have zero interest in moving up the ladder because I don't want it to cut into my personal time, which I like to spend with family and friends as well as reading/other nerdish pursuits. Many of my girlfriends say they couldn't imagine being a stay-at-home mom, but to me that sounds pretty awesome. Sometimes I wonder if I ought to have more ambition, but moving up the ladder just kind of seems like a rat race to me. Any other NFs experience this? My suspicion is that ENFJs won't because most of the ones I know in real life have an insane resume and are involved in a million things. But who knows... Let me know if any of this resonates with you NFs... Or maybe I am just unusually lazy

Ambition is doing something intense and rigorous with the intent to reach a certain level in your work that many others will be unable to match. Moving "up the ladder" often involves all kinds of politics that sometimes involve not that much work. I always felt that I didn't like getting involved with that stuff. I felt like I would be giving my soul away if I got involved with moving up a ladder.

I don't like stepping on others to get places. I also don't like being resented by others if I do succeed or looked down upon if I don't. I don't like the drama that such situations always seem to create. It's just too much for me to deal with, I get uncomfortable. I'm more comfortable in situations where I can kind of find my niche and better myself without worrying about others. That's just me though.

I am put in situations where I have to move up a ladder, and I just deal with it the best I can. That's all I can do. I try not to get too caught up in it. I've been both a leader and a follower, and I just try to do my best and avoid people who appear unhealthy to me.

 

[firstjudge]

I agree with most of what's been said in this thread.

When I listen to others talk about how important it is to "make it to the top," and watch people brown nosing their way to the top, I get frustrated. It really saddens me and even angers me at times that people who put so much importance on this type of corporate success look down on others who don't have the same ambitions. It seems like all people care about is money and status. Don't get me wrong, money is great to have, but I only need so much. Status is something I don't give a crap about. I am amazed by the lengths people will go to attain these rather superficial things: cutting-throats, back-stabbing, etc. Ugh...

 

[William K]

I thought lack of ambition was more of an NFP thing and/or SFP thing. I know I've seen plenty of MBTI book references to "lack of work ambition" amongst INFP's. I'd expect INFJ's to more likely have other major interests or goals in life, as you described, than to "have work ambition." Time to go see the INF thread on this topic...

I have to agree about the NFP part of it. INFPs in particular are laid-back when it comes to these kinds of things. When it comes to my annual performance evaluation at work and I come to the section where I have to describe my short, mid and long-term goals, I always have to grope for things to write.

Personally, I see professional success as a means as opposed to a goal. That is, if I become rich, then I'd be free to pursue what I really want to do. But being in the rat race is not my first choice of getting there.

I might not be ambitious in that sense, but my idealistic side dreams up a lot of big things I want to achieve if I can stop procrastinating enough to reach for it

 

[William K]

I have ambition, but it's not linear, dedicated, or disciplined in the slightest.

Same here. There's an idealistic, world-changing goal at the end but the journey is not a straight line with set milestones in between. And I probably won't really mind if I don't reach the goal either because the journey itself is as fun. I'd rather enjoy my daily (mundane, boring?) life then to sacrifice it to become rich and famous.

 

[Lacey]

So, this is my last year of college, and of course everyone's talking about what grad schools they're applying to, at what places they're getting job interviews, etc.

My plan after graduation is to just move to some big city, get a whatever job, and live in a crappy apartment with my friends. I've told some people this, and some of them have made sarcastic remarks about how ambitious I am and what a good use of a degree and all that.

Yeah, whatever. My ambition is to have an adventure.

 

[FemMecha]

I'm ambitious in my creative work moreso than most people I've encountered. I am driven to grow and to get it right. I'm not sure exactly why. The problem of ambition for me is that mine doesn't align well with the external games and images that are required to gain the opportunities. I did start having a few good clothes when I almost accidentally discovered how easily that impresses people. Sometimes depression gets in the way of my drive, but I am driven towards something, but it is of a strongly internal/philosophical nature.

 

[cascadeco]

I've *never* considered myself to be ambitious in the sense most people use the word. Actually I'm not terribly goal-oriented in life, and have never had a life plan...never had 5 or 10 year projections; given my nature and how I approach life, that's an impossibility. That stuff is usually pretty fuzzy for me.

But I'm definitely all about seizing opportunities that come my way, and I become quite impatient/restless when I feel I've been sitting still for too long, and don't have anything to show for it. So in that sense I'm always anxious and driven to try new things, and to keep myself reasonably occupied and challenged so that boredom doesn't set in. I hate feeling as if I'm not accomplishing anything. I DO need things to look forward to and to set my sight on - some reason for my momentum - so floating along and taking things as they come is definitely not comfortable for me. I need to feel proactive about my life and what I'm doing with it, and I get quite ancy when I don't feel like I'm striving for anything.

Specifically as to the OP - no, I'm no ladder-climber either. I find most of that stuff kind of pointless, especially since the act of climbing doesn't improve my sense of self-worth and I haven't had a job yet whose subject matter I actually care enough about to WANT to stay within the department/organization. The only reason I would want to 'climb the ladder' would be IF I truly enjoyed what I was doing and found the subject matter intriguing, and the act of attaining more responsibility was something I desired because I wanted the challenge because I was becoming bored/unfulfilled with my current job.