[ISFJ] ISFJ's Inflexibility

[Shimpei]

I live with my ISFJ mother. Yes, she may be a little inflexible at times but it's too easy to convince her and get my way. (That sounds bad, but it's for simple things.) You just have to be really, really.. um, well nice. It's really easy to make my mom happy. She loves compliments.. on anything: the dinner she made, her clothes, etc. The happier they are the more likely they're able to let you have what you want. The more you piss an ISFJ off the more they will fight back. So calm down, humor them.. it worked for me for 17 years.

I think you're right. I find ISFJs quite simple in this matter (too ).

 

[wildcat]

I think you're right. I find ISFJs quite simple in this matter (too ).

There was this test you took recently about the preference of a function.

Maybe it is a typo.

The outcome did not make sense.

 

[Shimpei]

There was this test you took recently about the preference of a function.

Maybe it is a typo.

The outcome did not make sense.

What do you mean? Could you elaborate?

 

[FDG]

There are two ways to convince an ISFJ:
- either you insist a lot with all the possible logical reasons and they say yes because of exhaustion.
- or you get ANGRY, incredibly ANGRY to the point they understand how their view is going to completely endanger the relationship and they'll agree with you.

 

[Ivy]

There are two ways to convince an ISFJ:
- either you insist a lot with all the possible logical reasons and they say yes because of exhaustion.
- or you get ANGRY, incredibly ANGRY to the point they understand how their view is going to completely endanger the relationship and they'll agree with you.

Do either of these actually count as "convincing?"

Do you have personal experience in this area?

 

[FDG]

Do either of these actually count as "convincing?"

Do you have personal experience in this area?

Not that I'm saying it should be used often. Only when you're (I am) absolutely sure I'm right, and they're wrong, and that their course of action is going to lead to disaster. In everyday matters it's kind of really hard to convince ISFJs.

anyway, I've got an ISFJ mother and almost all my girlfriends have been ISFJs.

They don't exactly count as convincing. Multiple times it has happened that they kept standing their ground, and then the next day told me I was actually right - it even happened with an ISFJ high-school teacher.

One last note. No ISFJ will ever admit that that's the way to do it. That's because they like being right - even when healthy.

Not that this is a manifesto against them at all, quite the opposite. It's just that probably the most delicate point in a relationship with an ISFJ is to convince them of something when they are wrong.

Anyway. The ISFJ I'm dating right now is not controlling at all. She just tells me to do more homework sometimes, but that's all. Not conservative on most accounts either.

Previously, I've dated a BPD ISFJ. That has been the worst experience of my life, and unfortunately has messed up some patterns in my head about relationships.

 

[Spartan]

Yes I know what you mean, I've an ISFJ friend who I used to roleplay with, and everything had to be done her way, there was just no negotiation. I remember another of our friends wanted to roleplay with us, but needed a ride home - she lived right near him, but she refused to give him a ride because it would mean she'd have to go by a VERY SLIGHTLY different route than the one she prefers, and she wouldn't budge on it. She would happily leave in her car, leaving him behind to walk home at night, I don't know how she lives with herself. The guy she snubbed is ISTJ, and I find him a bit easier to deal with, a bit more reasonable.

I found that the only way to persuade my ISFJ to do anything that was slightly out of her preferred routine, was to use a bit of emotional blackmail by saying that not doing so would cause hurt or offence to someone she liked, or knew she couldn't afford to offend. Or to subtly suggest that not cooperating with me might necessitate an open admission of her dislike/disrespect for someone, risking a 'scene' in public where people would confront her. That was the only leverage I could ever use with her - the obsessive sense of propriety and fear of confrontation.

I can remember the days where I followed countless rules and conformed in order to avoid punishment. While I still value things like tradition and religion a lot, I have become more skeptical and cynical about my habits. I have learned to respect people's views no matter how they sound in my mind. I have been open to new ideas and new experiences. I have become more extroverted and made a life-long promise to myself to value and use my education.
For any ISFJ out there, these are good ways to improve yourself, live life more happily, and get along with others better.
Take a joke every once and awhile.
I have met interesting people and made good friends such as with an ENTP. That never would of been possible if I had stayed narrow-minded.

 

[Spartan]

I hear all kinds of stories about INTJs but gosh, I work with an ISFJ woman that is one of the most inflexible human beings around. You can't have any level of spirited discussion about anything because if your opinion differs from hers, she gets so rigid and judgmental. It's painful being around her because I just have to keep my mouth shut and agree. That's hard for an INTJ to do but it is the only way to keep peace. She has no level of objectivity. Anyone come across this when dealing with an ISFJ? Any help in dealing with her would be appreciated. It's painful for me to be with "SJs".
I can tolerate "SPs" far greater.

I can always remember being very opinionated but I would hardly express my views to others. I understand now how some of my conclusions don't make any sense and I am willing to accept that I am wrong.
Heres a tip:
Try talking to the ISFJ about something that interests her. You may not believe it, but for an ISFJ talking about things that they like can make mentally stimulating them to the point that they can be ecstatic.
This kind of small talk is a good way to earn an ISFJ's acceptance and even their trust. Once you have that, they can consider you their friend in their own minds, and then you get better treatment on your differing opinions.

 

[Maverick]

ISFJ's are flexible, you just need to present your case in a convincing manner. They respond well to "Te" logic. Also, it's a good idea to lighten up the atmosphere by making a joke and cheering them up.

 

[Ivy]

ISFJ's are flexible, you just need to present your case in a convincing manner. They respond well to "Te" logic. Also, it's a good idea to lighten up the atmosphere by making a joke and cheering them up.

Yes. The joke does more than cheer up the ISFJ, though, it reassures them that you appreciate and want to be in harmony with them. It's a social symbol of benevolent intent.

 

[FDG]

Yes. The joke does more than cheer up the ISFJ, though, it reassures them that you appreciate and want to be in harmony with them. It's a social symbol of benevolent intent.

Oh! I never understood it that way.

 

[Ivy]

Yeah, it basically says "we are on good enough terms to joke around together, and I want to get along with you."

 

[Totenkindly]

Yeah, it basically says "we are on good enough terms to joke around together, and I want to get along with you."

Isn't Fe fun?

Just think of yourself as a big beacon, and you are projecting your overall intentions to everyone around you by what you say and do.

So you can tell jokes, not to necessarily be funny, but to break the ice and signal to everyone else that you are open and willing to engage and wanting to have "fun."

(That is the extreme end of it, but that's basically what is going on in a social setting.)

 

[Ivy]

Isn't Fe fun?

Just think of yourself as a big beacon, and you are projecting your overall intentions to everyone around you by what you say and do.

So you can tell jokes, not to necessarily be funny, but to break the ice and signal to everyone else that you are open and willing to engage and wanting to have "fun."

(That is the extreme end of it, but that's basically what is going on in a social setting.)

Yeah, for the most part. I would advise the other poster to be casual about it, though. An NT (J, anyway) making a joke for social purposes sometimes can smack of "I AM MAKING A JOKE FOR SOCIAL PURPOSES NOW." Which just makes an ISFJ wonder what they're being buttered up for. It loses its effect when you can see through it. It's like going behind the curtain at Disney World, or seeing an android's circuitry, or something.

 

[Totenkindly]

Yeah, for the most part. I would advise the other poster to be casual about it, though. An NT (J, anyway) making a joke for social purposes sometimes can smack of "I AM MAKING A JOKE FOR SOCIAL PURPOSES NOW."

LOL -- well, yeah!

(It reminds me of Data on ST:TNG, trying so hard to be "human.")

Still, nuance comes with practice.

 

[Ivy]

And actually, come to think of it, sometimes I can see through my NT husband's attempts to de-ice me with a joke, but it's okay because I can tell he is making an effort.

 

[FDG]

Yeah, for the most part. I would advise the other poster to be casual about it, though. An NT (J, anyway) making a joke for social purposes sometimes can smack of "I AM MAKING A JOKE FOR SOCIAL PURPOSES NOW."

Mmmm. Doesn't the fact that I was surprised by your interpretation of a joke means that it's usually not done (by me, at least) for social purposes?

So you can tell jokes, not to necessarily be funny, but to break the ice and signal to everyone else that you are open and willing to engage and wanting to have "fun."

Uh what?

 

[Shimpei]

posts No 47 and 48

Very very well said!

 

[Ivy]

Mmmm. Doesn't the fact that I was surprised by your interpretation of a joke means that it's usually not done (by me, at least) for social purposes?

Oh yes. I actually flaked on the thread and thought briefly that we were giving advice to Maverick who wanted to know how to better get along with an ISFJ but reading back over it I see that this is not the case.

 

[TaylorS]

My mom's an ISFJ and she is generally fairly flexible as long as you follow two rules:

1. Treat people fairly and with honesty

2. Obey proper social protocol.

3. Keep things clean

She also can be picky about home decor, she's always bothered about the very utilitarian arrangement of the stuff in my apartment.