Trump vs. Biden

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

Project Veritas could face legal liability for postal worker's ballot fraud allegations, experts say | Salon.com

Delightful.

Why? They have Veritas in the name, that means they must be telling the truth.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

A staunch Trump loyalist, McEntee, 30, was welcomed back into the fold in February and installed as personnel director for the entire U.S. government. Since the race was called for President-elect Joe Biden, McEntee has been distributing pink slips, warning federal workers not to cooperate with the Biden transition and threatening to oust people who show disloyalty by job hunting while Trump is still refusing to acknowledge defeat, according to six administration officials.

In Trump’s final days, a 30-year-old aide purges officials seen as insufficiently loyal - Anchorage Daily News

Fuck it.

"I was close to getting Ivanka to marry me."

 

[Jaguar]

Fuck it.

"I was close to getting Ivanka to marry me."

omg, aaaaahahahahahaaaaa.

 

[anticlimatic]

Virologists, epidemiologists, and public health experts are the ones with the answers. Whoever listens to these folks will have a plan that provides the least long-term health problems and deaths and least damage to small businesses and the economy. It is a pandemic, so there will be damage, but intelligent, trained scientists can figure out how to minimize damage. If they have some disagreement, it is a good sign and shows that we need a team or even symposium of scientists to come to consensus. This is the way for humanity to arrive at the best knowable solution to this current crisis.

The only question is if Joe understands who has the expertise because Donald was incapable of this understanding.

Trump was incapable of being a calm and reassuring spokesperson for the federal government's response, and if Biden is an improvement it will primarily be in that superficial (but important) aspect of things. The rest will play out exactly as it has. The feds have to balance virus concerns with economic concerns, with a corral of experts well beyond virologists and epidemiologists, and I don't see that changing under Biden in any significant way. Unless he's an idiot, which I sure hope he is not.

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Unrelated:

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

 

[Galena]

Hey did you guys hear about the MAGA 9,000 Member March today? I wonder if they are still going...

There were some noisy cars with Trump flags on the central street I live near in my city...off and on for like a half hour, then no more.

Fear feeds something to them. To the extent that I can help it, I am withholding it from them and encourage anybody to do the same.

 

[Jonny]

Trump was incapable of being a calm and reassuring spokesperson for the federal government's response, and if Biden is an improvement it will primarily be in that superficial (but important) aspect of things. The rest will play out exactly as it has. The feds have to balance virus concerns with economic concerns, with a corral of experts well beyond virologists and epidemiologists, and I don't see that changing under Biden in any significant way. Unless he's an idiot, which I sure hope he is not.

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Unrelated:

That video is over the top, no? With the exception of 2000, in modern history the media has always called the election and produced countless stories about the (technically presumptive) winner between Election Day and the official certification date. The only thing different about this election is that Trump is refusing to concede and engaging in a war with reality in an attempt to discredit Biden’s win. This isn’t a media conspiracy. It’s par for the course.

What motivated you to post it?

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

Derptubers

 

[anticlimatic]

That video is over the top, no? With the exception of 2000, in modern history the media has always called the election and produced countless stories about the (technically presumptive) winner between Election Day and the official certification date. The only thing different about this election is that Trump is refusing to concede and engaging in a war with reality in an attempt to discredit Biden's win. This isn't a media conspiracy. It's par for the course. What motivated you to post it?

It is a bit over the top, but he's not wrong. The media have called elections, but as far as I know they haven't run the same kind of stories and headlines before one of the parties has officially conceded. If the roles were reversed do you think Anderson Cooper would be calling joe Biden a fat turtle that was flailing around on its back, on national TV while pretending to be an objective journalist, just for waiting for the process to play out? Shitting on the media was my primary motivation, because I don't see a positive future for the country if the mainstream doesn't have any access to data that isn't being bent into a narrative. The media needs to fall, FoxNews included, and something better needs to take its place.

 

[Jonny]

It is a bit over the top, but he's not wrong. The media have called elections, but as far as I know they haven't run the same kind of stories and headlines before one of the parties has officially conceded. If the roles were reversed do you think Anderson Cooper would be calling joe Biden a fat turtle that was flailing around on its back, on national TV while pretending to be an objective journalist, just for waiting for the process to play out? Shitting on the media was my primary motivation, because I don't see a positive future for the country if the mainstream doesn't have any access to data that isn't being bent into a narrative. The media needs to fall, FoxNews included, and something better needs to take its place.

I agree that most of the media has become polarized entertainment, but you act as though what we’re currently going through is a natural, unavoidable part of the process. It isn’t. One of the major candidates is spreading falsehoods and propaganda. It isn’t spin. It isn’t politicking. It’s outright lies and distortion.

A factual reporting of the current issue might not call Donald Trump a fat turtle flailing on his back in the hot sun, but it should tell the American people what he’s saying isn’t backed by evidence and that his efforts will almost certainly not succeed. And to your question, actually I do think the media would be throwing shade if Biden behaved like Trump is behaving. The exact words chosen wouldn’t be the same, but animus would likely be present. Trump is hurting our country with his rhetoric.

 

[anticlimatic]

I agree that most of the media has become polarized entertainment, but you act as though what we're currently going through is a natural, unavoidable part of the process. It isn't. One of the major candidates is spreading falsehoods and propaganda. It isn't spin. It isn't politicking. It's outright lies and distortion. A factual reporting of the current issue might not call Donald Trump a fat turtle flailing on his back in the hot sun, but it should tell the American people what he's saying isn't backed by evidence and that his efforts will almost certainly not succeed. And to your question, actually I do think the media would be throwing shade if Biden behaved like Trump is behaving. The exact words chosen wouldn't be the same, but animus would likely be present. Trump is hurting our country with his rhetoric.

Be that as it may regarding Trump saying dumb crap, this was a very abnormal election on many fronts which produced many anomalies- on top of being being extrmely close- and I don't think there is prescident for this combination. Consequentially, it will take a while to sort out legally/logistically, so the media calling the race as though this election was routine and buisness as usual is ill advised in any objective context that doesn't place ousting Trump in the center of the universe.

 

[Jonny]

Be that as it may regarding Trump saying dumb crap, this was a very abnormal election on many fronts which produced many anomalies- on top of being being extrmely close- and I don't think there is prescident for this combination. Consequentially, it will take a while to sort out legally/logistically, so the media calling the race as though this election was routine and buisness as usual is ill advised in any objective context that doesn't place ousting Trump in the center of the universe.

What anomalies?

 

[anticlimatic]

What anomalies?

Stuff like the strange inaccuracy of bellwether states/counties:

And other odd firsts- like a Democrat president beginning his term (likely) without Senate control for the first time in history.
Down ballot Democrats taking a beating.
Having to create/deal with systems that help mitigate COVID, and verify their legality (which includes the extra days needed to count mail in ballots for states that didn't count them as they came in prior to the Nov 4).

Just lots of weird shit this year, and I'm not saying it means anything other than it provides opportunity/necessity for critical and legal analysis, will take time to do so, and in the meantime it would be better to stick with that process than a "business as usual, except for Orange Hitler" narrative. Because the business is not usual, even if Orange Hitler is saying so. Not everything he says has to be completely contrary to the truth, you know?

 

[Jonny]

Stuff like the strange inaccuracy of bellwether states/counties:

And other odd firsts- like a Democrat president beginning his term (likely) without Senate control for the first time in history.
Down ballot Democrats taking a beating.
Having to create/deal with systems that help mitigate COVID, and verify their legality (which includes the extra days needed to count mail in ballots for states that didn't count them as they came in prior to the Nov 4).

Just lots of weird shit this year, and I'm not saying it means anything other than it provides opportunity/necessity for critical and legal analysis, will take time to do so, and in the meantime it would be better to stick with that process than a "business as usual, except for Orange Hitler" narrative. Because the business is not usual, even if Orange Hitler is saying so. Not everything he says has to be completely contrary to the truth, you know?

There is a difference between bucking past trends and evidence of fraud. I think there’s a pretty clear narrative that fits those “anomalies” but that is beside the point. As others have said, Trump is welcome to pursue legal challenges, but the onus of proof is on him. Absent that proof, Biden has won this election with 306 electoral votes. No amount of claiming victory on Twitter will change that.

You’re essentially arguing that the media should put an asterisk next to the Biden win in a way they have never done before, but nothing you have provided warrants that. The delay in counting due to COVID/mail in ballots did shift the media narrative in an important way—Biden was not projected to win until Saturday. But the other stuff is just interesting statistics.

Ignoring the popular vote, Biden won this election is a very similar fashion to how Trump won the 2016 election—306 electoral votes and a victory in the tipping point state of Wisconsin by 0.5-1.0% margin.

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

Trump is indirectly destroying family/friend/community relationships by continuing to spread his voter fraud narrative. He’s a sore loser. And if you want to compare to the Democrats, protesting his election in 2016 and early 2017 was different. That was more akin to the 8 years of tea baggers protesting Obama. This is also nothing like 2000. At least then, the Gore campaign had a legitimate reason to call for recounts in a very close election. Which Trump also has every right to request, and which has happened. It’s not the recounting that bothers me, it’s the constant pushing of deliberate misinformation to sow division and unrest.

Fuck him. And fuck you if you are too obtuse to see what’s happening for what it is. Fuck you if you take a delight in friends and family being put at one another’s throats because of his refusal to see the reality of the situation

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

Really, the irony of the situation couldn’t be more clear. I’ve never seen a more spoiled, less empathetic group of people than those who laughed at losers of elections in 2016 but are currently crying foul over the 2020 results.

Grow the fuck up, you sound like a Karen.

 

[anticlimatic]

There is a difference between bucking past trends and evidence of fraud. I think there's a pretty clear narrative that fits those "anomalies" but that is beside the point. As others have said, Trump is welcome to pursue legal challenges, but the onus of proof is on him. Absent that proof, Biden has won this election with 306 electoral votes. No amount of claiming victory on Twitter will change that. You're essentially arguing that the media should put an asterisk next to the Biden win in a way they have never done before, but nothing you have provided warrants that. The delay in counting due to COVID/mail in ballots did shift the media narrative in an important way—Biden was not projected to win until Saturday. But the other stuff is just interesting statistics. Ignoring the popular vote, Biden won this election is a very similar fashion to how Trump won the 2016 election—306 electoral votes and a victory in the tipping point state of Wisconsin by 0.5-1.0% margin.

That could very well be, but the fact is that the election process this year was very different from 2016, so the vetting necessary to restore bipartisan faith in the electoral process will be more extensive than then.

I'm not saying that the media should put an asterisk next to Biden's victory, but rather do the universe a favor and commit seppiku- because if you think it's more important to acknowledge the "tradition" of a corrupt and wildly untrustworthy's institution than it is the legal and constitutional process that actually matters, nothing you say can really be trusted.

If you don't see how the things I listed might need to be examined and explained and transparsntly vetted in the courts to guarantee election integrity and faith in the process across all demographics I don't know what to tell you.

 

[Jaguar]

You’re essentially arguing that the media should put an asterisk next to the Biden win in a way they have never done before, but nothing you have provided warrants that. The delay in counting due to COVID/mail in ballots did shift the media narrative in an important way—Biden was not projected to win until Saturday.

And the reason it was not until Saturday is CNN was allowing Pennsylvania election law to guide them. Nothing subjective, whatsoever. L-A-W.

Prior to being called, the margin between the votes for Biden/DT had not pierced .50. Once the margin hit .51 or better, I knew CNN would call it. Why? The law in PA states that an automatic recount would occur if the result is less than or equal to .50. Ergo, you can't call it until you're past that objective point. Furthermore, Biden's pattern with each ballot dump was resulting in a roughly 80-20% split of the votes in Biden's favor throughout heavily Democratic Philadelphia and the surrounding suburbs. Reason would dictate that 80-20% trend would continue. That's exactly what happened. There were people yelling, "Why are the networks not calling PA?" Because they were doing their job, guided by state law. Period.

One of the silliest things I have seen are the people putting out conspiracy theory videos related to the time it took to count votes after the polls closed. Again, there are state laws. And they all differ.

This guide will show anyone just how different the laws in each state are:
When To Expect Election Results In Every State | FiveThirtyEight

As for down-ballot races, many Republicans voted for Biden but still voted for Republicans down-ballot. If you're a smart Republican who gives a shit about your country, you're going to grab a scalpel and cut out the Trump brain tumor at the top of the ballot, but leave the rest of the Republicans in place.

 

[The Cat]

Cant really imagine many AD being on board with Chump's military tactics; tbh It shouldnt surprise people.

 

[Red Herring]

I do agree though that it's important to increase trust in the process. By all means, let them recount.