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2020 Democratic Party primary thread

Julius_Van_Der_Beak

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WASHINGTON, D.C. -- More than nine in 10 Americans say they would vote for a presidential candidate nominated by their party who happened to be black, Catholic, Hispanic, Jewish or a woman. Such willingness drops to eight in 10 for candidates who are evangelical Christians or are gays or lesbians. Between six and seven in 10 would vote for someone who is under 40 years of age, over 70, a Muslim or an atheist.

Just one group tested—socialists—receives majority opposition. Less than half of Americans, 45%, say they would vote for a socialist for president, while 53% say they would not.

Socialism and Atheism Still U.S. Political Liabilities

It's pretty bad that you aren't promoting unity and getting behind the front-runner. That's how Trump won last time.

At least it wasn't a Bloomberg link this time.
 

Virtual ghost

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WASHINGTON, D.C. -- More than nine in 10 Americans say they would vote for a presidential candidate nominated by their party who happened to be black, Catholic, Hispanic, Jewish or a woman. Such willingness drops to eight in 10 for candidates who are evangelical Christians or are gays or lesbians. Between six and seven in 10 would vote for someone who is under 40 years of age, over 70, a Muslim or an atheist.

Just one group tested—socialists—receives majority opposition. Less than half of Americans, 45%, say they would vote for a socialist for president, while 53% say they would not.

Socialism and Atheism Still U.S. Political Liabilities



And the biggest irony is that most of those that wouldn't vote for a socialist will vote for the guy that: attacks journalists, wants to build a copy of iron curtain in North America, disrupts global market for years, is expanding military to record highs, has the highest prison population in the world under his belt (absolute and per capita numbers), is Ok with braking international laws, pretty obviously isn't genuinely religious, has a friendly press conferences with ex KGB spy ... etc.



Plus probably most didn't get my joke from the other day where I linked how socialist party in my part of the world is arresting family members of the opposition leaders that are protesting for certain religious freedoms. What was a reference to the famous "We have to take out their families".
 

Doctor Cringelord

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Regardless of socialism's merits or drawbacks, most americans seem to have a very limited understanding of the ideology, characterized more by ideas of boogeymen and shady government stooges.

Bernie is not a far left European communist. He's a center-left social democrat. Closer to European version of libertarianism than he is to Euro communism of the old soviet union or even to the Yugoslavian Tito style communism. Nothing he's said indicates a desire for a strong authoritarian socialism, rather just an expansion of existing benefits and services. He's the closest thing to a political embodiment of libertarian socialism that we have in the current crop of living politicians. At least as far as elected ones with any major influence goes. To be fair, Bernie may not even be totally accurate in referring to himself as democratic socialist. He's an old school social democrat. Big distinction, as the latter doesn't seek to do away with profit or to make ownership of production and the economy totally public. He's a Rooseveltian, A Keynesian, not a Stalinist or a Maoist.

As much as we'd love for the magical benevolent free market to fix all of the world's ills, I just don't see that as a viable path in this crowded global community. Mixed economy is the best way to go. For that matter, most American Republicans and Democrats could be said to be a little socialist, as most of them don't mind publicly funded, publicly owned infrastructures and services. Even many of the staunchest conservatives here don't have a problem sending their kids off to public schools, or benefitting from government health care if they're military veterans.

The antipathy to socialism is understandable, but people need to understand exactly what it is they're opposed to. No need to throw the baby out with the bathwater out of irrational fear based in ignorance.

In a nation where we've demanded a lot of service and sacrifice from the public in multiple wars over the last century+, it's only logical we repay the sacrifices largely made by the working and middle classes. That hasn't really happened. Time to pay up.
 

ceecee

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In a nation where we've demanded a lot of service and sacrifice from the public in multiple wars over the last century+, it's only logical we repay the sacrifices largely made by the working and middle classes. That hasn't really happened. Time to pay up.

This.
 

Jaguar

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At least it wasn't a Bloomberg link this time.

Bloomberg's network is well-known for its global market news. I wouldn't want a cable provider who didn't include the network in its channel lineup.
Bloomberg TV

And the biggest irony is that most of those that wouldn't vote for a socialist will vote for the guy that: attacks journalists, wants to build a copy of iron curtain in North America, disrupts global market for years, is expanding military to record highs, has the highest prison population in the world under his belt (absolute and per capita numbers), is Ok with braking international laws, pretty obviously isn't genuinely religious, has a friendly press conferences with ex KGB spy ... etc.

Plus probably most didn't get my joke from the other day where I linked how socialist party in my part of the world is arresting family members of the opposition leaders that are protesting for certain religious freedoms. What was a reference to the famous "We have to take out their families".

Thank you for replying to the actual content of my post. Julius is incapable of it, apparently. Just because person X isn't interested in voting for a socialist or a democratic socialist doesn't mean person X will automatically vote for DT.

Fully 12 percent of people who voted for Sen. Bernie Sanders, I-Vt., in the 2016 Democratic presidential primaries voted for President Trump in the general election. That is according to the data from the Cooperative Congressional Election Study — a massive election survey of around 50,000 people. Party seems to have had something to do with it — Sanders-Trump voters were much less likely than Sanders-Clinton or Sanders-third party voters to have been Democrats.

1 In 10 Bernie Sanders Supporters Ended Up Voting For Trump : NPR
 

Julius_Van_Der_Beak

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Bloomberg's network is well-known for its global market news. I wouldn't want a cable provider who didn't include the network in its channel lineup.
Bloomberg TV

Oh, speaking of Bloomberg, Richard Spencer is evidently a huge fan.
Richard Spencer loves Mike Bloomberg

Richard Spencer said:
While Trump brags about releasing minority criminals, Mike has a record of locking them up. Bloomberg’s entire reason for running is to maintain the status quo, another one of your expressed desires.

Seriously, why not Mike?
 

Doctor Cringelord

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I won't vote for a socialist, but that doesn't mean I would ever vote for DT.

That's good, because there aren't any socialists running for major party nominations this year. There is one social democrat running. So you're OK if Bernie is nominated. No one's bringing about the Mao cultural revolution or murdering white Russian families in 2021. Bernie's not going to seize your Porsche or prevent you from taking a 4th vacation next year. I'm sorry you might see your taxes increase, but I'm sure you'll be just fine.
 

Doctor Cringelord

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Spencer is a fraud, he's probably just butthurt because one of his Asian American ex griflriends cheated on him once in college.

Like how the only reason Lauren Southern even became a journalist for the right was because some arab-canadian guy broke her heart back in college (not lying, there's college pics of her floating around on the web to confirm this)

some redditor who claims they went to school with Southern said:
"Lauren was by all means a normal, dumb, white girl. She is now a racist, dumb, white girl. She had a reputation for being a bit weird, very insecure, attention seeking, and "easy." So basically she dated a bunch of brown guys. One dumped her because he upgraded to a hot Middle-Eastern girl, and also because he discovered about Lauren's reputation. Lauren got super attached to the second guy but he ended up dumping her because she was batshit crazy (and also ended up dating a rich brown girl). She didn't take the break-up well and turned into a mess. She dropped out of uni (read: dumb, white, girl) and did the whole anti-SJW thing at the slut walk for attention. I'm not surprised she embraced the whole white nationalism thing because she was burned very badly by the brown guys she dated. Not at all surprised that she specifically screeches against brown immigrants/Muslims, although that's also equally because of current events and their recent prominence."

I know someone who went to school with Lauren Southern *SUACEYYY* : Drama
 

Jaguar

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there aren't any socialists running for major party nominations this year.

I can always count on you to post something already known. For people who like to waste time typing out more words, add the word 'democratic' to the word 'socialist' in order to prevent Powell or a Bernie Bro from having a tantrum.
 

Julius_Van_Der_Beak

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Spencer is a fraud, he's probably just butthurt because one of his Asian American ex griflriends cheated on him once in college.

Like how the only reason Lauren Southern even became a journalist for the right was because some arab-canadian guy broke her heart back in college (not lying, there's college pics of her floating around on the web to confirm this)

Wouldn't surprise me.
 

Virtual ghost

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Thank you for replying to the actual content of my post. Julius is incapable of it, apparently. Just because person X isn't interested in voting for a socialist or a democratic socialist doesn't mean person X will automatically vote for DT.

Fully 12 percent of people who voted for Sen. Bernie Sanders, I-Vt., in the 2016 Democratic presidential primaries voted for President Trump in the general election. That is according to the data from the Cooperative Congressional Election Study — a massive election survey of around 50,000 people. Party seems to have had something to do with it — Sanders-Trump voters were much less likely than Sanders-Clinton or Sanders-third party voters to have been Democrats.

1 In 10 Bernie Sanders Supporters Ended Up Voting For Trump : NPR


As I told you before: give your people decent mainstream politicians that wouldn't shit on people or protect those who do that and I can promise you that both Trump and Bernie will go away. Probably even pretty quickly since they are the symptoms, not the core of the problem. However "Decent mainstream politicians that wouldn't shit on people or protect those who do" are in short supply and now you have what you have. In a way it is surprising that no one from the establishment came out in front of people and made a concrete promises and a pact with them, so that this entire populist era can come to an end. People tend to vote radical when the get they impression that no one is listening.
 

Doctor Cringelord

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I can always count on you to post something already known. For people who like to waste time typing out more words, add the word 'democratic' to the word 'socialist' in order to prevent Powell or a Bernie Bro from having a tantrum.

I'm not sure why you took what I wrote as a tantrum? Just goes to show how easy it can be to misinterpret tone and message on the internet.

Anyway, I was clarifying a very clear distinction between democratic socialist and social democrat/new deal democrat. Since you keep making comments about socialists running for president and how you'll never vote socialist, it seemed like you didn't understand the distinction. Why would Jag feel a need to keep expressing these sentiments if he knows there's no socialist running in any major party primaries?

I didn't realize clarifying distinctions was equivalent to having a tantrum. I will remember this the next time you clarify something.
 

Virtual ghost

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Regardless of socialism's merits or drawbacks, most americans seem to have a very limited understanding of the ideology, characterized more by ideas of boogeymen and shady government stooges.

Bernie is not a far left European communist. He's a center-left social democrat. Closer to European version of libertarianism than he is to Euro communism of the old soviet union or even to the Yugoslavian Tito style communism. Nothing he's said indicates a desire for a strong authoritarian socialism, rather just an expansion of existing benefits and services. He's the closest thing to a political embodiment of libertarian socialism that we have in the current crop of living politicians. At least as far as elected ones with any major influence goes. To be fair, Bernie may not even be totally accurate in referring to himself as democratic socialist. He's an old school social democrat. Big distinction, as the latter doesn't seek to do away with profit or to make ownership of production and the economy totally public. He's a Rooseveltian, A Keynesian, not a Stalinist or a Maoist.

As much as we'd love for the magical benevolent free market to fix all of the world's ills, I just don't see that as a viable path in this crowded global community. Mixed economy is the best way to go. For that matter, most American Republicans and Democrats could be said to be a little socialist, as most of them don't mind publicly funded, publicly owned infrastructures and services. Even many of the staunchest conservatives here don't have a problem sending their kids off to public schools, or benefitting from government health care if they're military veterans.

The antipathy to socialism is understandable, but people need to understand exactly what it is they're opposed to. No need to throw the baby out with the bathwater out of irrational fear based in ignorance.

In a nation where we've demanded a lot of service and sacrifice from the public in multiple wars over the last century+, it's only logical we repay the sacrifices largely made by the working and middle classes. That hasn't really happened. Time to pay up.


Among "online tests" sub-forum there is political test that in my mind hits very well certain issues.





It opposes the left-liberals to communists. What is logical because in human rights and personal prosperity those two have quite a number of differences from Communism. Which actually towards this map is basically a relative of fascism. What altogether is something that I can accept as realistic definition/map.
 

Doctor Cringelord

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Among "online tests" sub-forum there is political test that in my mind hits very well certain issues.





It opposes the left-liberals to communists. What is logical because in human rights and personal prosperity those two have quite a number of differences from Communism. Which actually towards this map is basically a relative of fascism. What altogether is something that I can accept as realistic definition/map.

Yes, the authoritarian-libertarian scale also does a better job than the traditional left to right scale of measuring the differences between authoritarian left and libertarian left, though I find it an over simplistic scale
 
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