2020 Democratic Party primary thread

[Totenkindly]

Bets on Biden Buttigieg being the eventual ticket we get?

I wouldn't be surprised, I'll say that much.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

Bets on Biden Buttigieg being the eventual ticket we get?

It would be a lot smarter to do something like Biden-Warren (or heaven forbid Biden-Sanders), but since this is Biden we're talking about, that won't happen. Biden's going to chase after the endangered moderate Republican (worked swimmingly well for Kerry and Clinton!). In reality, there's probably only like 100 of them and they all live in New York or California.

The truth is that anybody who is still considering voting for Trump is not going to change their mind just because he came out against legalization or his defense of health insurance companies.

The game isn't won by winning over "independendents" but by getting the base to turn out. Republicans don't try to win over "independents" and they still win all the time. Apart from gerrymandering, voter suppression, and the electoral college, why do you think that is?

 

[Jaguar]

”Whomever I would pick were I fortunate enough to be your nominee, I’d pick somebody who was simpatico with me, who knew what my priorities were and knew what I wanted to do," Biden said. “We could disagree on tactics but strategically we’d have to be on the exact same page.”

Forget Warren and Bernie.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

”Whomever I would pick were I fortunate enough to be your nominee, I’d pick somebody who was simpatico with me, who knew what my priorities were and knew what I wanted to do," Biden said. “We could disagree on tactics but strategically we’d have to be on the exact same page.”

Forget Warren and Bernie.

I'm just accepting the inevitability of Trump's re-election at this point. Biden's (like Hillary before him) entire political strategic framework is based upon faulty assumptions.

 

[Jaguar]

Biden's entire political strategic framework is based upon faulty assumptions.

Well, shit. You'd think you'd support someone who has so much in common with you.

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

It would be a lot smarter to do something like Biden-Warren (or heaven forbid Biden-Sanders), but since this is Biden we're talking about, that won't happen. Biden's going to chase after the endangered moderate Republican (worked swimmingly well for Kerry and Clinton!). In reality, there's probably only like 100 of them and they all live in New York or California.

The truth is that anybody who is still considering voting for Trump is not going to change their mind just because he came out against legalization or his defense of health insurance companies.

The game isn't won by winning over "independendents" but by getting the base to turn out. Republicans don't try to win over "independents" and they still win all the time. Apart from gerrymandering, voter suppression, and the electoral college, why do you think that is?

Buttigieg is more popular than I'd have expected with some republicans or at least with whitebread anglo centrists though. I think they like him because by now most of them have had to deal with some black sheep member of their family coming out of the closet, or have had a gay hairdresser do their white lady church hair, then realizing that not all gay people are Mr. Slave from South Park, because they saw their cousin Dave who happened to like dick was otherwise an upstanding member of the church and volunteered at the soup kitchen in the nearest black ghetto that the church goes to to help out and assuage their white guilt. Even if gay, he still ticks off enough of the other boxes they like, i.e. white, well-mannered dude from the Midwest who speaks a cultural language they can still understand. The dude's a boy scout, centrist or center right independent white women voters are gunna eat that shit up.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

Buttigieg is more popular than I'd have expected with some republicans or at least with whitebread anglo centrists though. I think they like him because by now most of them had to deal with some black sheep member of their family coming out of the closet, then realizing that not all gay people are Mr. Slave from South Park. He still ticks off enough of the other boxes they like, i.e. white, well-mannered dude from the Midwest who speaks a cultural language they can understand.

If we have to go with some uber centrist type, I'd prefer he win. I have a friend who is a huge supporter, and while I can't get excited about him personally, I think he has a few benefits and advantages Biden doesn't have. His youth is actually one of those positive assets; he doesn't have a long record that looks really terrible when examined in the light of the modern day. That kind of thing is likely to hurt Biden on all fronts.... more right-leaning people will see it as wishy-washy and hypocritical, and more left-leaning people will see it as proof that he can't be trusted to enact the kind of policy they want (hence, depressing turnout). Buttigieg can act as more of a "blank slate" like Obama (who was also rather young, if not that young), so that people can project (in a positive sense) whatever they want on to him. Buittgieg could maybe pull off an Obama-style victory; while Biden likes to think he could do the same thing, I don't see it happening (for him to have a shot Trump's reputation would have to be as bad as Dubya's at the end of the second term; it's not there yet).

By contrast, most progressive people who don't see the Democratic party as the gold standard for progressive politics already know Biden kind of sucks. Unfortunately, media, especially cable news, is pushing a narrative that he's "electable" so that might be enough for him to win the nomination regardless of that. They'll see it as doing the safe thing to "stop Trump."

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

If we have to go with some uber centrist type, I'd prefer he win. I have a friend who is a huge supporter, and while I can't get excited about him personally, I think he has a few benefits and advantages Biden doesn't have. His youth is actually one of those positive assets; he doesn't have a long record that looks really terrible when examined in the light of the modern day. That kind of thing is likely to hurt Biden on all fronts.... more right-leaning people will see it as wishy-washy and hypocritical, and more left-leaning people will see it as proof that he can't be trusted to enact the kind of policy they want (hence, depressing turnout). Buttigieg can act as more of a "blank slate" like Obama (who was also rather young, if not that young), so that people can project (in a positive sense) whatever they want on to him. Buittgieg could maybe pull off an Obama-style victory; while Biden likes to think he could do the same thing, I don't see it happening (for him to have a shot Trump's reputation would have to be as bad as Dubya's at the end of the second term; it's not there yet).

By contrast, most progressive people who don't see the Democratic party as the gold standard for progressive politics already know Biden kind of sucks. Unfortunately, media, especially cable news, is pushing a narrative that he's "electable" so that might be enough for him to win the nomination regardless of that. They'll see it as doing the safe thing to "stop Trump."

Agreed.

What Pete needs to do is start studying up on foreign policy so he at least sounds like he knows what he's talking about when the inevitable attacks and questions about his inexperience occur. If nominated he needs to surround himself with older, experienced advisors and choose a VP nominee with some foreign policy experience. I imagine he's going to follow a lot of Obama's 2008 playbook if nominated, since Obama also had to deal with the constant questions of inexperience.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

Clinton needs to go away.


Sanders reacts to Clinton's attack

You didn't have Al Gore showing up like that and whining about how it's the Supreme Court's fault he lost in 2004. At least, I don't remember that.

When asked why he thinks Clinton is still talking about the 2016 presidential election, Sanders said, “That’s a good question. You should ask her.”

LOL.

 

[Tellenbach]

Bernie's convinced me to vote for him. Since Trump's nomination is a foregone conclusion, why shouldn't we Republicans have a little fun and help Bernie cross the finish line. I'm urging all Republicans and Trump supporters to vote for Bernie in the primaries.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

Bernie's convinced me to vote for him. Since Trump's nomination is a foregone conclusion, why shouldn't we Republicans have a little fun and help Bernie cross the finish line. I'm urging all Republicans and Trump supporters to vote for Bernie in the primaries.

Uh, don't you remember when liberals were overjoyed when Trump won the nomination because they thought he couldn't win? Not that I mind if you vote for him, it just may not have the effect you intend.

 

[Tellenbach]

Uh, don't you remember when liberals were overjoyed when Trump won the nomination because they thought he couldn't win? Not that I mind if you vote for him, it just may not have the effect you intend.

I knew Trump had massive appeal. I've said several times back in 2015 that Trump would either flame out like Ebola or spread like the plague. I was right.

Bernie's numbers are terrible with seniors; they still think of Communists and socialists as the "enemy". Union members also hate his guts because he wants to take away their health insurance. I think all the candidates are lousy but Biden scares me a little because he has support in swing states like Michigan.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

I knew Trump had massive appeal. I've said several times back in 2015 that Trump would either flame out like Ebola or spread like the plague. I was right.

Bernie's numbers are terrible with seniors; they still think of Communists and socialists as the "enemy". Union members also hate his guts because he wants to take away their health insurance. I think all the candidates are lousy but Biden scares me a little because he has support in swing states like Michigan.

Seniors usually vote Republican anyway.

 

[Tellenbach]

Seniors usually vote Republican anyway.

I was talking about Democrat seniors; CNN did a breakdown of the strengths and weaknesses of the various candidates about a month ago. Seniors represent 50% of the Democrat base and only 10% (if I remember correctly) of Democrat seniors support Bernie. Go Bernie!!

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

I was talking about Democrat seniors; CNN did a breakdown of the strengths and weaknesses of the various candidates about a month ago. Seniors represent 50% of the Democrat base and only 10% (if I remember correctly) of Democrat seniors support Bernie. Go Bernie!!

Did they say if they would vote for Trump if Bernie won?

Edit: Hmmm... according to the polls here:

Sanders has a 4 point advantage over Biden in Florida, and only a 1 point disadvantage in Michigan. But if you want to, sure, back Bernie. Again, I don't mind.

Also, it has him beating Trump during the general election by 1% point.

 

[Tellenbach]

Hillary had about a 3 million vote count advantage over Bernie in 2016. I doubt Biden wins by that much. Basically, all we need are 2.5 million Republican voters to vote for Bernie in the primaries and he'll be the winner.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

Hillary had about a 3 million vote count advantage over Bernie in 2016. I doubt Biden wins by that much. Basically, all we need are 2.5 million Republican voters to vote for Bernie in the primaries and he'll be the winner.

Please do.

 

[ceecee]

I knew Trump had massive appeal. I've said several times back in 2015 that Trump would either flame out like Ebola or spread like the plague. I was right.

Bernie's numbers are terrible with seniors; they still think of Communists and socialists as the "enemy". Union members also hate his guts because he wants to take away their health insurance. I think all the candidates are lousy but Biden scares me a little because he has support in swing states like Michigan.

The stupidest thing GM did was show that union members can lost their health care (they didn't actually but the press was bad) via their employers stripping it from them. A perfect example of why you don't tether health care to your job. Which was exactly what Bernie said would happen. M4A will put more wages on the table for union members, that's a fact. You shouldn't listen to Joe Biden or Trump, both said the same things about unions and health care. But it's understandable.

Below are the current list of unions that hate Bernie (but are endorsing him anyway).

National
NNU – National Nurses United, representing 150,000[238]
NUHW – National Union of Healthcare Workers, representing 15,000[239] (co-endorsement with Elizabeth Warren)
UE – United Electrical, Radio and Machine Workers of America, representing 35,900[240][241]
State, regional, and local divisions
APWU – American Postal Workers Union: New Hampshire (NH)[242][243]; Local 44 (IA)[244]
BIDG – The Boston Independent Drivers Guild (MA)[245]
CCEA – Clark County Educational Association, representing 19,000 (NV)[246]
CWA – Communications Workers of America: Local 9119 (CA), representing 17,000[247]
IBEW – International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers: Local 1634 (IA)[243][248]
IBT – International Brotherhood of Teamsters: Pennsylvania Federation Brotherhood of Maintenance of Way Employes Division (PA)[249]
SEIU – Service Employees International Union: Local 1984, representing 10,000 (NH)[250]
UFCW – United Food and Commercial Workers International Union: Local 230 (IA)[251]
UTLA – United Teachers Los Angeles, representing 35,000 (CA)[252]
UURWAW – United Union of Roofers, Waterproofers and Allied Workers: Local 36 (CA)[249]

 

[Maou]

I don't knoe how anyone can support Sanders after his team threatened to send all conservatives to concentration camps.

Sanders Campaign Organizer: Free Education, Gulags Needed To "Re-Educate" You To Not Be A "F*cking Nazi" | Video | RealClearPolitics

 

[ceecee]

I don't knoe how anyone can support Sanders after his team threatened to send all conservatives to concentration camps.

Sanders Campaign Organizer: Free Education, Gulags Needed To "Re-Educate" You To Not Be A "F*cking Nazi" | Video | RealClearPolitics

The Jame O'Keefe tweet? Although I do think it's funny that you fake news! or it's a joke! when it comes to Trump and the stories his minions post but this - OMG TRUE!

Is James O’Keefe Good Now? | The New Republic

O’Keefe is treated as a clown by self-respecting journalists for good reason. He built his career on manipulative videos that fed into fantastical right-wing narratives, particularly surrounding race and abortion. These videos would then be posted online—Andrew Breitbart was an early booster—fueling right-wing outrage for weeks.