Gender

[fetus]

I'm vehemently in favor of everyone's gender identity. I understand that gender is not as black-and-white as society makes it out to be, and that it can be a complicated thing. Please don't get me wrong there!

Now. I found this gender masterlist somewhere. This is a very long list, and some seem a bit...outlandish. Such as this one:

"Colorgender: a gender associated with one or more colors and the feelings, hues, emotions, and/or objects associated with that color; may be used like pinkgender, bluegender, yellowgender."

Do you really think there are this many genders? I'm a cis girl still trying to get acquainted with all this gender stuff. Can anyone who identifies with any of these lesser-known genders (colorgender, existigender, etc.) explain what exactly they are or how they are experienced? I am really trying to be open-minded.

Here's the list.

P.S. I didn't know what subforum to put this thread in.

 

[á´…eparted]

Be who you want. I won't judge someone based of their gender identification. Nor should anyone else.

However, if it comes along with special snowflakeism and the like, then yes I will judge you, and probably tell you to shove it if I am forced to associate. One of the most poingent examples would be other-kin. No honey, you do not have the soul of a dragon, what you need is a nice talking to and a nice cup of reality and humility juice.

 

[ceecee]

Yeah, be who you want or whatever gender you want to be. If you're a douchebag then, you'll just be a Caelgender: a gender which shares qualities with outer space or has the aesthetic of space, stars, nebulas, etc. douchebag.

 

[fetus]

Be who you want. I won't judge someone based of their gender identification. Nor should anyone else.

However, if it comes along with special snowflakeism and the like, then yes I will judge you, and probably tell you to shove it if I am forced to associate. One of the most poingent examples would be other-kin. No honey, you do not have the soul of a dragon, what you need is a nice talking to and a nice cup of reality and humility juice.

Yeah I agree. Be who you want. I think what I'm getting at is, do people get too attached to labels for very, very specific things?

 

[á´…eparted]

Yeah I agree. Be who you want. I think what I'm getting at is, do people get too attached to labels for very, very specific things?

Of course. It happens all the time in all kinds of places. Humans like to put themselves in boxes for a variety of purposes. Usually to belong, or to assert onesself as an individual.

 

[Magic Poriferan]

Not to be a spoil sport, but I find master lists like this pointless, and their ever changing and dynamic content only underlines the silliness of gender categories.

Gender is not real beyond being an abstract social construct. This list is potentially infinite. Its actual utility is questionable.

Are all genders valid, or Is it really that no gender is valid?
Are two genders simply not enough, or are two genders actually too many?

 

[á´…eparted]

Not to be a spoil sport, but I find master lists like this pointless, and their ever changing and dynamic content only underlines the silliness of gender categories.

Gender is not real beyond being an abstract social construct. This list is potentially infinite. Its actual utility is questionable.

Are all genders valid, or Is it really that no gender is valid?
Are two genders simply not enough, or are two genders actually too many?

I don't agree with the notion of eliminating the concept of gender all together. As I see it, it seems more like a statement of "you aren't allowed to be any gender", and misses the point completely that it strives for. People will always put themselves in boxes, and forcing change to prevent that won't stop it. Because of this, I disagree with those that assert no gender is valid. Social construct are not inheriently evil, and as humans we'll never rid ourselves of them, and it's foolish to try to do so. What we can and should do instead, is strive to make those fair.

This then leads to saying all genders are valid, which is really a subset of saying all identities are valid. However, it doesn't make all of them real. Most are though. Can people pretend? Sure, no harm no foul, be who you want. However, if something isn't real, then it's hard to take it seriously in the way of rights and benefits specific to that.

Personally, I don't even look at lists like that, I just go about my business and meet new people. If they say they are cis, trans, agender, or something in between or whatever, ok cool. It would all serve us better to try and look at the person BEFORE putting them in a box. Putting in a box first causes problems, and it's the big root of gender issues in the modern era.

 

[Forever]

I kind of want my gender to be related to how a New Yorker orders coffee from a coffee shop/Starbucks.

That'd be a cool gender yeah. 2 pumps, extra whip extra shot. drizzled, skim, add sugar, some cream, etc.

Then to have a really long name as the order.

 

[Galaxy Gazer]

"Antegender: a protean gender which has the potential to be anything, but is formless and motionless, and therefore, does not manifest as any particular gender"

formless and motionless

"(POSSIBLE TRIGGER WARNING) Autigender: a gender that can only be understood in the context of being autistic"

Is ADHD a gender too? What about bipolar disorder?

"Caelgender: a gender which shares qualities with outer space or has the aesthetic of space, stars, nebulas, etc."

I can make a star my gender? Cool!

"Espigender: a gender that is related to being a spirit or exists on a higher or extradimensional plane"

And I can be a spiritual entity.

Come on, this is silly. These made-up gender identities are just promoting gender stereotypes. Sometimes I feel like going shopping and doing my nails and sometimes I feel like playing COD with my guy friends, but that doesn't make me "genderfluid" or any of these other ridiculous words.

IMO, gender is mostly associated with biological sex. If you really feel like you're the opposite gender, you might be transgender. Anything beyond that isn't necessary.

The color thing is cool, though. I like to associate my phases and alter egos with colors (ie. pink is my sweet and quiet side, black is my spontaneous and badass side, red is my outspoken side, etc.) but I don't really see how that could relate to gender.

 

[Yama]

Nonbinary genders are not ridiculous. My agender friend's (lack of) gender is very real and should not be invalidated. They don't identify with any gender and I don't see how that's ridiculous or silly.

Gender is also very separate from biological sex (though for ~90% of the population they are the same), which in turn is very different from romantic and sexual attraction. (As in, you can be trans and gay, or trans and straight, just as you can be cis and gay, cis and straight, etc).

 

[Forever]

I think there should just be biological sex. Male or female.

There shouldn't even be the word gender in the dictionary.

Do you have a penis or a vagina?

Great.

Let the person be. No strings attached.

I think the list of names in my opinion is ridiculous.

 

[Pionart]

lol waaaaaaaaaaaaaaat is this exactly even??

is it legit, or pointing out the arbitrariness of gender in the first place?

I thought gender was about the biological wiring of your brain, the idea being that males and females inherently use their brains in different ways, but sometimes there's a strange occurrence where the brain and body don't line up.

 

[Yama]

I think there should just be biological sex. Male or female.

There shouldn't even be the word gender in the dictionary.

Do you have a penis or a vagina?

Great.

Let the person be. No strings attached.

I think the list of names in my opinion is ridiculous.

But what if I don't like being called by my biological sex? To me anyway, "letting me be" means letting me identify in a way that makes me most comfortable with who I am so I don't have to experience gender dysphoria.

I haven't heard of most of the things on that list. Really the only nonbinary genders I've heard of before are agender, bigender, genderfluid, but I'm sure more probably exist that I'm forgetting. I do think some of the ones on that list are ridiculous but I'm also not well-informed enough to tell them if they're valid or not. I certainly wouldn't want anyone telling me that I'm not valid.

Basically, I like that gender is separate from sex, because I don't agree with my sex. I don't wanna live a miserable life just to simplify things for others to make them comfortable at my expense, y'know?

 

[Forever]

But what if I don't like being called by my biological sex? To me anyway, "letting me be" means letting me identify in a way that makes me most comfortable with who I am so I don't have to experience gender dysphoria.

I haven't heard of most of the things on that list. Really the only nonbinary genders I've heard of before are agender, bigender, genderfluid, but I'm sure more probably exist that I'm forgetting. I do think some of the ones on that list are ridiculous but I'm also not well-informed enough to tell them if they're valid or not. I certainly wouldn't want anyone telling me that I'm not valid.

Basically, I like that gender is separate from sex, because I don't agree with my sex. I don't wanna live a miserable life just to simplify things for others to make them comfortable at my expense, y'know?

Well sex is purely physical inherently there is no personality meaning or anything to conform to. Just pretty much medical.

If you really feel that you should match the aesthetics of a male then yeah you're a transsexual but does the meaning change? No.

Every human being is special.

 

[Yama]

Well sex is purely physical inherently there is no personality meaning or anything to conform to. Just pretty much medical.

Yes. Sex is the biological component, based on chromosomes, hormone levels, sex characteristics etc. But if we took "gender" out of the dictionary I'd have to call myself something that I don't feel like, so I don't like the idea of "taking it out." Filling out your biological sex on a medical form is one thing--but being called by certain pronouns and living your daily life as a certain gender is another.

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If you really feel that you should match the aesthetics of a male then yeah you're a transsexual but does the meaning change? No.

Every human being is special.

What does "the meaning" mean?

 

[Yama]

I read in the book my therapist lent me today that only 20% of MTF transgender fully transition, and only 3-5% of FTM. This is mostly because of the high monetary cost since transitioning is not covered by insurance, but also because some transgendered individuals don't feel the need to fully physically transition. They have gender dysphoria, but not body dysphoria. In my case, I have mild body dysphoria as well as gender dysphoria.

 

[Forever]

Yes. Sex is the biological component, based on chromosomes, hormone levels, sex characteristics etc. But if we took "gender" out of the dictionary I'd have to call myself something that I don't feel like, so I don't like the idea of "taking it out." Filling out your biological sex on a medical form is one thing--but being called by certain pronouns and living your daily life as a certain gender is another.

- - - Updated - - -



What does "the meaning" mean?

Well individual meaning. You are 21lux. You are only 21lux. He and she would really mean nothing if the social implications were taken out and if you were a transsexual than yeah you'd go to the one you would like to be called. And those who think outside of the 2 wouldn't really care because everyone is born with the genitalia. It's just like blue vs red , it's just a color difference and taste.

Maybe the rare hermaphrodites just pick one and can say they are one and because it is all physical. People are like cool.

Because once you put a definition into your humanism. You create stereotypes and limited meaning.

 

[Luke O]

"1,000 years from now there will be no guys and no girls, just wankers. Sounds great to me."

From Trainspotting - BTW I want to watch Trainspotting now.

 

[Forever]

People are afraid of what they don't understand.

 

[Yama]

Well individual meaning. You are 21lux. You are only 21lux. He and she would really mean nothing if the social implications were taken out and if you were a transsexual than yeah you'd go to the one you would like to be called. And those who think outside of the 2 wouldn't really care because everyone is born with the genitalia. It's just like blue vs red , it's just a color difference and taste.

Maybe the rare hermaphrodites just pick one and can say they are one and because it is all physical. People are like cool.

My agender friend likes to go by "they." Unfortunately they cannot avoid being visually gendered because people will always see others as being either male or female, despite the fact that if they had any control over it, my friend would like to not be gendered at all. Yes, they're born with one set of genitals or the other, but they don't like being socially defined as either category.

Yes, I am 21lux. And being transgender is a huge part of that identity. It's a huge part of what makes me 21lux. For those who are cis it might not be as important, but for me it is, because of all of the confusion and fighting I have had to do, and continue to have to do, just to feel comfortable with myself in my own body. Part of gender is biological, and part of it is a social construct--nature and nurture both play a part in all of us.

Due to the world and society we live in, people are gendered. People are labelled as "he" and "she." Unfortunately, it is too idealistic to think that this is going to change anytime soon, if ever. I doubt we can ever eliminate gender and see everyone as androgynous. So for all that it's worth, being able to use male pronouns and be seen as a guy is very important to me and it is a part of my core self, part of what makes me the one and only 21lux. I want others to see me this way and refer to me this way, too.

Intersexed people vary regarding gender identity. A lot of children are born with ambiguous genitalia and nowadays parents are usually informed, but 40, 50 years ago? No one was. The doctors would use different standards of measurement to determine whether the genitalia was a "micropenis" or an "offensively large clitoris" (those are the medical terms) and perform surgery (almost ALWAYS without telling the parents and getting consent, up until recently) to make the child's sex more "socially appropriate." And many of these children would grow up feeling wrong or confused, and then one day go to a doctor and find out, "oh my god, I was born like that, that explains so much and I've always felt this way but didn't understand why and now I know!"

Individual meaning is part of it, but my social identity and being seen the way I want to be seen is a part of that too.

People are afraid of what they don't understand.

Very, very true.