[ENTJ] ENTJ: A Jungian Cognitive Function Analysis By SimulatedWorld

[yeghor]

This isn't possible.

Why not?

 

[FDG]

Wouldn't you want to learn from them?

If I'm in a classroom or in a position where I have to *learn* from them, sure. But if they just have authority over me and we are of more or less equal competence, doesn't work well.

 

[JocktheMotie]

I've experienced that and it's not really good for my psyche. I am forced to give up control and repress my natural tendencies which can make me snappy and depressed. Eventually one of the two ends the relationship.

I don't know why you'd care so much. I'd find it amusing and want to see how it would play out.

 

[FDG]

I don't know why you'd care so much.

Oh, I don't know either. It just happens to be so, somewhat like breathing.

 

[yeghor]

If I'm in a classroom or in a position where I have to *learn* from them, sure. But if they just have authority over me and we are of more or less equal competence, doesn't work well.

My friend seems to brush off my insights too easily, some of which turn out to be true on the long term... And I don't want to tell him "I said so.." cause it defeats the purpose...

Sometimes I take time to put together my insights into a comprehensive form in writing and send it to him... But he appears to not be affected by them...as if he doesn't change his views..

Do you think he might be recognizing them by himself but not telling me? Sometimes I feel that he's not giving me enough due credit (not externally but internally)...

And he also sometimes goes into this some kind of "energy hunting" mode where he becomes lively\chatty and somehow feeds on the attention he gets from others...it feels as if it has some kind of ritualistic importance to him cause he acts irritated if he's disrupted at those times... does that sound familiar to you?

There's another mode of his that he verbally challenges\taunts people around him to challenge him or somehow remain silent to acknowledge his superiority...it feels as if he's feeding on that... Are they Te-checks?

The thing is that in doing that it feels to me as if he is somehow forcing\blackmailing people into showing him admiration cause if he doesn't get it, he either withdraws himself and his skills for a while (to punish them?) or tries to make those people feel bad somehow... so he's trying to strongarm them to show him admiration... That's how it looks to me... I think he does these when he's insecure or somehow low in energy so as to feel good\powerful again...

One day he said that a manager would never be happy with one of his subordinates being smarter\more skillful than himself\herself... and added that luckily he didn't have any reason to be unhappy...among his coworkers!

All these feel like some kind of a reflex to me...

I just want to have you guys opinions on all these, if you will...

 

[yeghor]

And would you care to post clips from movies that demonstrate the ENTJ type...?

 

[Evo]

I think the college persona is his true\core self and the aggressive one is his protective persona that he uses to interact with the outside world...

Anyway I was wondering if he could be an ENTJ...???

Well I don't know if your friend is an ENTJ. But I will say that I have been doing the opposite in life. I have always been a responsible hardass... even when I was really very young. And now in my late 20's I'm becoming less aggressive. I think that my aggressiveness has always been what others have seen, and still do see (I'm way more aggressive than everyone I know, even when I'm toning it down...) But my core is inferior Fi. So on the inside I'm kind of a mush.

I do get irritated when others don't take their guard down though. That's why when I see old friends that I haven't talked to in a while, I just act like nothings changed, so that we can pick up where we left off.

 

[yeghor]

Well I don't know if your friend is an ENTJ. But I will say that I have been doing the opposite in life. I have always been a responsible hardass... even when I was really very young. And now in my late 20's I'm becoming less aggressive. I think that my aggressiveness has always been what others have seen, and still do see (I'm way more aggressive than everyone I know, even when I'm toning it down...) But my core is inferior Fi. So on the inside I'm kind of a mush.

I do get irritated when others don't take their guard down though. That's why when I see old friends that I haven't talked to in a while, I just act like nothings changed, so that we can pick up where we left off.

Why do you get irritated by the way? Do you think they owe it to you somehow? Or is there something deeper?

Also, have you ever experienced anxiety, increased heart race, dizziness etc?

 

[Evo]

Why do you get irritated by the way? Do you think they owe it to you somehow? Or is there something deeper?

Also, have you ever experienced anxiety, increased heart race, dizziness etc?

I think it's mostly because I don't like to waste effort. I give someone all my trust when I first meet them, I expect the same in return. If not immediately, then slow building at an exponential rate, at the very least from them.

Also, if I feel like someone I know well, needs me to earn their trust again, I'm going to be annoyed. I find that insulting. Cause that means they don't know me very well. And I will eventually stop putting in the effort, cause I'll lose respect.

It's not worth my energy.

Energy is a huge priority for me.

I put all my effort into something/someone cause I like to do my best in every situation.

When I don't get the returned effort from the other person...I recognize that they're not worth the effort, and discontinue mine.

Wrt the anxiety... yes. But I've done my best to ignore bodily sensations and my emotions. So up until last year, I did not acknowledge them because I found them to be a weakness.

I am a 6w7 though, lol. So I cannot deny that I am an anxious person anymore.

 

[yeghor]

I think it's mostly because I don't like to waste effort. I give someone all my trust when I first meet them, I expect the same in return. If not immediately, then slow building at an exponential rate, at the very least from them.

Also, if I feel like someone I know well, needs me to earn their trust again, I'm going to be annoyed. I find that insulting. Cause that means they don't know me very well. And I will eventually stop putting in the effort, cause I'll lose respect.

It's not worth my energy.

Energy is a huge priority for me.

I put all my effort into something/someone cause I like to do my best in every situation.

When I don't get the returned effort from the other person...I recognize that they're not worth the effort, and discontinue mine.

Wrt the anxiety... yes. But I've done my best to ignore bodily sensations and my emotions. So up until last year, I did not acknowlede them because I found them to be a weakness.

I am a 6w7 though, lol. So I cannot deny that I am an anxious person anymore.

Thanks... It's the same for me I guess... If the other person expects me to jump thru hoops too frequently to make himself\herself vulnerable, I get irritated with it... I think that may be a sign of an insecure personality...

Do you need them to admire you all the time though, give you positive Te feedback, like acknowledging your worth as a useful\valuable person in terms of capacity to envision and do things?

 

[yeghor]

There's aonther thing I wonder, do Fe and Te frameworks have to be on a vertical plane, i.e. has there to be a vertical hierarchy between people in terms of their perceived Fe or Te value...? Do Fe and Te-dom feel compelled to measuring themselves (their worth\status) against others?

My understanding of Fe (aux) strives and desires for a framework that is organized more on a lateral\parallel plane...where people could exist more or less with same Fe value...

Is this the same for Te (aux)...? How about for Te-dom?

Edit: Is Te\Fe-dom geared more towards Empire\Nation building?

 

[yeghor]

Also would love your contribution to this thread about me ranting on Te...

http://www.typologycentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=68269

[MENTION=14015]Urarienev[/MENTION] I've noticed you've already did that earlier...others are welcome too

 

[Evo]

Thanks... It's the same for me I guess... If the other person expects me to jump thru hoops too frequently to make himself\herself vulnerable, I get irritated with it... I think that may be a sign of an insecure personality...

Do you need them to admire you all the time though, give you positive Te feedback, like acknowledging your worth as a useful\valuable person in terms of capacity to envision and do things?

I don't care if people admire me.

I can take em or leave em. If people don't like me it doesn't bother me.

The only time conflict or lack of admiration, bothers me, is when I am close to that person.

Ideally I would like positive feedback from everyone. But my worth no longer comes from that. It only did when I was younger and it was with my parents/bosses/teacher (authority.)

 

[yeghor]

I don't care if people admire me.

I can take em or leave em. If people don't like me it doesn't bother me.

The only time conflict or lack of admiration, bothers me, is when I am close to that person.

Ideally I would like positive feedback from everyone. But my worth no longer comes from that. It only did when I was younger and it was with my parents/bosses/teacher (authority.)

I would expect Te-dom to be more dependent on (making sure of) such feedback... What you describes sound like Te-aux countered by Fi-tert developed around late 20s?

 

[Evo]

I would expect Te-dom to be more dependent on (making sure of) such feedback... What you describes sound like Te-aux countered by Fi-tert developed around late 20s?

Well I don't have the patience for that. Getting people to like me can be tedious. I am definitely an extravert though. I just have to click with them first. I'm not willing to go through the motions anymore.

 

[yeghor]

Well I don't have the patience for that. Getting people to like me can be tedious. I am definitely an extravert though. I just have to click with them first. I'm not willing to go through the motions anymore.

That points to internally defined self-worth...i.e. internal judging functions...I am trying to do that myself as well...My self-worth started to become more dependent on internal factors around 30...it's still vulnerable to external feedback though...

My friend feels compelled to keep checking his T standing\worth against other people around...the problem with that is that he becomes condescending in the process... by establishing publicly the fact that he's the better cog, he's at the same time giving the other the message that the other is the worse cog... so there's some kind of public devaluation going on...

There has to be another way for doing this without devaluing the others...

 

[rav3n]

Why not?

It was a joke. An inflation of stereotype.

 

[yeghor]

It was a joke. An inflation of stereotype.

 

[FDG]

My friend seems to brush off my insights too easily, some of which turn out to be true on the long term... And I don't want to tell him "I said so.." cause it defeats the purpose...

Sometimes I take time to put together my insights into a comprehensive form in writing and send it to him... But he appears to not be affected by them...as if he doesn't change his views..

Do you think he might be recognizing them by himself but not telling me? Sometimes I feel that he's not giving me enough due credit (not externally but internally)...

And he also sometimes goes into this some kind of "energy hunting" mode where he becomes lively\chatty and somehow feeds on the attention he gets from others...it feels as if it has some kind of ritualistic importance to him cause he acts irritated if he's disrupted at those times... does that sound familiar to you?

There's another mode of his that he verbally challenges\taunts people around him to challenge him or somehow remain silent to acknowledge his superiority...it feels as if he's feeding on that... Are they Te-checks?

The thing is that in doing that it feels to me as if he is somehow forcing\blackmailing people into showing him admiration cause if he doesn't get it, he either withdraws himself and his skills for a while (to punish them?) or tries to make those people feel bad somehow... so he's trying to strongarm them to show him admiration... That's how it looks to me... I think he does these when he's insecure or somehow low in energy so as to feel good\powerful again...

One day he said that a manager would never be happy with one of his subordinates being smarter\more skillful than himself\herself... and added that luckily he didn't have any reason to be unhappy...among his coworkers!

All these feel like some kind of a reflex to me...

I just want to have you guys opinions on all these, if you will...

Well, the behavior of your friend sounds slightly overblown. I believe I went through a phase like that when I was 20-21, now I've mellowed out a lot. Even though, I still believe that being more aggressive may lead to better life outcomes, at least until you're somewhat young-ish.

 

[yeghor]

Well, the behavior of your friend sounds slightly overblown. I believe I went through a phase like that when I was 20-21, now I've mellowed out a lot. Even though, I still believe that being more aggressive may lead to better life outcomes, at least until you're somewhat young-ish.

Thanks... Do I sound probing and judgmental...? How do I come across?

And, what enabled you to mellow-out? What did you notice?