[INFJ] When an INFJ doorslams you / cuts you out of their life / breaks off contact

[Ginkgo]

The potato has spokeneth.

Haha

 

[Society]

What did she put you through?

i went into my subjective experience here.

What did you do?

as i said earlier:

the one thing i did say was that she doorslammed me because she felt i publically humiliated her by talking about her, wtf would make you think this is what i'd be doing here? some people are able to recognize their own mistakes.

so now she see's me as a-moral for having done so.. which isn't like her at all, she has never deemed anything objectively a-moral before as far as i can remember.

Well, what is your theory, exactly? Can you spell it out?

when applied to no type in particular, it's simply that we are used to getting certain information from our functions and compensate for the information we aren't used too getting, which is why when our stress points are pushed, when we fall back on our undeveloped shadow functions and loose access to our main functions, we often aren't aware of the information we aren't getting, we don't have the tools to compensate for that lack of information, and thus assume there's no information to get - it's like people unaware that they have a cold believing that there's nothing to smell.

when applied to people who are used to relay on developed Fe & Ni, such as INFJs, habitual of empathy and being extremely aware of the other points of view within their relationships, the state of stress forms a tunnel vision in which the other person's point of view stops existing for them in the way they are used to experience it, there's no room for the other's point of view, and they treat their shadow Ne - speculated possibilities - as if it was Ni and lead to definite meanings. doorslamming - the act of denying yourself any access to information about the other's point of view - seems to be the extreme of this.

How much space are you giving her? How much time? Can you share more details?

right now? we haven't being together in 3 months and we haven't talked in about 5 weeks..

 

[Society]

and btw:

Plus, this:

You don't need to contribute to an existing one. Start a new one. If he has a social insurance # you also are eligible for the Canada Education Savings Grant.

More info: http://www.hrsdc.gc.ca/eng/learning/education_savings/public/cesg.shtml

you have no idea how greatfull i am for that idea. thank you!

 

[Fidelia]

PB is a great person to consult if you need a wide variety of sundry knowledge, and she usually has done research on it and can even provide links. She's helped me out more than once that way!

 

[Cellmold]

I recognised this tendency in myself when I was a child, these days ive matured and im more likely to try and engage someone with my aux function Fe if I have an issue or a problem.

Communication is always a problem for Ni doms I find. For me it's as if by going through a conversation or problem in my mind, (it's like a roaring tide of information and thoughts that's really loud except without sound), I forget that I havn't actually discussed it with anyone yet, im making up my mind and seeing eventualities without running it past other people.

I saw this as a flaw in myself when I grew older, id have a problem, id mope over it and go over and over it in my mind, then I would react with extreme harshness and close myself off from others from some minor interaction, leaving everyone around me completely at a loss.

Nowadays I try to engage with others more, that is, those who are close to me at least. Afterall how could anyone understand the problem if you aren't willing to give them any information even as a stepping stone? of course it could also be that a Ni dom sees the problem as so complex that it renders explanation impossible, in that case it would be up to the individual as to how they deal with it.

 

[Lexicon]

I never actually did the true ''doorslam,'' thing. I can't force myself to not care about someone simply for my own good. I can rationally understand that it's unhealthy in some situations, therefore I do take measures to scale back on contact, and increase distance, to establish some healthier boundaries, and just give myself a break, and space to process. But I never just cut someone off completely, without a word, leaving them to wonder. I know I'd hate to be left wondering.

I have a tendency to ''quarantine'' myself emotionally, if I happen to be under a tremendous amount of stress, but this is not always directly related to interpersonal relationships. Sometimes it's just cumulative factors. I fall off everyone's universal radar. I do try to give some disclaimer, when this occurs, before or as I nestle into my cave.

If the person can't respect that I may need some space, for whatever my reasons are, then the distance widens, of course. If it became overtly abusive, in some way, then, I would quickly close the door at that point.

 

[Ivy]

I recognised this tendency in myself when I was a child, these days ive matured and im more likely to try and engage someone with my aux function Fe if I have an issue or a problem.

Communication is always a problem for Ni doms I find. For me it's as if by going through a conversation or problem in my mind, (it's like a roaring tide of information and thoughts that's really loud except without sound), I forget that I havn't actually discussed it with anyone yet, im making up my mind and seeing eventualities without running it past other people.

I saw this as a flaw in myself when I grew older, id have a problem, id mope over it and go over and over it in my mind, then I would react with extreme harshness and close myself off from others from some minor interaction, leaving everyone around me completely at a loss.

Nowadays I try to engage with others more, that is, those who are close to me at least. Afterall how could anyone understand the problem if you aren't willing to give them any information even as a stepping stone? of course it could also be that a Ni dom sees the problem as so complex that it renders explanation impossible, in that case it would be up to the individual as to how they deal with it.

I agree that this would be an immature way of handling conflict and worth working out of. But I don't think this is always how doorslamming works. I think for many, it happens after very much (perhaps too much) engagement with the other person and the giving and considering of very much (perhaps too much) information.

I also think it's interesting that the loudest voices in this thread lately "against" INFJ doorslamming are the ex-spouses/SOs of INFJs who have cut them out. Is the painful end of a long-term romantic relationship really a fair way to assess a phenomenon? I've never doorslammed a SO, but I was doorslammed once after I tried to take a romantic relationship that had grown from a friendship, back down to friendship. Yeah, it hurt, but breakups hurt, and I think he was hurt way worse than I was, as is evidenced by his need to shut me out.

 

[Lexicon]

Yeah, it hurt, but breakups hurt, and I think he was hurt way worse than I was, as is evidenced by his need to shut me out.

I think people often fail to see the simple fact that we all experience and process emotional situations differently, especially when they are quite likely overwhelmed by their own emotions at the same time. Clouds judgement. Breaks and space may hurt, but they can help you grow, as well.

Trying to barge in past what another person may need to deal with their feelings, or even faulting them for it, is excessively invasive. Just because you have [or had] a relationship with someone does not entitle you to contact whenever YOU feel it necessary, unfortunately.

Patience goes a long way.

 

[Cellmold]

I agree that this would be an immature way of handling conflict and worth working out of. But I don't think this is always how doorslamming works. I think for many, it happens after very much (perhaps too much) engagement with the other person and the giving and considering of very much (perhaps too much) information.

I also think it's interesting that the loudest voices in this thread lately "against" INFJ doorslamming are the ex-spouses/SOs of INFJs who have cut them out. Is the painful end of a long-term romantic relationship really a fair way to assess a phenomenon? I've never doorslammed a SO, but I was doorslammed once after I tried to take a romantic relationship that had grown from a friendship, back down to friendship. Yeah, it hurt, but breakups hurt, and I think he was hurt way worse than I was, as is evidenced by his need to shut me out.

Good points, in fairness I related a lot of this to myself and missed the perspective of others.

ps: Love the avatar lol.

 

[BalanceFind]

I don't believe door slamming is a good choice for anyone.

The reasons for leaving a relationship sometimes make sense and sometimes don't, not just one or the other.

In my situation, my infj didn't check in enough for accurate information. She made wrong, factually incorrect assumptions because she quietly, distantly guessed. Those things then snow balled out of control. All she had to do was speak up. When I offered/volunteered to help or solve or discuss anything, I walked on egg shells. Then what happens next, the non-infj gives space to keep the peace.

These were very solvable issues.

When I was younger, I liked a different infj. And I found out after the fact she liked me too, perhaps even more than I liked her. I never would have guessed it. We both wound up dating different people, and it never worked out, mostly because we didn't know each other's feelings for another. Point being, there is no substitute for direct communication. None.

Not checking in leads to false assumptions, false conclusions. Those things then snowball over time.

If I left a situation, I would tell the person, AND, if there was anything important to clear up, I'd do it right away.

Unhealthy infj's seem to door slam very impulsively. My infj wasn't always unhealthy. But she became that way over time because of stress unrelated to me and triggers.

There are a wide range of types of door slams it seems.

I'm admittedly a more direct person, but I can handle some less direct communication, as long as there is some and it is clear.

I would never just disappear from someone if they were unclear, or unsure and trying to communicate with me. I would be clear, and if any major loose ends were resolved, then I could move on in another direction.

 

[BalanceFind]

I think people often fail to see the simple fact that we all experience and process emotional situations differently, especially when they are quite likely overwhelmed by their own emotions at the same time. Clouds judgement. Breaks and space may hurt, but they can help you grow, as well.

Trying to barge in past what another person may need to deal with their feelings, or even faulting them for it, is excessively invasive. Just because you have [or had] a relationship with someone does not entitle you to contact whenever YOU feel it necessary, unfortunately.

Patience goes a long way.

I was door slammed. I then waited 6 months patiently, and I suffered big time financial consequences because of it as well as emotional. That was enough for me. My approach now has been the opposite because she ran out of time for me. I know well pressure is not the best way to get cooperation from an infj, but I have no choice. So, I always chuckle at the be patient stuff. Uh no. Clear up your old bills and debts first, then you can have all the space you want for the rest of your life. Facts are not feelings. Facts come first. Reality comes first. My case is extreme I know, but, my infj has been caught up in long term thoughts and feelings, many of which are not even real or accurate. And yes, this happens to some infj's though not all.

She thinks withdrawing, feelings, come first, when, they don't. Reality comes first.

I walked on egg shells when in hindsight, I didn't need or deserve to do so. Then came the door slam. Then came the space and patience. Then came an offer from me for a positive, win/win deal. Next after still being ignored is heavy legal pressure, which I know doesn't go over well with infj's. Too bad.

Infj's don't get to call all the shots and make all of the decisions. All relationships in life are 50/50.

In my experience, when infj's take the focus off of self they do much better, generally speaking. As is the case with some other types.

I can tell you that the time has been the worst thing for me. The time has lessened and lessened my interest and remorse. Space is fine, but after a long period I lose interest. Or, after frequent brief walking on egg shells periods, I lose interest. I prefer balance, sometimes spontaneity, or ability to live in the moment in healthy way. I love the quiet strength, the depth, the intuition. But that balance of being spontaneous sometimes, in the moment, helps too.

As I have stated, my infj is 4w3. I am really struggling to handle the avg and low levels of 3. The ruthlessness is pretty staggering.

Compromise, compromise, compromise. Re-visiting decisions after the fact, especially poor ones. Forgiveness of self and others. Not walking through life thinking you are a victim, thinking that is your identity, nope. Perfectionism, nope.

Losing balance in the above can cause a lot of problems for self and others.

 

[Starry]

Is the painful end of a long-term romantic relationship really a fair way to assess a phenomenon?

I have actually been wondering about this myself. It's not that I believe my definition of 'the doorslam' is most accurate and all others should be rejected... but when I read stories in this thread concerning LTRs that have ended, for all intents and purposes, normally with 'explanations and good-byes'...only then to be followed with/by a break in communication I think ???

^^^No...I don't really believe that captures the nature of this phenomenon. That to me is just how the majority of relationships end. But what can you do...

 

[Lexicon]

I don't believe door slamming is a good choice for anyone.

The reasons for leaving a relationship sometimes make sense and sometimes don't, not just one or the other.

In my situation, my infj didn't check in enough for accurate information. She made wrong, factually incorrect assumptions because she quietly, distantly guessed. Those things then snow balled out of control. All she had to do was speak up. When I offered/volunteered to help or solve or discuss anything, I walked on egg shells. Then what happens next, the non-infj gives space to keep the peace.

These were very solvable issues.

When I was younger, I liked a different infj. And I found out after the fact she liked me too, perhaps even more than I liked her. I never would have guessed it. We both wound up dating different people, and it never worked out, mostly because we didn't know each other's feelings for another. Point being, there is no substitute for direct communication. None.

Not checking in leads to false assumptions, false conclusions. Those things then snowball over time.

If I left a situation, I would tell the person, AND, if there was anything important to clear up, I'd do it right away.

Unhealthy infj's seem to door slam very impulsively. My infj wasn't always unhealthy. But she became that way over time because of stress unrelated to me and triggers.

There are a wide range of types of door slams it seems.

I'm admittedly a more direct person, but I can handle some less direct communication, as long as there is some and it is clear.

I would never just disappear from someone if they were unclear, or unsure and trying to communicate with me. I would be clear, and if any major loose ends were resolved, then I could move on in another direction.

Yeah, your situation's a tough one. Her initial mistake was making assumptions that her perception was entirely correct without getting direct feedback from you about it. I agree, in that regard, relationships are 50/50. For me, I want to check the facts before allowing myself to experience intense emotional responses to whatever it is I'm contemplating. I dislike being incorrect, and getting upset over nothing. I feel weak and foolish doing so. It's not always possible to put my feelings on pause, but I do try, and attempt to communicate these concerns to the other party. We all have blind spots, and our feelings, like I said before, can cloud our judgement, at times. Less mature or underdeveloped people will overlook this fact, more often than others. None of us are exempt, though.

Dealing with people who live in their heads to that degree, acting on only their filtered sense of a given situation, is certainly frustrating, disappointing and draining. Sadly, it's very difficult, and sometimes impossible to help people like that see beyond their own self perpetuating feedback looping reality. And as for the financial part, there.. yeah, regardless of her feelings or [lack of] desire to contact you, if she agreed to hold up some end of a financial deal, it's her responsibilty to make good on that, especially if [I don't know this, obviously] she specifically agreed to, and within a specific time bracket. Otherwise, she pretty much fucked you over, there. Feelings & needing space in of themselves are not excuses for delaying or breaking promises of that nature.

I wonder if you ever detected any red flags in her behavior before this, in terms of her communication ''style'' with you or with others. I don't know you, nor do I know the dynamics of your relationship or your individual lives, so take my questions/observations with a grain of salt, if they seem too personal. It seems like you were dating someone who relied heavily on her own feelings far more than anything else, to determine her course of action. I imagine it carried over into other regular life situations. If you did notice these red flags, what made you feel like you were making a worthwhile financial/emotional investment? Did you expect it to be stable? Or did you not notice these potential patterns until the damage was done? Or do any come to mind, at all?

We're all chasing the same thing, at the core. We tend to share many of the same values related to all the basic ''should be's'' in a relationship; albeit they can be expressed differently. But what everyone wants aside-- some people are simply unable to consistently use, provide or share the insight & tools necessary to build that healthy foundation. It's not always easy to recognize this, within ourselves, or others. And it's not always easy to admit, even when we do finally learn to see.

 

[BalanceFind]

Yeah, your situation's a tough one. Her initial mistake was making assumptions that her perception was entirely correct without getting direct feedback from you about it. I agree, in that regard, relationships are 50/50. For me, I want to check the facts before allowing myself to experience intense emotional responses to whatever it is I'm contemplating. I dislike being incorrect, and getting upset over nothing. I feel weak and foolish doing so. It's not always possible to put my feelings on pause, but I do try, and attempt to communicate these concerns to the other party. We all have blind spots, and our feelings, like I said before, can cloud our judgement, at times. Less mature or underdeveloped people will overlook this fact, more often than others. None of us are exempt, though. Dealing with people who live in their heads to that degree, acting on only their filtered sense of a given situation, is certainly frustrating, disappointing and draining. Sadly, it's very difficult, and sometimes impossible to help people like that see beyond their own self perpetuating feedback looping reality. And as for the financial part, there.. yeah, regardless of her feelings or [lack of] desire to contact you, if she agreed to hold up some end of a financial deal, it's her responsibilty to make good on that, especially if [I don't know this, obviously] she specifically agreed to do so, and within a specific time bracket. Otherwise, she pretty much fucked you over, there.

I wonder if you ever detected any red flags in her behavior before this, in terms of her communication ''style;'' with you or with others. I don't know you, nor do I know the dynamics of your relationship or your individual lives, so take my questions/observations with a grain of salt, if they seem too personal. It seems like you were dating someone who relied heavily on her own feelings far more than anything else, to determine her course of action. I imagine it carried over into other regular life situations. If you did notice these red flags, what made you feel like you were making a worthwhile financial/emotional investment? Did you expect it to be stable? Or did you not notice these potential patterns until the damage was done? Or do any come to mind, at all?

We're all chasing the same thing, at the core. We tend to share many of the same values regarding all the basic ''should be's'' in a relationship; albeit they can be expressed differently. But regardless of what everyone wants, some people are simply unable to consistently use, provide or share the insight & tools necessary to build that healthy foundation. It's not always easy to recognize this, within ourselves, or others. And it's not always easy to admit, even when we do finally learn to see.

I did beat myself up pretty good for not seeing it coming. Ego can cause that type of thinking. But, no, I stopped questioning myself a while back. This is entirely her doing and her fault. I will not and do not feel bad for not seeing this coming.

I take solace with the quote: "Others almost always find out how deeply neurotic 3's are only after they have already done their damage." p122 of the book "Personality Types."

Moving to new country caused stress. Lots of small logistical and financial details caused stress. Fear of not being able to pull off grand vision caused stress, and these triggered the estp grip. I tried to get her to live within reason, balance, patience. She became more touchy, dismissive, pouting than normal. Then it clicked in her head that she could either continue down this grip path or come back to reality. She put her foot on the gas. Much of it had to do with her image and vision. I became someone in the way. My financial investment was sound with proper paperwork. However, I was not expecting to be abandoned. It will cost me lots of time and money and stress to solve my problem. But, as an 8, Entp/Enfp, we don't tolerate injustice, mostly for others, but for self too. It is easier for me to stick up for others, but because I'm reasonably healthy, I can do it for myself to in a healthy way. If anything I wish I gave less time and less space than I did. I do regret that.

She was pretty healthy with me for the past 3 years. I knew her off and on for 9. I am pretty observant and all of those things. I of course now, after the fact see the signs and clues. But she was a master at hiding some things. And, it comes down to how low will someone sink to save oneself. Would you lose all integrity and destroy others? I didn't expect that. Not that far and I had no reason to expect it. I am not trying to seek to understand. I work on strategies daily and implement them daily to get what I deserve and get out of the situation. Her genuine self-esteem turned out to be far less than even I thought. And her willingness to sacrifice anything and anyone for a grandiose vision was far greater than I thought.

Sure she needed to reel it in before. But nowhere near this. I never anticipated her moving beyond normal boundaries, lie, steal, cheat. Not even close.

Her feelings were very valid to me. They are not any more. She lost balance and all sense of reality, values, principles, boundaries. Door slamming made it much worse.

 

[Lexicon]

I did beat myself up pretty good for not seeing it coming. Ego can cause that type of thinking. But, no, I stopped questioning myself a while back. This is entirely her doing and her fault. I will not and do not feel bad for not seeing this coming.

I take solace with the quote: "Others almost always find out how deeply neurotic 3's are only after they have already done their damage." p122 of the book "Personality Types."

Moving to new country caused stress. Lots of small logistical and financial details caused stress. Fear of not being able to pull off grand vision caused stress, and these triggered the estp grip. I tried to get her to live within reason, balance, patience. She became more touchy, dismissive, pouting than normal. Then it clicked in her head that she could either continue down this grip path or come back to reality. She put her foot on the gas. Much of it had to do with her image and vision. I became someone in the way. My financial investment was sound with proper paperwork. However, I was not expecting to be abandoned. It will cost me lots of time and money and stress to solve my problem. But, as an 8, Entp/Enfp, we don't tolerate injustice, mostly for others, but for self too. It is easier for me to stick up for others, but because I'm reasonably healthy, I can do it for myself to in a healthy way. If anything I wish I gave less time and less space than I did. I do regret that.

She was pretty healthy with me for the past 3 years. I knew her off and on for 9. I am pretty observant and all of those things. I of course now, after the fact see the signs and clues. But she was a master at hiding some things. And, it comes down to how low will someone sink to save oneself. Would you lose all integrity and destroy others? I didn't expect that. Not that far and I had no reason to expect it. I am not trying to seek to understand. I work on strategies daily and implement them daily to get what I deserve and get out of the situation. Her genuine self-esteem turned out to be far less than even I thought. And her willingness to sacrifice anything and anyone for a grandiose vision was far greater than I thought.

Sure she needed to reel it in before. But nowhere near this. I never anticipated her moving beyond normal boundaries, lie, steal, cheat. Not even close.

Her feelings were very valid to me. They are not any more. She lost balance and all sense of reality, values, principles, boundaries. Door slamming made it much worse.

What it seems to come down to in your situation is: For whatever the reasons, some individuals will allow themselves to become.. well.. shitty people.

I'm sure she has it ''rationalized'' & ''justified'' in her own mind, but it doesn't change the result.

Good luck.

 

[BalanceFind]

Thanks.

That's just it. She has somehow convinced herself that basic reality and basic common sense does not take priority over her grandiose thoughts of vision and image. And she will destroy anyone in the way of that. I have no leverage to some extent. Sure, long term I can and will win so to speak. But at what cost? Lots of pain and suffering and time and money first. All unnecessary. All because of her greed. I no longer became useful to her. Her feelings had value. But she ruined the value of her feelings by doing all of this other stuff.

It's pretty hard to believe that she could today sign some papers that would solve all of this and she won't do it. That would mean compromise, fairness, integrity, re-visiting issues.

Here I felt like the person who saved the day for her and she is telling anyone any lies to keep everything for herself. Considering how well I treated her, that is pretty amazing.

I tried space. I tried 3rd party friends. I tried legal. I tried kindness. I tried compromise. I tried sympathy, and empathy. We couldn't be farther apart.

 

[Crescent Fresh]

I also think it's interesting that the loudest voices in this thread lately "against" INFJ doorslamming are the ex-spouses/SOs of INFJs who have cut them out. Is the painful end of a long-term romantic relationship really a fair way to assess a phenomenon? I've never doorslammed a SO, but I was doorslammed once after I tried to take a romantic relationship that had grown from a friendship, back down to friendship. Yeah, it hurt, but breakups hurt, and I think he was hurt way worse than I was, as is evidenced by his need to shut me out.

I happened to get doorslammed after trying to pursue a friendship into a relationship. The thing that hurted me the most is he had flirted with me and teased me for a period of time after developed a close friendship with him. I thought that's an obvious sign when the flirts get heated and I was really astonished that I got doorslammed as a rejection. He then immediately found a new love interest and started dating who is my best friend. My best friend didn't doorslammed me but she did try to keep a distance from me and I just let our friendships die off naturally.

From that moment on, I've never confessed to anyone of my love interest. I did manage to do that once I am sure of my infactuation was gone completely (even though it seems rather pointless). It did affect me as I never took any chance unless the guy pursue me clearly through verbal validation, or else I wouldn't take any forms of flirting as a sign of confession.

Well, it's rather different from what you've experience, Ivy. But I can sort of feel the level of impact how that may had hurted you. The good thing is after a period of time I happened to recover compeletely and leave those heartbreakers out of my world and move on without any bad sentiments. Even the worst breakup I'd ever experienced, I somehow managed to get over it by not looking back in the past.

I wonder if other INFJ also have simliar self-defensive mechanism of blocking any past heartbreaking moments when it comes to doomed romantic relationships.

 

[A window to the soul]

I happened to get doorslammed after trying to pursue a friendship into a relationship. The thing that hurted me the most is he had flirted with me and teased me for a period of time after developed a close friendship with him. I thought that's an obvious sign when the flirts get heated and I was really astonished that I got doorslammed as a rejection.

Unfortunately, it's not an obvious sign and sounds more like a misunderstanding than a doorslam. I'm friendly and flirty, but it doesn't mean I'm feelin' anything more than a friendship. Actions are the best indicator.

 

[BalanceFind]

I have a lot of studying to do in terms of counter acting narcissism effectively. It seems impossible to deal with, especially after the damage has been done.

How does a formerly higher functioning infj 4w3 get back to a reasonable enough level in order to communicate and make deals? That I what j have tried and failed with daily. But I can't give up. Too much at stake.

 

[Fidelia]

There are a ton of sites that offer advice on how to deal with narcissists. There's also a book that has some good ideas for dealing with narcissists during a divorce so there is a chance at dividing property fairly. Can't remember the title, but you can probably find it through Amazon.