[ESFJ] Problems with ESFJ mother

[Leysing]

Warning - heavy teenage angst will follow.

I'm turning 18 and I'm most likely spending my last year at home with my parents. The problem is that I'm having serious issues with my stubborn and bad-tempered ESFJ mother. I'm trying to tiptoe around, talk mainly about weather and engage in my own introvert activities in order to avoid fighting, but naturally we occasionally clash - and when we do, we clash hard.

I suppose that one of the things that causes the problems is that I'm consciously trying to be responsible for my own things and slightly pull away from the other family, as I know they won't be there for a long time anymore and I'm going to have to take the more or less full responsibility sooner or later. My mother is very sociable, somewhat clingy and she values closeness and intimacy. She is also very authoritarian and conservative. I very clearly see how she absolutely hates my introvert independence and my Ne slightly-revolutionary ideas. She has started to tell me to do ridiculous things just because she says so and that I have to obey because she's my parent, like to move things that I'm using at the moment to other places without any obvious reason or to start shopping as a hobby because I'm a girl. (She also accuses me for no longer watching TV with my family. )

She believes that she is extremely and above-average intelligent - she says that aloud. Well, she's extremely practical and sensible when it comes to everyday matters and I admire her because of that (I can't cook macaroni without ruining it) but when it comes to deeper things she's, honestly said, closer to dumb. (This is not to be taken as a generalisation, as I know several very smart ESFJs.)

She is extremely easily angered. Last time she nearly threw a chair through our kitchen window. She can also be very mean and even cruel, and she isn't afraid of aiming at the spot where she knows it hurts. She isn't guilty after that - she has managed to make me cry several times (I don't very easily cry because of negative or bad things) but she never apologises, she just tells me to develop a sense of humour or says that she has to "let it out". A few weeks ago during a fight I forced myself to calm down and told her, along with my sister, that she can't always force others to adapt to her and that it's rather selfish. I tried to make the message softer my assuring that I value her good traits. She responded by calling me unintelligent, humourless and hypersensitive. It was very frustrating.

Nothing is ever her fault - and the few times it is she plays martyr and melodramatically announces how she is mean and bad and can never do anything right.

Another frustrating thing is that she blames me for our arguments and she claims that I'm always trying to make up something to argue about, though I absolutely hate arguing. I try to avoid it as much as possible and I'm constantly going out of my way to keep our relationship as calm as possible. She misinterprets a lot of the things I say. (Of course it is likely the other way around as well, and that's why I try to ask questions to understand. MBTI has also helped somewhat - our arguments have fortunately become less frequent after me learning more about it.)

My mother of course has many very admirable traits as well (and we're not arguing all the time). I have listed only the negative ones above. I know that she's not a bad person. We just speak a very different language and we're on so different wavelengths that cooperation is often hard.

Do you have any ideas or experiences how I/we could improve the situation? I don't deny my responsibility of the situation and I'm sure that I'm the reason to at least part of the problem. It's just a little difficult to see all the angles, and that's why I ask for feedback (and there are many older-and-more-experienced-than-me people here ).

 

[booya moon]

Your mom sounds just like my mother-in-law (who I think is also an ESFJ)
She used to drive my ENFJ husband crazy, when he was still living at home. Actually, when I think about it, they are at each others throats every time we go to visit - which is not very often, probably due to the abovementioned incidents
And the crazy thing is, she means well, but she just won`t get it how annoying she can be. I think that ESFJs can get along with NT and NF as long as they are equal (and relationship parent-child is not equal by default and will never be).
So, the only solution to your problem is to move out and be independent. You can`t choose your parents and siblings, but you can choose your spouse and friends - let that be a consolation to you.

 

[Chris_in_Orbit]

Hey, its OK. SJs are just really really high maintenance. It may be that the only reason your mom is acting out in the way she is is because she isn't sure how you feel about her.. at least this would be my mom's reasons.

I have an ESTJ mother so I can seriously relate to most of the stuff you are sayin' (except for not being able to make macaroni, come ON woman )
Usually its easier for me to get upset with my mom, look for someone to agree with me that the woman is borderline insane but I know that really doesn't help. You don't get to pick your parents and no matter how difficult they may be, you should love them anyway.
You don't have to agree with anything she says but you shouldn't argue with her either. I find it easier to just say "OK" to whatever silly thing my mother is accussing me of (somehow this works???) And when I disagree with her or I feel she has done something to upset me I voice my opinion, but I never let it turn into an argument. When you argue with an SJ parent....you lose.
I'm glad that you see some good in your ma though, just remember she may be scared that you will be leaving soon, who knows. Once you get your independence things should definitely get easier for the two of you.

 

[Kora]

Argh. I can relate very well to what you're saying, since my mother is an ESFJ too. In my case she's more likely to play the victim role, as I'm the 'coldhearted and unemotional' one.
I could tell you how to 'counter-attack' her, but that would only cause more trouble (and for sure you know that an ESFJ mom angry is not very nice).
I just recommend you to not show that she hurts you. Or actually laugh at her 'jokes', and simply show that she has no greater power over you. She's just trying to re-assure that she's the one in control, so rebelling is hard.

On a second thought... Have you ever thought that she might have some issues? That is not a healthy attitude. Maybe she's trying to deal with something, and since you're under her 'control', she projects that on you.
You could also simply wait until you leave... but she will always be your mother, and you can't just run away.

Sorry, I'm not very helpful, but anyway, good luck on that.

 

[mlittrell]

Tell her how much you appreciate her, give her respect, and count down the days to when you move out lol.

 

[runvardh]

My dad wants to be cremated and dumped along the highway when he dies. He told me he won't old me to it (even though he's not married and I'm his eldest son) because he knows the family EFJ Trimaverate (his mother, his aunt, and his sister) would crusify me. Poor dad, funny thing is the first two actually are quite intelligent.

Edit: As for the OP, I agree with mlittrell. Find a good solid escape route you can take and take it when the time is right.

 

[Giggly]

This is not a type thing. You are turning from a Princess to a Queen. And there can never be more than one Queen in a single castle. This is making you two clash. The same is true for boys who turn from Princes to Kings. There can never be two Kings in one castle.

So you have to just grin and bear it, until you are able to leave and find a castle of your own to be a Queen.

 

[Bella]

That's lovely, Hmm

 

[runvardh]

This is not a type thing. You are turning from a Princess to a Queen. And there can never be more than one Queen in a single castle. This is making you two clash. The same is true for boys who turn from Princes to Kings. There can never be two Kings in one castle.

So you have to just grin and bear it, until you are able to leave and find a castle of your own to be a Queen.

+1

 

[Leysing]

Thanks to all for the responses. I've been reflecting on them a lot.

On a second thought... Have you ever thought that she might have some issues? That is not a healthy attitude. Maybe she's trying to deal with something, and since you're under her 'control', she projects that on you.

I have thought about this. She's generally a very anxious and limbic person and is often very stressed.

This is not a type thing. You are turning from a Princess to a Queen. And there can never be more than one Queen in a single castle. This is making you two clash. The same is true for boys who turn from Princes to Kings. There can never be two Kings in one castle.

So you have to just grin and bear it, until you are able to leave and find a castle of your own to be a Queen.

Extra thanks for this.

 

[Pavilion]

Start doing excessive amounts of drugs, drink a lot, become a cutter, a blood drinker, wear bizarre clothing, dye your hair black - no, better yet, shave it off.

...Just kidding.

Seeing as how she's your mom, I doubt I need to tell you not to make ESFJs really angry - not if you're looking to patch things up, anyway. In fact, I'm not really sure I could mention or suggest anything that you haven't already considered or tried yourself. All I can say is that I sort of know where you're coming from with an ISFJ mom. xSFJs need to be needed. If you don't let her do whatever it is for you that she's trying to do then she isn't going to like it. You've probably got it worse than I do too (from an I's standpoint) because my mom will bottle it up and never forget it so she can use it against me later, whereas your mom will unleash her fury right then and there in whatever Fe way she can. There must be no end to her tirade.

 

[redacted]

That sucks. Your post reminds me of my mother (an ISTJ).

It's so hard to deal with people like that because you're forced to be around them, but you don't want to just compromise yourself and your morals and go along. I'd say just grit your teeth and brute force it through the days until you leave.

Unless she's willing to go to family therapy or something, but it sounds like she'd be against that.

Maybe clean up without being asked? That's about all I can think of, lol.

I still have an incredible amount of resentment towards my mother for shit like that, and I've been out of the house for over 4 years

 

[vikkz]

I registered on this website just to tell you that what you are describing is 100% accurate with my ESFJ mom, me being an INFJ, I have almost the exact same interaction with her as you guys. I've realized that distance is the only way for our mother-dauther relationship to work better, been living away from home for 8 years now and our relationship has improved a bit. But whenever I do go visit her, if I don't behave exactly like how she wishes, or if I loses my patience, we can clash really hard.

 

[typologyenthusiast]

My mother is very commanding like military forces but also a caregiver like a nurse.
My mother is always in a hurry. She wants to get something done immediately: right now. Otherwise, she will judge it as a procrastination, which she reproaches. When something is done just now, she always question: why did you do it just now? why not getting it done long ago or since long time ago.
I have been theorizing that I used to play military action figure when I was a kid, is partly because of her influence and I also play RTS military video game.
Her feeling can only be satisfied when people do as she instructs.
She encounters a trouble with my sister (ISTP), who she judges knows nothing of doing housekeeping work. Quite often She is upset and question who my sister descendants are, since she perceives that my sister is not like herself: she has been doing housekeeping work since a kid, and has been giving example but disappointed that my sister fails to follow her diligence in housekeeping work. She seems to be a proponent of theory of inheritance trait through gene. Viewing from this paradigm, she seems to believe that because my sister is her daughter, her descendants, she should have a trait like herself.She seems to expect that if herself are diligent in doing housekeeping work, my sister should behave like her, which seems not the case.
She doesn't like Saying yes, without taking some action or even not immediately take some action to her instruction. For example, when she instructs me to throw away the garbage, and I say yes, but it happens that I am still doing something else, she will get upset.
My sister also when telling that she is going to do some exercise in the afternoon, when afternoon arrives, she will remind it. She doesn't like if my sister cancel it. She didn't ask whether my sister positively go exercising, or whether she has made up her mind but she rather reminds what she said before.
My sister once told me that she chose to enroll in a dormitory based high school more than two decades ago, in order to stay away from my mother. May be it is also the reason why she chose to enroll in university which distanced 1,5-2 hours flight plus 2 hours on bus/car from the city my parents used to live in.

Do you have any ideas or experiences how I/we could improve the situation?

You may have to live far away from her, just like my sister used to do.
You seem to me an ISFP.

she has managed to make me cry several times (I don't very easily cry because of negative or bad things) but she never apologises, she just tells me to develop a sense of humour or says that she has to "let it out".

When you cry, ESFJ might only say not to be crybaby.

Another frustrating thing is that she blames me for our arguments and she claims that I'm always trying to make up something to argue about

I have learnt that ESFJ likes to monitor the news, so you had better act like news broadcaster way to her. For example, Whenever you are in disagreement with her, You should not argue against her position, that since it will be wasting your energy. Just inform her that You disagree with her telling like this: I disagree with you Mom and just leave her. Her Extroverted intuition - introverted thinker will process that when she is alone.