[NT] No Thought?

[substitute]

I find when you're tired or drunk enough, you can dispose of either, first at will and then both, involuntarily.

A good ten years of relentless labour without support or respite, for kicks in the teeth in return (aka single parenthood) should sort you out.

Went a long way to solving my insomnia issues. Yep. Abject exhaustion, just what the doctor ordered!

 

[Jack Flak]

I find when you're tired or drunk enough, you can dispose of either, first at will and then both, involuntarily.

A good ten years of relentless labour without support or respite, for kicks in the teeth in return (aka single parenthood) should sort you out.

Went a long way to solving my insomnia issues. Yep. Abject exhaustion, just what the doctor ordered!

Sounds like my "one year hard labor" cure-all. It works.

 

[Provoker]

What is easier to dispose of, thought or feeling?

When you find that no other mental solution is available have you ever rationalized a thought into a feeling because it was easier to dispose of that way? Was the thought then complete or accepted?

Interesting post. I am very skeptical of the thought-feeling dichotomy. I have felt a thought and have thought a feeling. I could fall in love with an idea. Does that make me a thinker or a feeler? Personally, I don't think it's so black and white - it's much more complex.

To answer your queston - yes, I have rationalized a thought into a feeling probably out of some base instinct to self-preservation. It is uneconomical for the human mind to have unproductive ideas circulating in one's head. Better to assign the cluster of thoughts a feeling, and know that feeling for the future to avoid repeat mistakes (something intuition will in effect take care of).

 

[Gen]

Analagy Check it out.

Youve been working on a 1,500,000,000 piece 3D puzzle of the solar system and everything looks wonderfull. You are down to your last three peices but you keep checking over the puzzle and there are only two open holes. So you keep reasessing the puzzle and reassessing the puzzle. You try combinations of two of the last three pieces and not of them fit together. But there is the rest of the puzzle, minus the three that dont fit anywhere. You start to read the box, or think you make have gotten somewhere there were two identically cut pieces by chance, and you may have used the wrong one throwing the entire puzzle off. Every solutions nets the same result so finally you say. I can't do it because I am tired and not thinking clearly. So you dont allow your self to focus on the puzzle until you get rest. Which may be a while because now that you think its because your tired your not feeling tired anymore or never were or whatever. But you have shifted focus away from the puzzle which could have its own bennifitial elements to it rather than completion or perhaps the completeion will come from distance.

This is probably the first time I have tangibly allowed myself to not follow a thought through to completetion. And yes it feels like cheating. Noone has done this?

You've been talking online to this guy who is definitely 1 in 1,500,000,000 so you decide to meet each other and when you do everything looks wonderful. You're down to your last three days before he goes home and you both realize that this can't work: your lives are entirely separate and it would take enormous effort for one of you to move closer. And for what? Lust? So he goes and you don't know what to do. You think of ways to be close temporarily but your job is important to your life and his is in his life and most relationships fail anyway. Right? Every possible solution nets the same result, you have to sacrifice something of your life just to find out if it really does have any potential. So, emotionally exhausted you say "I can't do it because I'm too tired. I need a break. We have to stop." So you stop and you plan to go back but you know you may not because its just such a heartbreak and so frustrating. There's no solution, its just a feeling, completely irrational with no solution...

Yes, I've tried the repression route, and failed.

Then again, on smaller "puzzles" repression is much much easier. Its still not healthy.

 

[ThatGirl]

Lol, I have mainteained this thought in the back of my mind for a while and came up with a theory ar to what it may pretain to. Basically seeing a sequence I couldnt define. then I had the thought, that this possibly pertains to the irrational feelings. Courage, hope, faith and such. Instances or circumstances where against logic and clarity one must take action beyond solution. They must first remove the distraction of the contrast to their thought, give an emotional definition to the thought, fear, love, happienes sadness whatever, then dispose of the feeling as it is insignificant to the goal. Despite that the linear pattern contradicts the rationality behind such an action.

after rereading the thread i realized that both my analogy sucked and also that the reaction the description of such an event brought forth was incredibly interesting.

 

[redacted]

What is easier to dispose of, thought or feeling?

When you find that no other mental solution is available have you ever rationalized a thought into a feeling because it was easier to dispose of that way? Was the thought then complete or accepted?

Feelings are way easier to shut off. I've never been able to use Feeling as an escape from Thinking, only the other way around (intellectualization).

This is probably due to my nurture more than my natural tendencies, though, although there's no way to really tell. Maybe I would be a different type with different nurture -- no idea.


For me, I get closure when something makes sense to me. Or at least I get conscious closure. It probably still floats around in the background, though, until my emotions are processed, but that's not Feeling, as Feeling is conscious by definition.


Actually now that I think about it, one could use Feeling to attain conscious closure without dealing with the emotional issue. I think I do this with Fe. Hmmm. I think judging in general can easily be removed from internal emotional states (except Fi I guess).

Sorry, my mind is all over the place ATM.

 

[Tiltyred]

Lol, I have mainteained this thought in the back of my mind for a while and came up with a theory ar to what it may pretain to. Basically seeing a sequence I couldnt define. then I had the thought, that this possibly pertains to the irrational feelings. Courage, hope, faith and such. Instances or circumstances where against logic and clarity one must take action beyond solution. They must first remove the distraction of the contrast to their thought, give an emotional definition to the thought, fear, love, happienes sadness whatever, then dispose of the feeling as it is insignificant to the goal. Despite that the linear pattern contradicts the rationality behind such an action.

after rereading the thread i realized that both my analogy sucked and also that the reaction the description of such an event brought forth was incredibly interesting.

That's exactly my process. The puzzle thing was, too. That's exactly how I picture it. Moving the puzzle pieces around, trying to get the big picture to come into focus. Sometimes it won't, and sometimes I get tired and put it down. It will come to me when it gets ready -- it will pop into my head and I'll go test it and it will work. Or if not, hopefully it will turn out to have no significance and I can just let it go.

Or sometimes I can't get the last three pieces in, but I can still see enough of the picture that I decide to take a position and proceed just because I'm tired of not having a position to operate from. So based on what I can tell at that point, I take a position and proceed, and then I wait to see if anything changes. Or it may be that I decide it is hopeless but I am going to persist in my effort anyway because the effort is good in itself (hope, faith, courage) even if I can't see a result.

Ok please tell me at least some of that is what you were talking about.

 

[ThatGirl]

Possible new analogy here

You are aproaching a forest and you servey the area. You know you need to get across the forest but there is this in the way, and that you need to go over, which will lead to this, which causes that. You keep looking around it and disecting it down and yet each path is slightly incomplete or there is something missing or some form of casualty.

Now you know you can sit there because you know that you havent yet figured out as best you could, there is a missing link a missing peice, or something you havent thought of. So instead, you convince yourself that your not going into the forest because psh youre just scared. Even though that wasnt the case at all. So then you say, well im not going to be a scardy cat and charge.

Sigh, my analogies on this really suck and even as i am writing this I don't think I am expressing it correctly.

Next question do you ever take mental images of patterns and try to articulate them into applied words?

 

[redacted]

Possible new analogy here

You are aproaching a forest and you servey the area. You know you need to get across the forest but there is this in the way, and that you need to go over, which will lead to this, which causes that. You keep looking around it and disecting it down and yet each path is slightly incomplete or there is something missing or some form of casualty.

Now you know you can sit there because you know that you havent yet figured out as best you could, there is a missing link a missing peice, or something you havent thought of. So instead, you convince yourself that your not going into the forest because psh youre just scared. Even though that wasnt the case at all. So then you say, well im not going to be a scardy cat and charge.

Sigh, my analogies on this really suck and even as i am writing this I don't think I am expressing it correctly.

It's funny when you say you think you're an S.

It's like it's raining and freezing in the forest and there are two paths to your destination (there are hot showers and towels and a nice fire in a fireplace at the destination). There's a quick path, but you have to walk through a cold stream (analogous to dealing with emotion). And there's a really long path, in which you'll definitely get soaked anyway (because it's raining), and you'll spend way more time very cold, but you don't have to go through the stream because you somehow think it'll be worse (suppressing your emotion).

For some reason not dealing with emotion feels safer or easier, but it's less efficient.

Next question do you ever take mental images of patterns and try to articulate them into applied words?

That's all I do...