Munchausens by Internet

[Frosty]

Munchausen’s By Internet: Why People Fake Illnesses Online – HealthyWay

Munchausen’s By Internet: Why People Fake Illnesses Online
Bloggers who write about their illnesses often get a lot of sympathy online. But what happens when they lie? And why would they do that?

How common?

Why do people do this?

Anyone have any experience with this- knows anyone whose had experience with this?

Its hard to know over the internet who is real and who isnt, and its easy to be suckered in to things sometimes- sometimes I think its even what people who do this depend on- good natured people not wanting to beliebe that someone culd acrually be lying about something so serious. But it happens. And people get hurt. Sometimes peoppe get scammed out of serious cash- time- energy- all that.

But is it the fault of the person with munchausens- or is that an illness like any other? Sometimes rhe lines are unclear.

So what do you think. Sorry if Im unclear- mostly this is just a thread to discuss the phenomenon.

Some cases of this

Kaycee Nicole - Wikipedia

Behind Belle Gibson's cancer con: 'Everything about this story is extreme' | Books | The Guardian

Who would fake a tragedy on Facebook just to get sympathy and attention? - The Washington Post

Its actually really interesting in some ways. The types of people wjo do this... and why.

So. Discuss. If you can find somethinf to discuss in this op- sorry its a little unclear. Not sure what Im really asking except sharing a fascination- over yhe last few days- witb this. And wondering how widespread it is and how many people are aware that this is even a thing

 

[Lady Lazarus]

I feel that whoever does this, needs to. Not physically, but mentally/emotionally. They want to feel protected and safe, they want the affection they crave. They want and need something they feel they cannot get by themselves. They are damaged and cannot handle it at all.

That said, this is the way they fight (because who else could this possibly point to). People the opposite of brave and honorable. Because it is the easy way to do things.

It's not legitimate if you don't bleed, it's not bold if there are no stakes, it's not real if you aren't direct. It is just an image unless you live it and you feel it all.

In my hurt, I succumbed to someone who is not me. But of course, no more.

A lot of things in her background point to so much pain. Not more than everyone in the world obviously. But still, it all came from somewhere.

Of course, that is the unpopular opinion and it will certainly make people disgusted at me to see this. But I have legitimately never cared about the approval of the people or my image. It doesn't matter what she has tried or let him do to me, as I said in another place, others do not dictate my actions.

It's way past time to let this die or else this is also milking something, similarly to people with this condition.

 

[Yuurei]

It’s too bad Magpie is no longer here. We could just ask her.

I have known many people like this.

All I can say is that it is easy to tell who is faking it. There is nothing beautiful about illness and those who claim otherwise are desperate for one of ( or both of) two things;, admiration, but not just any, they want that disgusting, fake portrayal of the transcendent angel which the media forces onto us.
They glorify illness with bullshit like “ It takes dying to truly live”...or some other sacchirribe nonsense.
The second reason they do this is because they are desperate to feel something.

Really, it’s just another form of appropriation. Those who have truly dealt with illness for a large part of thier lives don’t know any other reality. They are just trying to get buy.
No one praises them, their stories don’t go viral, they don’t have the clout or money to make a movie about thier lives or start any kind of awareness campeign. They just try to live thier lives while dealing with not only the hardship created by the illness itself but just a shit ton of judgement by people who rather not have to acknowledge they exist.
“ Why can’t you have a better attitude like sweet girl on TV!?” Well, because that isn’t real. Even if the person is real, the transcendent angel” bullshit is an act. And some people choose to play the part because it’s the only way to get help.

I once saw an article in “ The Sun” ( a bullshit newspaper) about my own generic condition, I was greatly amused- the title was something like “ Brave twins slowly turning to crystal have only each ither!”
Of course the comments were all about how brave and wonderful they were.
I corrected the article “ We don’t “ turn into crystals.” I said. “ That is rediculous. Crystals form inside our cells and destroy them.”
And yes, I, a former “ brave little girl” was chased off by an angry mob because I was clearly “ just bitter”. Hate to tell you this but that is likely what those little girls will become when they grow up. But no one wants to hear that. It doesn’t fit their ideal of the transcendant and brave warrior.
I’ve said it before and I will say until the day I die ...for good: there is nothing brave about living your life the only way you know how. Anyone who says otherwise is lying to you.

 

[Frosty]

Just to be clear, this thread isnt about anyone on the forum-past or present. Dont want this to turn into... that

 

[Lady Lazarus]

[MENTION=6554]/DG/[/MENTION]

Since you said you would edit, I won't quote. But thank you for that post. It's one of the only reasonable and human ways I've seen people approach this here.

As for your confession, on the contrary to making me think less of you, I actually respect the honesty and self-awareness you display in the section under spoiler.

That said, I do feel like Munchausen's by proxy is a different matter altogether for me as well.

 

[prplchknz]

I'm aware of it, the issue is i went down the rabbit hole a few years back and it gave me anxiety because I do talk about my illness and i used to a lot more it made me worry that i was faking despite having an actual diagnoses or that people think i'm faking, So I hate it and I hate the people who do it. I don't care if they're considered sick or not.

 

[Yuurei]

I don’t think any less of people because of curiousity or experimentation. I think everyone has these sorts of thoughts of and feelings. It’s just human nature.

....what about people who genuinly have serious health problems and needs that aren’t being met? Often times, because they are over shadowed by these liars who know how to play on everyone’s sympathies? Do they matter less?

My Grandmother had ...if not ACTUAL munchousen by proxy something very similar ( I don’t know a lot anout it) she didn’t make up my illness but did greatly exaggerate it.
It is about 99% physical ( the one percent is some issues with math/ vidual spatial concepts but nothing that could not be solved with a little extra tutoring) but she had convinced everyone I was severly deficiant, unable to live on my own ( or do anything a normal, successful person could) and that I was a danger to myself. None of this true.

 

[Lark]

I think I remember reading about this as something that Freud suspected motivated some of the people he saw in psychoanalysis, it was part of his writing or conclusions about analysis as terminable or interminable, I think it may have been called "secondary gain" I'm not sure.

There's a lot of different versions of this online and probably as many different sorts of motivation too. Financial gain is one big one that I can think of an part of why I'm very careful about supporting any casual fund raising offline or online until I've done a lot of checks. I'm pretty sure of more than one occasion on which I've known fund raising was going on and only part or none of the money reached the source if was intended for.

I'm sure there's other motivations too, catfishing is an interesting internet phenomenon I only recently discovered and there's an entire movie dedicated to that.

Its interesting because I've read one book which was really positive about the early days of the internet and even celebrated a lot of the pseudo-identity and false persona thing, however, even that source had to admit that things had changed from those early days and it was less innocent when it occured now (though it wasnt clear if this was a reflection of demographic shifts, I think the net is used differently by people who have a strong memory of a time predating it, or a time without it, to those largely socialised with it or by it or a reflection of exploits developed by cyber criminals).

 

[Yuurei]

You are making a false comparison. Saying someone's life and needs are important does not negate the lives and needs of others.

That is precisely what I am saying.

 

[The Cat]

I feel that whoever does this, needs to. Not physically, but mentally/emotionally. They want to feel protected and safe, they want the affection they crave. They want and need something they feel they cannot get by themselves. They are damaged and cannot handle it at all.

That said, this is the way they fight (because who else could this possibly point to). People the opposite of brave and honorable. Because it is the easy way to do things.

It's not legitimate if you don't bleed, it's not bold if there are no stakes, it's not real if you aren't direct. It is just an image unless you live it and you feel it all.

In my hurt, I succumbed to someone who is not me. But of course, no more.

A lot of things in her background point to so much pain. Not more than everyone in the world obviously. But still, it all came from somewhere.

Of course, that is the unpopular opinion and it will certainly make people disgusted at me to see this. But I have legitimately never cared about the approval of the people or my image. It doesn't matter what she has tried or let him do to me, as I said in another place, others do not dictate my actions.

It's way past time to let this die or else this is also milking something, similarly to people with this condition.

 

[Yuurei]

I am not the greatest with words, but points seem to be getting misconstrued here. You seemed to be implying that I think those with physical illnesses matter less because of the point I had stated earlier.

Additionally, I just noticed your edit and I'm very sorry that that happened to you. However, the topic as a whole was not really about Munchhausen's by proxy, and my original point was not about Munchhausen's by proxy. That condition is a bit of a different story and one that I do not wish to get into at the moment.

No, no. Of course not. This could be a thread called “ Tell me about your Munchousen by proxy experience....no, really, someone, anyine we’re here to support you.” And as soon as I show up “ Yaaah we don’t feel like talking about it anymore.” Seriously, who the fuck do I think I am, wanting such luxuries as to be heard?
Yeah, I should be ashamed for being emotional. But apparently I should be ashamed for thinking I deserve to be heard on a forum that claims to be supportive so I can’t be bothered to care.
There are some great people here, I have a hard time staying away but everytime I return I inevitably feel horrible. Like everyone here just wishes I’d shuttup and go anyway so, fine. Sticking around is no good for me.
( This isn’t about you. It’s been festering for a while.)

...and I wasn’t looking for sympathy. I was genuinly asking if it was a form of Munchousen.

 

[Peter Deadpan]

For the record, I'm not convinced that Magpie wasn't a victim of Munchausen by Proxy at the hands of her mother. I distinctly recall her mentioning that her father (whom according to her was personality disordered) had once reported to medical professionals that her mother had the affliction. Regardless, Magpie wasn't exactly set up for psychological success given her upbringing and family dynamic. I'm not pitying her, I merely understand darkness as if it's my second skin, so it's not hard for me to put on a Magpie suit and imagine some of her feelings and difficulties.

I think though that you are most likely to see Munchausen by Internet from people who succeed to be in the spotlight, as in those who get media coverage or have successful crowd funding campaigns.

It's quite an intriguing subject worthy of more research and discussion.

 

[1487610420]

I'm sure there's none of that on a typology forum. and it's only limited to illness, too, not other generic woe is me stuff. 100%. guaranteed. not.

 

[Frosty]

Munchausens vs munchausens by proxy is another interesting thing I think to talk about- how feelings differ/tolerance differs.

And when it comes to money vs just attention in munchausens.

Personally, I think that munchausens is close to a personality disorder, and it DOES have overlap with several-especially borderline personality disorder.

A Relationship Between Factitious Disorder and Borderline Personality Disorder

Personality disorders cause distress both for the person with the persoanlity disorder and those involved in their lives. But- although personality disorders can tbe “cured”, I dont think, they can be managed by those people going through things like therapy to learn healthier coping mechanisms.

But this speaks to a willingness to look at the self and recognize that what they are doing is problematic. And from what Ive read, people with munchausens tend to defend their sicknesses even past the point where they are proven not real. Example- in some cases the patient is actually recorded making themselves or someone under their care sick- but often, even when shown that, they refuse to acknowledge what they did.

So. Its difficult. No one should be told that their condition means they are totally screwed- but with this... munchausens... there are a lot of elements at play. Ones that take a lot of time to even MAYBE work through- and in that time while they are worked through- there can also be a continuance of pain.

Mostly, what my view is- these people need help, but they also need to be willing to get it. And if they dont, then what they do should not be encouraged. Because who does that help? Not the person with this condition who is just being enabled deeper and deeper- farther away from reality- and further into their delusion. I think that more research needs to be done with this, and treatments, to help people with this, need to be figured out. In my mind, its akin to a persnality disorder. Hard to work through or entirely change- but possible to be tweaked so there is less suffering for all involved- both society and the person suffering.

Getting people who do this comfortable to acknowledge it- is the most important thing. That- yes they are sick- but maybe not exactly in the way they portray.

Also, I also read somewhere that munchausens patients do have had a tendency to be the children of people with muncahsens by proxy. Thats an interesting thing. And it speaks to the need really for people- everyone- to be aware. And not intolerant- not label the person as good or bad. But label the action, and through the action, through understanding it- pointing those people towards help.

 

[Smilephantomhive]

[MENTION=29849]Yuu[/MENTION] you cant just assume someone has munchausen without proof or at least a good concrete reason.