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Gaiman's "Sandman" series

Totenkindly

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I thought there was already a thread on this, since they have been casting.

Here is a comprehensive article including casting decisions from both the first batch (a few months ago) and the second, last week.
Everything We Know About Netflix’s The Sandman Series << Rotten Tomatoes – Movie and TV News

Gaiman has said he is involved more than "American Gods," less than "Good Omens."

To include the most obvious stuff:
Sandman_Cast-Grid_700x380.jpg


Sandman_NewCastAnnouncement_700x700.jpg


There has also been an audiobook reading out there with different cast.

I'm actually happy it's getting done as prestige TV. It deserves a decent treatment. trying to condense too much into a two hour movie would likely not just be disastrous but also not do the concept justice. And now they've had a few trial runs (American Gods, Good Omens, plus tons of other adaptations) to get it all right.
 

Totenkindly

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Apparently there was yet another twitter feed where some idiots got in Gaiman's face about not caring about his work... which is ridiculous. If you know the history of Sandman at all, Gaiman has been fighting the good fight for literal years (decades?) to get this into an AV format that is true to the core of the work.

Neil Gaiman Fires Back at Sandman Netflix Casting Critics

Apparently someone got their undies in a wad over a black casting of Death (she changes shape all the time anyway, depending on where she is, to reflect the dying). Gaiman didn't really take it lying down either.

"I give all the f*cks about the work. I spent 30 years successfully battling bad movies of Sandman," Gaiman wrote. "I give zero fucks about people who don't understand/haven't read Sandman whining about a non-binary Desire or that Death isn't white enough. Watch the show, make up your minds."

If someone is stupid enough to not know that Desire was always non-binary / straddling the gender line, they have no claim to even watching the show. the whole point of desire is that it's not one gender or the other. They appear as both genders (or simply as the in-between gender) throughout the series. Desire impregnates someone as a male (by admission) at one point in the series but regularly could be read as female as well. Gaiman's work is pretty broad in these respects, he had one of the most memorable trans characters that really impacted me, in the "A Game of You" arc, as well as a number of gay and lesbian characters.

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The guy playing Abel, scarily enough, looks just like the comic book version. The Corinthian casting as well, and the guy played Pierce in "Logan" so I think he's up to the task.
 

yeghor

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Now that makes sense why American Gods makes me depressed when watching.

This guy is a nihilist and probably an INTP. In contrast Tim Burton (INFP), Burton's domains are as eerie as Gaiman's yet the former is more about hope and love shown thru a distorted lens and world.

Gaiman's work is also distorted and eerie but more about despair and decay and corruption. He is a warlock or a dark shaman who corrupts the society and souls.

Haven't read the comic, curious about the TV show.

EDIT: Alan Moore's style looks similar to Gaiman's.

EDIT 2: Alan Moore on Rorrchach: “I wanted to kind of make this like, 'Yeah, this is what Batman would be in the real world'. But I had forgotten that actually to a lot of comic fans, that smelling, not having a girlfriend—these are actually kind of heroic! So actually, sort of, Rorschach became the most popular character in Watchmen. I meant him to be a bad example. But I have people come up to me in the street saying, "I am Rorschach! That is my story!' And I'll be thinking: 'Yeah, great, can you just keep away from me, never come anywhere near me again as long as I live'?”

So if Batman is ISTJ and Moore is irked by ISTJs, that would make him INFP?

Maybe Gaiman is also an INFP after all and there are shades to INFPs as there are shades to Fi.

EDIT 3: Also interesting is Niamm Wallsh looks a bit like Naomi Watts both in name and in face?
 

Julius_Van_Der_Beak

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Now that makes sense why American Gods makes me depressed when watching.

This guy is a nihilist and probably an INTP. In contrast Tim Burton (INFP), Burton's domains are as eerie as Gaiman's yet the former is more about hope and love shown thru a distorted lens and world.

Gaiman's work is also distorted and eerie but more about despair and decay and corruption. He is a warlock or a dark shaman who corrupts the society and souls.

Corrupting souls is so much fun tho.
 

Totenkindly

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Now that makes sense why American Gods makes me depressed when watching.

This guy is a nihilist and probably an INTP. In contrast Tim Burton (INFP), Burton's domains are as eerie as Gaiman's yet the former is more about hope and love shown thru a distorted lens and world.

Gaiman's work is also distorted and eerie but more about despair and decay and corruption. He is a warlock or a dark shaman who corrupts the society and souls.

Haven't read the comic, curious about the TV show.

EDIT: Alan Moore's style looks similar to Gaiman's.

EDIT 2: Alan Moore on Rorrchach: “I wanted to kind of make this like, 'Yeah, this is what Batman would be in the real world'. But I had forgotten that actually to a lot of comic fans, that smelling, not having a girlfriend—these are actually kind of heroic! So actually, sort of, Rorschach became the most popular character in Watchmen. I meant him to be a bad example. But I have people come up to me in the street saying, "I am Rorschach! That is my story!' And I'll be thinking: 'Yeah, great, can you just keep away from me, never come anywhere near me again as long as I live'?”

So if Batman is ISTJ and Moore is irked by ISTJs, that would make him INFP?

Maybe Gaiman is also an INFP after all and there are shades to INFPs as there are shades to Fi.

EDIT 3: Also interesting is Niamm Wallsh looks a bit like Naomi Watts both in name and in face?

This is not a typing thread, this is the Arts & Entertainment thread. So this is a discussion of the show and things related to the show, so we can focus on the show and story itself, NOT typology. THis is why the two areas exist. Otherwise the story/show discussion would continually be derailed by people arguing about what type the main character or the author is.

You can place typing threads for characters and artists/writers, etc., over in the Popular Culture and Typing area. It should be kept out of Arts & Entertainment threads except obliquely.

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To try to address your main points: Maybe you should actually read the entire Sandman series before you go off about how he's "about despair and decay and corruption." Death is actually an uplifting character in this series, which is why she has been a fan fave. And the reason it's a big draw is because of the catharsis and uplifting quality of the entire 75 issue work. No, it's not all about unicorn farts and light and breezy, it deals with some heavy shit, and maybe that doesn't sit well with you -- where I would simply say, "to each their own." At the same time, it embraces the necessity of change in life, lest we become calcified in un-life. So much trauma revolves around refusal to deal with change and admit that change (with is a form of "mini-death" -- you are leaving behind what exists for something new, something still being born) is required if you want to actually live. The theme of Sandman is, quite literally, "change" -- and change as a form of growth because you have to leave your past behind to move into the future. [To summarize: We "die" regularly in order to continue to live, and if we refuse to change/die, we are dead already.] I personally found so many instances of catharsis over the course of this story. It's the reason the comic series ended in the 90's and yet people have been trying to get an adaptation to the screen ever since.

I've seen the first season of American Gods and have not read the book. AG is darker than than Sandman, based on the first season of the show. Also, it's not clear where any of its going from just that season, other than it being an all-out war between the ancient gods who are becoming obsolete and the newly developing gods of younger countries/cultures, which I found kind of fascinating to think about -- but yeah, it's pretty dark and bloody. It's about a war between beings who are far larger than humans, who need humans to amass power, and who otherwise might not care about humans. I would not misunderstand the show to be totally reflective of the book, so I cannot draw the same comparisons you have from watching some of the TV show.

Tim Burton loses some of his power because he's always going for the whimsical. This is amusing at times, even if it allows him to pull off what would be a sick horror story in lesser hands (like Edward Scissorhands), but sometimes it can rob his work of gravitas. I feel like I enjoyed him in his early years because there were very few unique voices in the film industry, but that has changed a lot over the last 25 years. Burton is also a film director (different medium) than Gaiman, so he directs his own visual manifestation of story; Gaiman can be more abstracted and with his comics work would be reliant on artist pairings. He's worked with a wide range of artists through Sandman, some are darker visualists, some are lighter, some are quite beautiful (Michael Zulli is one in particular that comes to mind).

I'm not sure why you are talking about Watchmen in this thread without better sketching out what point you are trying to make. There is a Watchmen thread somewhere if you want to discuss Alan Moore and Watchmen as its own entity.

Corrupting souls is so much fun tho.

Well, there is that.

What better way to pass the time?
 
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