It's not Fe, Fe is concerned with appropriate behavior and judging/creating proper environments.
Additionally, I've never met an FJ who could compare with NP empathy. Especially proteanmix.
I think you might be appropriating. Getting along with people is not mimicry. Nor empathy.
Well, it hasn't been my observation. I see Ps change (not all to the same degree) while Js stay the same, depending on context.Dude! Look at what you just wrote.
'Kay. I went too far calling it "empathy". (But the other kids did first!)
What about the mimicry, mirroring chameleon thing?
To me, and I can't exactly get the full picture here, what it sounds like you're doing is self-improvement. I assume you don't mimic people you find nothing worthy or interesting about, which I can hardly help doing myself. It's like a subconscious desire to demonstrate no traits the other person doesn't have in order to blend in.You might be right. If I do appropriate when it comes to the environment and people around me, though, it's something that I don't think about. That is, I might internalize their concepts, judge them according to worth (with apparently relatively low standards), and adopt the worthy ones all within a split second for use within that particular environment.
It's quite possible that it's not the same as what you're describing as far as an internal process goes, but it seems to have about the same end result. I've noticed phenomenon such as adopting others' mannerisms even from just watching TV shows.. especially strong personalities such as House. My friends have also told me that I act differently around different people, and I don't even recognize it when it happens. Only when I'm thinking about it am I aware that it's occurring.
This might be a related concept, but less "temporary".. when it comes to core principles or ideas that I read or hear, I do tend to think about them and judge them before I adopt them. But then they seem to become a part of me rather quickly. Any idea I consciously or subconsciously judge as useful is collected and I act upon it as if it's a more permanent part of my personality. When I introduced myself to these forums, I really had no idea what my type was, and I kept changing it as I was introduced to different situations and people. It was almost as if I'd also read several type descriptions that fit me and found myself acting upon them before finally settling on my first impression.
In any case, whether or not I'm experiencing what you guys are.. it's a pretty interesting phenomenon. I wasn't aware that it was such a normal trait, and I do wonder where it comes from.
Well, it hasn't been my observation. I see Ps change (not all to the same degree) while Js stay the same, depending on context.
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I'm sure this is true as a preference. Eventually though all people ,regardless of type, learn how to adapt. It is simply not efficient to do otherwise.
Ja. Balancing. What we do naturally evolves into what's best to do per situation, over the years. Ps become hard when necessary, and Js become pliable when necessary.I'm sure this is true as a preference. Eventually though all people ,regardless of type, learn how to adapt. It is simply not efficient to do otherwise.
To me, and I can't exactly get the full picture here, what it sounds like you're doing is self-improvement. I assume you don't mimic people you find nothing worthy or interesting about, which I can hardly help doing myself. It's like a subconscious desire to demonstrate no traits the other person doesn't have in order to blend in.
I'm sure this is true as a preference. Eventually though all people ,regardless of type, learn how to adapt. It is simply not efficient to do otherwise.
I can fake sensing, feeling and extroversion. Essentially, you create a persona for yourself beforehand, commit your mind to it, quit thinking and go. Visibly people see you more as an ESF. Obviously my sensing abilities will never match those of a person who natively possesses it, but it's only a matter of outward appearance, not actual functionality.
As soon as it comes to dealing with people who know you and can read you, toss it out the window. Real friends will detect your insincerity. That's the thing...
Mimicking and chameleoning are effects of being high self-monitors. Don't delude yourselves INTPs, you are not high self-monitors and you don't mirror people well. Your cheese and whine wouldn't be as delicious if you were. Watch your ExTP brothers for other TP examples, or ExFJs for FJ examples.
proteanmix said:Cypocalypse, in my observations and interactions with INTPs, I know what you're getting at but I don't think it is what you think it is. I notice that the handful of INTPs at my job give off an easygoing vibe but it's not necessarily because they're "chameleoning" anyone. Like other IPs they insist upon being persistently themselves. It's more or less just being quiet and not creating an image and allowing people to form whatever impressions of them they want, allowing people to project images onto them which can be positive, negative, or neutral. When I think of chameleoning I think of actively creating an image or persona of yourself that you want people to have in their heads or believe you to be. Mimicking another person is even harder because you have to be paying close enough attention to the other person to pick up their habits and mannerisms, even temporarily. I don't see INTPs noticing or that attuned to other people that closely to mimic them.
INTP Profile Thing Jock Quoted said:INTPs dislike making the first move and tend to mirror the emotional content of the other person. A jolly person will quickly bring the INTP out of his shell, as much as that is possible, while a serious person will find a serious INTP looking back at him. In this sense, INTPs preference for intuitive perception (rather than action) with respect to people results in them resembling a chameleon. The INTP can fit into many different modes of behaviour, even contradictory ones, in order to get into the mindset of the other person. The goal is to gain enough intuitive data to analyse and assess the person. In doing this, the INTP remains somewhat reserved, never wholly identifying himself with his surroundings. As chameleons, INTPs are therefore approachable and open, unless the Ne tells the INTP that the other person is a type he doesn't like, in which case the reserved attitude may become too obvious. The chameleon behaviour can be particularly strong when discussing something. The INTP may even argue something that he doesn't really believe himself. Sometimes it is for the intellectual stimulation that comes with the challenge of arguing from a variety of standpoints. Otherwise, it may be to avoid early conflict before the situation has been fully assessed. Chameleons hide their true selves. INTPs do not do this cynically, or indeed all the time, but it is a result of the strong desire to remain detached and observe.
So basically, you disagree because you have a different definition of what a social chameleon is. And it is wrong. Chameleons as a species do not "project an image and display it outward to the world," they respond to their surroundings. Which is exactly what you said INTPs do.
"An INTP can simulate any personality of various archetypes, none of which is legitimately his."
Additionally, I've never met an FJ who could compare with NP empathy. Especially proteanmix.
OK, so I have this forum full of INTPs, another forum full of INTPs, and INTPs I personally know. One of the most consistent things I've noticed with INTPs--not all of course, never all of anything, but yeah usually I can bank on some of this stuff--is that they aren't very high self-monitorers. This is why so many INTPs are frustrated with their social interactions. Because, and perhaps this is their inferior Fe, the social function, they aren't as quick to notice and react. So no, I don't see how INTPs in general are these super chameleons or do some chameleoning above and beyond what the average person does. I don't see INTPs in general taking great pains to create or preserve an image of themselves for others to see. This is what I consider chameleoning and it does not correlate to that chameleon behavior mentioned in the OP.
Yep. I do it constantly, mostly unconsciously. I really don't know how I'd adapt in social situations without doing it. It's very effective most of the time, but it's the reason why i don't like being in large groups, as I sometimes get confused about what behaviors to mirror :/ .
Do you act like them? Adopt their accents, speech patterns, mannerisms, expressions, apparent moods, and levels of effusiveness?
It's like a subconscious desire to demonstrate no traits the other person doesn't have in order to blend in.
Chameleon, yup.. do that lots. It's not morphing though.. as underlined by other posters (though often in other contexts). I don't become their type, I simply adjust to how they seem to prefer to interact. INTPs are reknowned for being accepting of people as they are.. I think that this reflects the chameleon characteristic quite well.
As for Ti stimulus, that's kind of why I'm on these forums. Most people don't appreciate direct Ti analysis. At least on here it has a small chance to blossom and find a home.
Yep. I do it constantly, mostly unconsciously. I really don't know how I'd adapt in social situations without doing it. It's very effective most of the time, but it's the reason why i don't like being in large groups, as I sometimes get confused about what behaviors to mirror :/ .
I know exactly what you mean.
The alternative I've attempted is to be more like myself, but extremely guarded. Unforunately, that one doesn't go over nearly as well with people.