[NT] the morality of NTs

[ThatGirl]

What brand of morality to you hold yourselves and others accountable to?


Do people trust you?


Do you consider yourself trustworthy?

 

[The Ü™]

What brand of morality to you hold yourselves and others accountable to? There is no such thing as morality.


Do people trust you? Well, I'm reliable -- I remember to return things that I borrowed. I don't have any reason for people not to trust me. I'm actually more likely to distrust others. I feel uncomfortable lending my stuff to others.


Do you consider yourself trustworthy? I would say so. Although I don't trust others. On the other hand, I trust backstabbers -- you see, I readily assume that people are going to do something to betray me. Hence, the people who betray me are the ones I trust, because I knew from the beginning it would happen.

 

[ThatsWhatHeSaid]

What brand of morality to you hold yourselves and others accountable to? I don't really think it's a brand. I know what I'm supposed to be doing and what's "right" in all situations. It's just a matter of putting all the other isht down and taking responsibility.


Do people trust you?
Hm. Trust me in general? Yes. It gets messier when you ask if they trust that I will feel the same about them in a few days/months/hours or that I will not harm them in some other way, usually by getting angry. For that, I think most do, but I sometimes do get moody.

Do you consider yourself trustworthy?
Same as above. Generally, if I say something, I will keep my word, but with regard to the type of trust I mentioned above, I don't fully trust myself, so I can't be fully trustworthy.

 

[ThatsWhatHeSaid]

There is no such thing as morality.

Don't take this as an attack, because it's not. I would agree that there is no objective morality, but subjectively, people devise moral system to guide their behavior. To that degree, there is morality, so the question stands: how do you, Uber, make decisions about right and wrong? What does your compass look like?

 

[entropie]

What brand of morality to you hold yourselves and others accountable to?

I have no moral system that is a clear problem, but only in cases when you are asked for your morality. I believe in balance, fairness and logic. I go by my heart, when it comes to trusting people or giving them the security that they can trust me. If I like them it happens, if not it doesnt.

I especially see the discrepancies my NF girlfriend is having with morality. She recently told me that nurses on her station in the hospital are covering up for other nurses, if their husband calls and asks for them. The nurses tell their husband, they have to work and do otherwise.

I have the basic fear to loose my mind, because my world sometimes is erradic, colorful and chaotic. I can go so long ways that I start to transform the world around me into something non-existing, non-realistic, what I do believe and accept as being right. Therefore my highest form of concentration lays in linearity. Therefore I never develop a feeling towards someone, until I am not 100% sure, she wont disturb my linearity. Therefore I would never cheat on someone, because I would have to betray my own emotions and I would do the thing, I dread the most.

But this is no form of morality, this is basic instinct and comes with the design of myself.


Do people trust you?

Everyone close to me does and I have not failed anyone. I havent met their expectations though, which are sometimes to high. Like not doing something on behalf of the group, because it is good for the group, but I think its wrong. That's why I would never be a good soldier.


Do you consider yourself trustworthy?

No, I dont. I consider myself highly volantile. But I consider my basic feelings trustworthy. Would fight for them, til the day I die

 

[Jack Flak]

I have a complex code of honor.

People almost always trust me.

I am trustworthy. I might screw up and show up late, but I never screw people over.

 

[The Ü™]

Don't take this as an attack, because it's not. I would agree that there is no objective morality, but subjectively, people devise moral system to guide their behavior. To that degree, there is morality, so the question stands: how do you, Uber, make decisions about right and wrong? What does your compass look like?

Generally, I look at it from a legal standpoint. If it's illegal, I don't do it because I am aware of the consequences. Or I am aware of undesirable consequences that are internal. That's what stops me from acting, because I can see all the consequences. And all consequences except for one are undesirable. My desired outcome in almost all situations is like striving for a hole in one. If I miss it, I'm doomed.

I'm all in favor of the "whatever works" approach, but I must also protect myself from the consequences. If I wanted to, I would have no guilt from observing the quirks of the rules and working to the objective that way.

But most of all, I want to find the most efficient way of reaching a goal, or somehow drawing the power to gather self-confidence -- in my case, that comes from making others feel worthless, but there again, I anticipate a certain reaction in my head (usually for someone to cry and feel weak), but the reaction I may actually get is lash of anger, which will then make me feel weak. Naturally, I must also work within the legal limits here, too.

 

[The Ü™]

Uber, you do have a moral compass that is irrespective of the law, because you often state that you'd never hurt an animal.

I don't really think that really has to do with morality, though. It has to do with the fact that I like animals.

 

[ygolo]

What brand of morality to you hold yourselves and others accountable to?

I don't know how to describe my moral code. The simplest is that I am being "moral" when I listen to my conscience (which is VERY different from doing whatever I want).

When I don't listen to my conscience or explicitly override what my conscience says is right, I am being "immoral."

The flip side of this is that my conscience is still a bit "teachable."

Do people trust you?

Generally, people trust me more than I trust myself. Its a bit scary actually.

Do you consider yourself trustworthy?

It depends.

I generally tell what I believe to be the truth. I am rather trustworthy about that. The main exception is when I want to protect my privacy.

I am also reasonably good at discerning what is true, and not fooling my self.

I do my best to follow through on commitments I make to people. Unfortunately, I am notorious for underestimating the time things take to do. So, on this particular thing, I am not very trustworthy (though I am getting better).

 

[The Ü™]

I don't steal or cheat because I have respect for humanity and vicariously enjoy others' experience of trust untarnished.

What if humanity didn't have respect for you?

 

[Jack Flak]

Fi's actin up! Get the hose!

 

[entropie]

When I was around the age of 10, there was that tabletop game I wanted badly. It costed around $150 by that time.

Once my mum send me to the backery to get some bread and she gave me her banking card so that I can get the money before I buy the bread.

Well I got the money + the change I needed for my desired tabletop game. A few days later my dad asked me, if I had stolen money. I wasnt aware of banking statements by the time. I improvised and invented a story about a guy that forced me with a knife to get the money for him, while I was at the bank. I really made up a coherent story.

My very objective but morally inclined istp father, pretended to buy the story and took me to the police. There I should present it to an investigator. The hearing happened and I repeated my story. The investigator listened and then started asking question that I could not stand. To many gaps in my story, finally brought me to collapse and to admit I stole the money.

From that day on the relationship between my father and I should take years to recover. I guess I am pretty morally burned through the way I was raised

 

[Jack Flak]

Wow, that's harsch.

 

[entropie]

Yea, I learned much about moral through my father. The only problem I have today is, my father's SP moral is pretty all-or-nothing, do-it-or-die. My NF girlfriend wants to morally fine tune me nowadays sometime, so that I get rid of that Sylvester Stallone limited emotion-logic.

I by the way, feel pretty much gangbanged. But as long as there is music, beer + the switch to shut off your head, I let people talk

 

[The_Liquid_Laser]

What brand of morality to you hold yourselves and others accountable to?
I'm a Christian, so I hold myself to Christian morality. Specifically I try to live by the principle "love your neighbor as yourself". I only hold other people accountable to the law (and even then I usually let things slide unless they do something serious like kill someone).


Do people trust you?
Yes.

Do you consider yourself trustworthy?
Yes.

 

[Lateralus]

What brand of morality to you hold yourselves and others accountable to?

-I don't hold others accountable to anything. I have my own mishmash of values that I follow, some remnants of my Christian background, others I've come up with on my own.


Do people trust you?

-Yep, if anything, I suffer from being too honest, sharing things I shouldn't.


Do you consider yourself trustworthy?

-Yep, see above.

 

[ThatsWhatHeSaid]

Generally, I look at it from a legal standpoint. If it's illegal, I don't do it because I am aware of the consequences. Or I am aware of undesirable consequences that are internal. That's what stops me from acting, because I can see all the consequences. And all consequences except for one are undesirable. My desired outcome in almost all situations is like striving for a hole in one. If I miss it, I'm doomed.

I'm all in favor of the "whatever works" approach, but I must also protect myself from the consequences. If I wanted to, I would have no guilt from observing the quirks of the rules and working to the objective that way.

But most of all, I want to find the most efficient way of reaching a goal, or somehow drawing the power to gather self-confidence -- in my case, that comes from making others feel worthless, but there again, I anticipate a certain reaction in my head (usually for someone to cry and feel weak), but the reaction I may actually get is lash of anger, which will then make me feel weak. Naturally, I must also work within the legal limits here, too.

You should read about Kohlberg's Moral Stages of Development. I think you'd find it interesting.

Level 1 (Pre-Conventional)
1. Obedience and punishment orientation
(How can I avoid punishment?)
2. Self-interest orientation
(What's in it for me?)
Level 2 (Conventional)
3. Interpersonal accord and conformity
(The good boy/good girl attitude)
4. Authority and social-order maintaining orientation
(Law and order morality)
Level 3 (Post-Conventional)
5. Social contract orientation
6. Universal ethical principles
(Principled conscience)

 

[Salomé]

I believe in moral relativism - but only for myself, everyone else needs to obey the ruleZ OK?
I don't think I've ever done anything immoral - my conscience is more of an asspain than the J-ist of Js.

People don't trust me - but that's because they're stupid and immoral. For some reason they think I'm too good to be true and I'm must be hiding some dark and dirty secrets. If I am, they are very well hidden.

I'm very unreliable, but totally trustworthy (thinks: is an untrustworthy person ever gonna put their hand up there?)
I do lie quite shamelessly tho' - does that count?

 

[entropie]

You peed in the pool, people dont like guys who pee in pools !

 

[Salomé]

You peed in the pool, people dont like guys who pee in pools !

good job i'm not a guy then