Dave Chappelle's "Sticks & Stones"

[Honeydew]

Has anyone watched this trainwreck on Netflix?

I once considered myself a fan of Dave's work, but his latest performance is so vile and filled with misogyny and transphobia. When did Dave Chappelle become a white supremacist? I had to stop watching it half way through because my blood was literally boiling.

These reviews pretty much sum my feelings up:

All the Worst White People Love Dave Chappelle's Sticks and Stones

Vice - You Can Definitely Skip Dave Chappelle's New Netflix Special 'Sticks & Stones'

Buzzfeed - Sticks & Stones

Rotten Tomatoes

 

[tinker683]

I did. Also a big of fan of his earlier work. My thoughts are as follows:

1) It felt like he was just trying to provoke everyone, like the article from the Root stated. This is in and if itself not a bad thing for a comedian to do (Carlin did it all the time) but I don't think Dave's commentary (if this is indeed commentary and not just reaching into the barrel) here will have the same sort of landing George's did.

2) I feel like he's running out of gas. What he did say just didn't seem that interesting to me. Like Kevin Hart, I loved his earlier material but his newer stuff just doesn't seem funny to me. I don't know why.

That's all I got.

 

[anticlimatic]

I thought it was as funny as anything else he has ever done. He's a notorious master of his craft (other famous comedians are even jealous of his talents), and I think a big part of his success and talent comes from being an individualist who doesn't pander to his audience.

This guy more or less sums up my detailed feelings on the video:

 

[ceecee]

I did. Also a big of fan of his earlier work. My thoughts are as follows:

1) It felt like he was just trying to provoke everyone, like the article from the Root stated. This is in and if itself not a bad thing for a comedian to do (Carlin did it all the time) but I don't think Dave's commentary (if this is indeed commentary and not just reaching into the barrel) here will have the same sort of landing George's did.

2) I feel like he's running out of gas. What he did say just didn't seem that interesting to me. Like Kevin Hart, I loved his earlier material but his newer stuff just doesn't seem funny to me. I don't know why.

That's all I got.

I watched it twice. It felt like he was provoking, even trolling. It doesn't take a great talent to tear down trans, gay or rape victims, which bums me out because I have liked Dave for a long time. That doesn't make him un-funny. It was just boring since many of his observances are shouted daily by conservative media. I wasn't terribly offended or angered, I just think he can do better than this.

By the way, there are all kinds of entertainment I don't find as entertaining as I once did. I chalk much of this up to the current world we live in. No desire to watch a fictional dysfunctional billionaire family or political gymnastics or ultra violent military fetishists. I can have that for free daily.

 

[Maou]

I heard it was intended to make a point, hence the title, for impact of the current political climate about people being too easily offended by words. I haven't watched it yet, but plan to. He came to my city just the other day, the traffic was horrible lol.

 

[The Cat]

there are few things humans hate more than a point.

 

[Population: 1]

Freedom of Speech takes a certain level of maturity and personal responsibility to utilize. No, it doesn’t mean you can say whatever you want. No, you can’t use it to incite violence. Yes, you can otherwise use it to express yourself and your opinion and not have the government or anyone else tell you to stfu and only say whatever they attempt to stuff in your brain and mouth.

Dave should be able to say whatever he wants within the limits of that right and those that disagree should also be able to criticize him for it in a reasonable manner and not silence him with angry mob tactics. I have a feeling a lot of people would miss the First Amendment if it were ever to be revoked.

 

[The Cat]

Freedom of Speech takes a certain level of maturity and personal responsibility to utilize. No, it doesn’t mean you can say whatever you want. No, you can’t use it to incite violence. Yes, you can otherwise use it to express yourself and your opinion and not have the government or anyone else tell you to stfu and only say whatever they attempt to stuff in your brain and mouth.

Dave should be able to say whatever he wants within the limits of that right and those that disagree should also be able to criticize him for it in a reasonable manner and not silence him with angry mob tactics. I have a feeling a lot of people would miss the First Amendment if it were ever to be revoked.

Yeah, but they'd learn to keep it to themselves.


“I know your race. It is made up of sheep. It is governed by minorities, seldom or never by majorities. It suppresses its feelings and its beliefs and follows the handful that makes the most noise. Sometimes the noisy handful is right, sometimes wrong; but no matter, the crowd follows it. The vast majority of the race, whether savage or civilized, are secretly kind-hearted and shrink from inflicting pain, but in the presence of the aggressive and pitiless minority they don't dare to assert themselves. Think of it! One kind-hearted creature spies upon another, and sees to it that he loyally helps in iniquities which revolt both of them. Speaking as an expert, I know that ninety- nine out of a hundred of your race were strongly against the killing of witches when that foolishness was first agitated by a handful of pious lunatics in the long ago. And I know that even to-day, after ages of transmitted prejudice and silly teaching, only one person in twenty puts any real heart into the harrying of a witch. And yet apparently everybody hates witches and wants them killed. Some day a handful will rise up on the other side and make the most noise--perhaps even a single daring man with a big voice and a determined front will do it--and in a week all the sheep will wheel and follow him, and witch-hunting will come to a sudden end.

Monarchies, aristocracies, and religions are all based upon that large defect in your race--the individual's distrust of his neighbor, and his desire, for safety's or comfort's sake, to stand well in his neighbor's eye. These institutions will always remain, and always flourish, and always oppress you, affront you, and degrade you, because you will always be and remain slaves of minorities. There was never a country where the majority of the people were in their secret hearts loyal to any of these institutions.”

 

[Hive]

Has anyone watched this trainwreck on Netflix?

I once considered myself a fan of Dave's work, but his latest performance is so vile and filled with misogyny and transphobia. When did Dave Chappelle become a white supremacist? I had to stop watching it half way through because my blood was literally boiling.

I'm not sure why any fan of Chapelle's earlier work would be terribly offended by this special. His style and subject matter hasn't changed at all. Much of the second half of the special he talks about race relations from the perspective of a black man, in the same manner that he has done through his whole career - with a pretty great deal of understanding of both the differences and similarities between the groups. I can only assume your white supremacy accusations are indignant hyperbole.

Personally I found it really funny, although less sharp than his previous works.

Also, does anyone experience issues with the sound? I watched the first half with no issues, paused it, and then resumed the next day, only to find the sound way less clear, as if recorded with a phone in the audience. I checked, and this isn't an issue with other Netflix titles. Has this only happened to me or has the sound been tampered with?

 

[Honeydew]

I just feel like he was bordering on hate speech. Society's values have changed and entertainers need to evolve to accommodate that. If a person operates on the fringe of what is acceptable then they're going to be ostracized and/or censored. It's the only way to maintain a sense of sociopolitical equilibrium in today's divisive climate.

I can only assume your white supremacy accusations are indignant hyperbole.

I was mostly referring to this quote from the Root article:

"That said, there are also many who consider this to be one of his best performances. And among that group are trolls, professional bigots, white supremacists, Nazi sympathizers and more of the very worst white people; an adoration due to the parallels between their sensibilities and his."

 

[Hive]

I just feel like he was bordering on hate speech. Society's values have changed and entertainers need to evolve to accommodate that. If a person operates on the fringe of what is acceptable then they're going to be ostracized and/or censored. It's the only way to maintain a sense of sociopolitical equilibrium in today's divisive climate.



I was mostly referring to this quote from the Root article:

"That said, there are also many who consider this to be one of his best performances. And among that group are trolls, professional bigots, white supremacists, Nazi sympathizers and more of the very worst white people; an adoration due to the parallels between their sensibilities and his."

Stand up comedy is at its most potent when it's punching upwards, and the most bland when it's enforcing the status quo. Dave has always been honest and his work full of integrity, which is a huge part of his appeal, and also why he remains successful despite not pandering or walking around eggshells around sensitive topics. Regarding the quote from the article, I'm just gonna dismiss it. Clearly the author is incapable of judging the substance of Chapelle's word for themselves, instead opting for some lazy guilty-by-association bullshit. (Which is funny to me because I wonder why all the nazis would suddenly come out of the woods to watch a Dave Chapelle special.) And if you're a white supremacist or alt-righter and believe Chapelle is an ally of yours, then you're similarly incapable of understanding what he's actually saying. Accusing him of pandering to the alt-right is such lazy, low resolution tribal thinking. It's disgusting.

 

[anticlimatic]

Society's values have changed and entertainers need to evolve to accommodate that.

I'm not sure society's values have changed, but I'm positive that comedians do not need to accommodate themselves to society.
If that were the case, older comedians would have just gotten on stage and recited the pledge of allegiance.

 

[Forever_Jung]

I liked it! I wonder if some media outlets are panning it because Dave is going against the grain of their narrative.

I am pretty sensitive to gender stuff since it's something I've wrestled with for a long time, but I still quite liked the car ride analogy for LGBT. I think it was pretty nuanced in comedy to make the point about how despite the fact that many people think of LGBT as a monolith there are differences between the groups/identities and little resentments. I cracked up when the Q saunters up to the car in booty shorts, not sure exactly what they want, but gets in the car anyway.

I was made very uncomfortable about the parallels between the black crack epidemic and the white opioid crisis, and the white hypocrisy, and I appreciated being made to feel uncomfortable. Shook a few things loose for me. I did not feel comfortable in my whiteness watching the special, that's for sure! So I wouldn't see why Nazis would be into it.

All in a day's work for one of the best working comedians. I wouldn't call it his all-time greatest work or anything, but it was relevant!

 

[Honeydew]

Also, does anyone experience issues with the sound? I watched the first half with no issues, paused it, and then resumed the next day, only to find the sound way less clear, as if recorded with a phone in the audience. I checked, and this isn't an issue with other Netflix titles. Has this only happened to me or has the sound been tampered with?

I finished watching it last night and the volume worked fine on mine.

I wonder if some media outlets are panning it because Dave is going against the grain of their narrative.

Probably, but the narrative is being pushed for a good cause, to promote social progress. There needs to be solidarity among everyone who identifies as progressive, or at least everyone who isn't a white male.

I can't believe that 99% of audience members approved of his performance. It's such a stark contrast to the critics score.

 

[Totenkindly]

Haven't watched it, I didn't really watch his earlier stuff either tbh -- although I heard about it because of the media splash.

Maybe my perception is wrong but from the discussion it sounds like his targets generally were the disaffected and minorities that are already abused by the system and who do not possess power realistically in the system. Typically comedy makes a better splash when it's used to tear down established powers and those in control. It's a weapon for change for those with no power in the system.

I'd have to watch the show to get a better since of the nuance, so my initial thoughts could be wrong here, but: Maybe he perceives a threat from previously ignored voices who now might have more power on social media and would potentially try to control his speech, but damn... when you're in a minority where you run the risk of losing your job, your housing, your religious affiliations/community, your family, your ability to support yourself, your ability to just be considered like everyone else, and then some guy jumps in to reinforce the same social stereotyping shit that is keeping you down once your community finally has been finding a voice... how is that not a douchebag move? Or a guy who is just more interested in his own career and "freedom" than the ability of his targets to finally find equal footing in society?

I liked it! I wonder if some media outlets are panning it because Dave is going against the grain of their narrative.

I am pretty sensitive to gender stuff since it's something I've wrestled with for a long time, but I still quite liked the car ride analogy for LGBT. I think it was pretty nuanced in comedy to make the point about how despite the fact that many people think of LGBT as a monolith there are differences between the groups/identities and little resentments. I cracked up when the Q saunters up to the car in booty shorts, not sure exactly what they want, but gets in the car anyway.

I was made very uncomfortable about the parallels between the black crack epidemic and the white opioid crisis, and the white hypocrisy, and I appreciated being made to feel uncomfortable. Shook a few things loose for me. I did not feel comfortable in my whiteness watching the special, that's for sure! So I wouldn't see why Nazis would be into it.

All in a day's work for one of the best working comedians. I wouldn't call it his all-time greatest work or anything, but it was relevant!

If he was targeting everyone, then that's definitely better than the buzz I have been hearing.

Can't really comment further because as I have admitted, I haven't watched it. My concerns are simply what I've stated, but I would revise once I would watch.

The thing is, I've watched a bit of his earlier stuff and was kinda "eh." Some things make me laugh, I don't remember being particularly amused by him. Maybe he's just not my thing. So I'd only watch this special as context for discussions, which means it probably won't happen.

I can't believe that 99% of audience members approved of his performance. It's such a stark contrast to the critics score.

ha, maybe you didn't notice how it's been for awhile... Pretty much when they reset the scores in Netflix and Amazon to reflect an audience baseline and not a critical one, I pretty much can evaluate whether I will like something based on the inverse of the score. 5 stars? It probably sucks. 2-3 stars? Woot -- I'm gonna love it. Not EVERYTHING is that way, there have been works where the critics and audience align have similar appraisals, but it's a minority it seems.

IMDB meanwhile has always been heavily skewed towards white people and males; also, the popular blockbuster films/works.

 

[anticlimatic]

I can't believe that 99% of audience members approved of his performance. It's such a stark contrast to the critics score.

Most critics these days don't relate at all to the average person. I miss Roger Ebert, I felt like he and I had our fingers on the same priorities when it came to film, and since he died I can't find anyone that is enough like me to let me know how good I'll think something is.

Don't feel bad about the audience score. That just means you finally made it to the 1%!

 

[Honeydew]

Haven't watched it, I didn't really watch his earlier stuff either tbh -- although I heard about it because of the media splash.

Maybe my perception is wrong but from the discussion it sounds like his targets generally were the disaffected and minorities that are already abused by the system and who do not possess power realistically in the system. Typically comedy makes a better splash when it's used to tear down established powers and those in control. It's a weapon for change for those with no power in the system.

I'd have to watch the show to get a better since of the nuance, so my initial thoughts could be wrong here, but: Maybe he perceives a threat from previously ignored voices who now might have more power on social media and would potentially try to control his speech, but damn... when you're in a minority where you run the risk of losing your job, your housing, your religious affiliations/community, your family, your ability to support yourself, your ability to just be considered like everyone else, and then some guy jumps in to reinforce the same social stereotyping shit that is keeping you down once your community finally has been finding a voice... how is that not a douchebag move? Or a guy who is just more interested in his own career and "freedom" than the ability of his targets to finally find equal footing in society?

If he was targeting everyone, then that's definitely better than the buzz I have been hearing.

Can't really comment further because as I have admitted, I haven't watched it. My concerns are simply what I've stated, but I would revise once I would watch.

The thing is, I've watched a bit of his earlier stuff and was kinda "eh." Some things make me laugh, I don't remember being particularly amused by him. Maybe he's just not my thing. So I'd only watch this special as context for discussions, which means it probably won't happen.




ha, maybe you didn't notice how it's been for awhile... Pretty much when they reset the scores in Netflix and Amazon to reflect an audience baseline and not a critical one, I pretty much can evaluate whether I will like something based on the inverse of the score. 5 stars? It probably sucks. 2-3 stars? Woot -- I'm gonna love it. Not EVERYTHING is that way, there have been works where the critics and audience align have similar appraisals, but it's a minority it seems.

IMDB meanwhile has always been heavily skewed towards white people and males; also, the popular blockbuster films/works.

I admit that I am easily triggered. If you are anything like me then I would advise you to exercise extreme caution if you decide to watch it.

Most critics these days don't relate at all to the average person. I miss Roger Ebert, I felt like he and I had our fingers on the same priorities when it came to film, and since he died I can't find anyone that is enough like me to let me know how good I'll think something is.

Don't feel bad about the audience score. That just means you finally made it to the 1%!

This just appeared in my suggestions. Not sure why. I can't particularly say that I agree with their conclusions though. As for the 1% thing, I've always felt like a minority fighting against the status quo.

 

[Tengri]

The memes floating around are jokingly dubbing Chappelle a 'white supremacist' and his irony is lost on the most literal audience viewership. That said, the guy has raised a family and has gone through some mental turmoil and growing during his hiatus, so the youthful immaturity so characteristic of his earlier standup has changed significantly. Also, his audience has grown up with him - plus, the Trump administration's domestic terrorism (inter-border warfare) differs significantly from the Bush-era political climate of border expansion. (Critics are unhappy with the shock 'n awe approach, too) As much as I admire Chappelle, he does come off as an old man yelling at a cloud now.

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

He’s always done provocative comedy. You’re upset people enjoyed it?

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

I've never been into Dave Chappelle, but I find the idea of "punching up vs. punching down" to be a little weird. Like there's a neat little rubric and set of checkboxes you can create for whether something is ok to joke about or not.

Maybe I'm just afraid of a future where the entirety of comedy is nothing but jokes about Trump being an orange cheeto.