Nootropics (Cognitive Enhancers)

[Opal]

I realize a thread with this title already exists, but since the thread starter Noopept is banned I figured I'd open my own.

I've dabbled in different general health supplements for maybe five years (omegas, B complexes, D, K, 5-HTP, melatonin, L-tyrosine, ALCAR, etc.) to varying degrees of effect. After dabbling a little too heavily in certain categories of drugs I found myself building a nootropic (cognitive enhancement) arsenal and playing somewhat irresponsibly with my neurochemistry. I'll expand on that soon. I've done a great deal of research but haven't had anywhere to express my findings or experiences. This seems like a nice place to do so.

I'm very curious which other types have experience with nootropics and which nootropics in particular they find helpful for their intended purposes. I'm especially interested by anything that significantly aided creative flow, working memory or recall.

If this thread picks up I'll start posting my findings/experiences here.

 

[zago]

Piracetam + choline is supposed to be one of the more popular nootropic stacks.
I'd like to try adderol and/or modafinil.
Creatine enhances cognitive function and is found in Body Fortress whey protein, which is what I take.
Bacopa Monnieri enhances memory, learning, and cognitive performance.
Rhodiola Rosea, Spanish sage...... also.

 

[badger055]

Modafinil is supposed to be the best one I think. Not so good for creativity though. Schizophrenia is in my family so I can't risk it.

I tried a bunch of other supplements that had little to no beneficial effect. Except melatonin that I use for sleeping. I have problems with being foggy or out of it so I'm always experimenting with new things to keep my mental state higher.

I'm curious to know about your results.

 

[Opal]

Piracetam + choline is supposed to be one of the more popular nootropic stacks.
I'd like to try adderol and/or modafinil.
Creatine enhances cognitive function and is found in Body Fortress whey protein, which is what I take.
Bacopa Monnieri enhances memory, learning, and cognitive performance.
Rhodiola Rosea, Spanish sage...... also.

Piracetam/choline can be helpful; given the right ratio of piracetam:choline and piracetam dosage you'll likely experience increased verbal fluidity, word recall, linear thinking abilities, attention, and processing speed. These tend to compound to greater social confidence/lowered social anxiety for me. If the ratio is skewed you'll end up with brain fog, a headache, or both, and if the dosage is lower than 4.8g (recommended is actually 800mg) you'll experience a decrease in global complexity, which may be helpful for manual labor, or rote memorization, but potentially detrimental for critical thinking. I actually have more experience with piracetam analogues than piracetam itself.

I haven't tried Adderall or Modafinil, but I've tried Modafinil's OTC analogue, Adrafinil. It's more subtle than you would expect; I never felt overstimulated, but I definitely didn't feel understimulated, either. It kept me alert and functioning at a consistent (slightly above average) level for around 12 hours. The next day was foggier than expected, possibly from poor sleep. Adrafinil is supposed to stress the liver considerably, so also taking acetylcysteine might be advisable.

Also, both of these have the potential to trigger mania in susceptible individuals.

I took both creatine and bacopa monnieri for a period of 2-3 months around a year ago and experienced very notably increased memory storage and recall; after mindlessly typing my debit card number into online forms for maybe a year I did so while on bacopa and fully memorized it along with the expiration date and security code. I hadn't attempted to memorize it before, so I was rather surprised it suddenly stuck.

I have some experience with rhodiola, though I've never taken it for an extended period of time. For me it seems to function as a stimulant; I can swap it out for caffeine, sulbutiamine, l-tyrosine, or presumably adrafinil, for similar effect. I think rhodiola can also trigger mania.

Has anyone tried Spanish Sage?

Modafinil is supposed to be the best one I think. Not so good for creativity though. Schizophrenia is in my family so I can't risk it.

I tried a bunch of other supplements that had little to no beneficial effect. Except melatonin that I use for sleeping. I have problems with being foggy or out of it so I'm always experimenting with new things to keep my mental state higher.

I'm curious to know about your results.

Huh, what other supplements had little to no beneficial effect? Some take weeks to months to build in your system and produce a perceptible effect (such as bacopa and, to a lesser extent, piracetam).

 

[Halla74]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned Hydergine yet - if they have but by a different name then Ooopsy on my:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ergoloid

The combination of nootropics/smart drugs I read most about many years ago was "Hydergine + Piracetam"

http://forum.lef.org/default.aspx?f=37&m=16284

and...

http://www.consciousnesscafe.org/2005/01/nootropics-alert-on-hydergine.html

Don't forget that taking some nootropics along with prescription CNS stimulants (Adderall, Vyvanse, Ritalin + any and all combos or generics) can KILL You - such as:
Deprenyl + (Any Amphetamine) = Tachycardia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selegiline (see Adverse Effects)


Interestingly enough "Keppra" (Levetiracetam) has been sold (as a prescription drug) alternative to Klonipin/Clonazepam as an anticonvulsant/anti-seizure medication.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Levetiracetam and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clonazepam

My Mother was put on it as a preventative measure after brain surgery this past October where a 2cm X 3cm acoustic neuroma was removed from the region of her brain near her pons and (right) vestibulocochlear nerve.
She told me that the Keppra made her dizzy and made her feel as if she were going to fall when she was walking around.
She also indicated that Valium had never made her feel as disoriented as the Keppra.
So, she told her neurosurgeon that she was not going to take it and that was that. She's walking around just fine.
This is further evidence, IMHO, that there is an overzealous desire to eliminate any possible use of benzodiazepines from modern medicine in place of newer medications that have not demonstrated greater efficacy for similar purposes (especially in long-term studies) - but that do offer a major corporation opportunity for massive profit via a brand new patent.
In this case I think that is further shite because Keppra is simply a purified form of an already existing non-patented substance, much like Rozerem is highly purified Melatonin, but a bottle of one costs you $8, and a 30 tablets of the other $185.

Provigil is indeed an interesting medication.

http://www.medicinenet.com/modafinil/article.htm

I took it for one month to see if it was effective as an alternative to Adderall for my ADHD.
In that regard Provigil failed miserably. I took it for 5 days and wound up a complete mess, awake enough for sure - but hardly able at all to pay attention.
However, the 25 tablets I did have left over were very effective over the course of the next year whenever I had a long drive to make, a long night at the office and an equally long next day, etc.
BUT - I tell you this: Any amount of wakefulness you get from taking Modafinil will be taken from you once you stop taking it - at least that was my experience.
In one instance I took it for two days straight - and after the third day, when I went to bed I CRASHED for about 15 hours. I never sleep more than 6 - 7 hours on any regular night if that reference point is useful in considering what I wrote above.

Creatine monohydrate it AWSM. I've used it on and off since 1994 as a weight lifting supplement. Bang for your buck it is hard to beat with regard to giving you a noticeable increase in muscular size and performance in a short amount of time. At a base weight of 235 pounds I can get up to 245 pounds of bodyweight in 10 days or less just by ingesting one nasty, tropical punch flavored scoop of creatine per day as a post workout recovery tonic. If it increases brainpower too, well then fuck it - I'm in again.

CONCLUSION:
-----------------

I think nootropics are interesting, but I also think that there is significant danger in taking them - especially if you already have one or more psychoactive substances, be it an Rx medication, OTC, or of naturopathic formulation. Not enough studies have been done for us to fully understand the side effects of one or more with all the others - and the reason is simple - there is no profit in doing so.
I haven't fucked with them. Maybe when I'm old and grey and want to get better at crossword puzzles while I sit in my diaper at a nursing home I'll grab a few bottles of the latest and greatest nootropics and put to shame the best that the New York Times has to offer. Or maybe I'll be chillin' like a villain at a tropical bungalow doing the limbo with the natives while sipping Mojitos. Only time will tell, and as the blind man said "We shall see."

Be safe and don't fuck with anything that can fuck you up.



-Halla74

 

[Mole]

Nootropics and the Noosphere

There is the lithosphere: the sphere of rock around the Earth.

And there is the aquasphere: the sphere of water around the Earth.

And there is the atmosphere: the sphere of air around the Earth.

And there is the magnetosphere: the sphere of magnetism around the Earth.

And there is the biosphere: the sphere of life around the Earth.

And there is the noosphere: the sphere of mind around the Earth.

And the greatest nootropic (cognitive enhancer) is the noosphere.

 

[zago]

I got some l-theanine coming in the mail. Gonna see how it fairs with my caffeine pills. Should be fun. I'll post results.

 

[Mole]

Cognitive enhancers have been found to create the illusion for a time that we are smarter, or that our cognitive abilities have been enhanced.

And those who use cognitive enhancers very likely have deep seated psychological problems.

And we can find those with similar problems in free self help groups.

A good place to start for free self help groups is Share!

 

[Opal]

Cognitive enhancers have been found to create the illusion for a time that we are smarter, or that our cognitive abilities have been enhanced.

And those who use cognitive enhancers very likely have deep seated psychological problems.

And we can find those with similar problems in free self help groups.

A good place to start for free self help groups is Share!

Feelin' antagonistic? Some compounds do quantifiably boost certain cognitive dimensions--they're not just sugar pills.
I think it's fair to say most people who seek any sort of mind-altering substance have deep seated psychological problems, some more minor than others. But the world needs art, y'know?

Also, plenty of what I'll discuss here is natural and more for the sake of rounding oneself out nutritionally than, say, inhibiting the reuptake of acetylcholine.

 

[Mole]

Feelin' antagonistic? Some compounds do quantifiably boost certain cognitive dimensions--they're not just sugar pills.
I think it's fair to say most people who seek any sort of mind-altering substance have deep seated psychological problems, some more minor than others. But the world needs art, y'know?

Also, plenty of what I'll discuss here is natural and more for the sake of rounding oneself out nutritionally than, say, inhibiting the reuptake of acetylcholine.

Almost everyone with psychological problems comes to Typology Central for illusions.

They come for the illusion of mbti and they come for the illusion of astrology. And more generally they come for the illusions of the New Age Movement.

But worse, those with psychological problems come to Typology Central not to have their psychological problems cured but to have them validated by their peers.

The come, not to have their drug problems cured, but to have them validated by their peers.

And they come, not to have their fetishes cured, but to have their fetishes validated by their peers.

 

[Opal]

Almost everyone with psychological problems comes to Typology Central for illusions.

They come for the illusion of mbti and they come for the illusion of astrology. And more generally they come for the illusions of the New Age Movement.

But worse, those with psychological problems come to Typology Central not to have their psychological problems cured but to have them validated by their peers.

The come, not to have their drug problems cured, but to have them validated by their peers.

And they come, not to have their fetishes cured, but to have their fetishes validated by their peers.

Those are wise words, Mole. Thank you.

If anyone else has personal experience they'd like to share, preferably related to the OP, I hope they feel comfortable doing so.

I feel I shouldn't have to say this, but I don't condone doing any of the things I've discussed or will discuss here. This thread's usefulness hinges on there being others with similar life experience/current issues in this community. The topic of cognitive enhancement is especially prevalent among students, and if I can provide information and anecdotes that help steer someone toward healthier, more useful options I'll consider it worth the effort.