[ENFJ] Unhealthy ENFJ ARE like ISTP or INTJ ?

[AStrange~Nostalgia]

I have been wondering for a while about that . I know the rule that 'under stress the personality type shift to its opposite functions' so I tried asking some ENFJ'S with previous 'depression' and some said they were more like INTJ , and others were more like ISTP.
Personally I somehow experienced both.

So for those of you who experienced that how do you describe it and which did you seem more like ?
And why is it different for some? Does enneagram has anything to do with this?

 

[Tilt]

I was more like an exaggerated INFJ with a fixation on Ni and Ti. But as I got healthier, I realized how drained I felt relying mostly on the introverted functions...that's how I settled on being an extrovert.

 

[Quick]

First off, Jungian Analytical Psychology is a FULL system.

Identifying the unconscious in oneself is something that requires time and experience.

I know I have Ji (Dom) and Ni (Aux). These are obvious for me to identify. If you really want to be able to identify your Unconscious Functions, you DO NOT look at your thought process AT ALL. That is like trying to tell a joke saying "Why did the chicken cross the road?" And your audience giggles and says "Why?" and you say "IDK". To put it simply, it is a very very bad joke. So what does that leave us with? The answer is to look at your behaviors, specifically, you have to ask yourself "What are my unhealthy behaviors?" This is not easy because it is a humbling experience that forces you to identify your weaknesses. Furthermore, "Typing" yourself is NOT a trivial thing. When someone asked Jung what psychological type he categorized himself as, he basically said "I have thought about this question a lot, and it is a painful experience."

Personal example: I know that I have Unconscious Se. How do I know this? Because I am a smoker and I drink a lot of soda. Those are things I do that effect a physiological response i.e. sensory stimulus, which manifests itself in an unhealthy way because they are harmful to my own well being.

OK, so if you want to know how I know I have Ni as Aux, this is relatively trivial in comparison from me being able to discover Se is in my Unconscious Functions. I have not read the entirety of "Psychological Types", but what I have read, I can say to pretty high confidence levels that I actually understand what Jung was getting at. Along with this, If you look at the Functional Illistration I made on how Functions manifest themselves in People according to Jung, what I was able to intuite about how they work was almost completely 100% correct according to someone who understands Jung's works far far better than myself in part because they have studied Jung for a much longer time period than me and reading things about Jung that I probably could not even recognise as something that came from Jung.

 

[Red Memories]

Shadow functions work in opposite, so ENFJ would be ISTP.

 

[AStrange~Nostalgia]

Shadow functions work in opposite, so ENFJ would be ISTP.

Well that is general ; not every one let ALL their functions change even under great stress . so why is it different between the same type , is it because of different enneagrams ?

 

[AStrange~Nostalgia]

First off, Jungian Analytical Psychology is a FULL system.

Identifying the unconscious in oneself is something that requires time and experience.

I know I have Ji (Dom) and Ni (Aux). These are obvious for me to identify. If you really want to be able to identify your Unconscious Functions, you DO NOT look at your thought process AT ALL. That is like trying to tell a joke saying "Why did the chicken cross the road?" And your audience giggles and says "Why?" and you say "IDK". To put it simply, it is a very very bad joke. So what does that leave us with? The answer is to look at your behaviors, specifically, you have to ask yourself "What are my unhealthy behaviors?" This is not easy because it is a humbling experience that forces you to identify your weaknesses. Furthermore, "Typing" yourself is NOT a trivial thing. When someone asked Jung what psychological type he categorized himself as, he basically said "I have thought about this question a lot, and it is a painful experience."

Personal example: I know that I have Unconscious Se. How do I know this? Because I am a smoker and I drink a lot of soda. Those are things I do that effect a physiological response i.e. sensory stimulus, which manifests itself in an unhealthy way because they are harmful to my own well being.

OK, so if you want to know how I know I have Ni as Aux, this is relatively trivial in comparison from me being able to discover Se is in my Unconscious Functions. I have not read the entirety of "Psychological Types", but what I have read, I can say to pretty high confidence levels that I actually understand what Jung was getting at. Along with this, If you look at the Functional Illistration I made on how Functions manifest themselves in People according to Jung, what I was able to intuite about how they work was almost completely 100% correct according to someone who understands Jung's works far far better than myself in part because they have studied Jung for a much longer time period than me and reading things about Jung that I probably could not even recognise as something that came from Jung.

It is true . I didn't recognise it easily but I was for about a year in a bad psych condition , I was not myself , but I couldn't tell easily if I was like an ISTP because I have always found myself as a one when it comes to knowing shortcuts to studying at last moment a day before exam if I have studied at all ; I could easily pass though. But significantly I felt numb , I cared about nothing , no motivation for whatever I was slaking even beyond deadlines , I never finished anything and COMPLETELY became Introverted and was uncomfortable being around people even family.

But around the end of it , I once had a frustrating experience of ppl shutting me down for my tries to survive and change for the better .So I was in a state to drown again in depression even worse than before . BUT I stood upon myself and refused to supmit and die in soul , I said I don't need people I'll change this world myself independently , with the strongest J I've ever felt in my life (INTJ ,it only went on for the next day) , but I was scared of my self change, and I survived because of that. I pushed myself to be INTJ because at that time it's all I needed.

And I'm certainly not a person who understands domes but I DO know how other personalities feel for sure.
And can impersonate most of them and know how their every move feels like and why.

 

[Tilt]

Well that is general ; not every one let ALL their functions change even under great stress . so why is it different between the same type , is it because of different enneagrams ?

At least for me, I have PTSD related to OTHER PEOPLE and have trust issues stemming from that so I emotionally shut down and isolated myself. Being the extrovert I am, it caused a lot of depression and internal conflict. My Se was pretty nonexistent, because my hypervigilance would easily overwhelm with sensory overload. It's tough to desire friendships and relationships while also being afraid of other people in general. I honestly think that if I was a true introvert, I would have enjoyed my alone time instead of getting into dark thoughts almost every time. In reality, random conversations and interactions can do more for my mood than anything else can...it's almost instant.

I am in a much better place now, but I just wanted to share my take on stress and type!

 

[AStrange~Nostalgia]

I really do appreciate your effort to share this.

This helps to understand the different worlds but same personality thing ,and to be open minded to hear every ones part of the story .

Your words about random coversations and alone times really hits me deep every time. It is just that way ! We can't get rid of our negativity and dark thought easily without others .Even reading one massage helps alot ..as simple as that. And the few cases I know of ENFJ in their bad times are mostly because of lonliness.

We are E so we start fading without love and support; thats why we can't stand conflict. I think I need more friendly interactions , and actual intellectual conversations .I'm getting moody recently. Unfortunately at some point we avoid people though we need them most.

 

[Chernushka]

I have been wondering for a while about that . I know the rule that 'under stress the personality type shift to its opposite functions' so I tried asking some ENFJ'S with previous 'depression' and some said they were more like INTJ , and others were more like ISTP.
Personally I somehow experienced both.

So for those of you who experienced that how do you describe it and which did you seem more like ?
And why is it different for some? Does enneagram has anything to do with this?

Well, I'll give you my two cents. At the unhealthiest points in my life, when I look back on it, I was acting like a crazy ass ESFJ. At this time I typed as INFJ, but I realize I was much less of an ESTP. Now that I'm doing better, I managed to pin my type down. I'd not be surprised if worn-down ENFJs were like unhealthy ISTPs.