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  1. #81
    Senior Member Justin of Flavia Neapolis's Avatar
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    Why Is Jordan Peterson So Popular? - The Atlantic

    The alarms sounded when Peterson published what quickly became a massive bestseller, 12 Rules for Life, because books are something that the left recognizes as drivers of culture. The book became the occasion for vicious profiles and editorials, but it was difficult to attack the work on ideological grounds, because it was an apolitical self-help book that was at once more literary and more helpful than most, and that was moreover a commercial success. All of this frustrated the critics. It’s just common sense! they would say, in one arch way or another, and that in itself was telling: Why were they so angry about common sense?

    The critics knew the book was a bestseller, but they couldn’t really grasp its reach because people like them weren’t reading it, and because it did not originally appear on The New York Times’s list, as it was first published in Canada. However, it is often the bestselling nonfiction book on Amazon, and—perhaps more important—its audiobook has been a massive seller. As with Peterson’s podcasts and videos, the audience is made up of people who are busy with their lives—folding laundry, driving commercial trucks on long hauls, sitting in traffic from cubicle to home, exercising. This book was putting words to deeply held feelings that many of them had not been able to express before.
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  2. #82
    Armchair Explorer Doctor Anaximander's Avatar
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    I was just about to post that same article.

    I read another piece recently, written by a young college student trying to explain Peterson's appeal. While 12 Rules seems like common sense to anyone born before a certain date, the gist of it was that to younger people just now reaching adulthood, a lot of the wisdom put forth in the book is surprisingly alien and unheard of to them. I think this explains his popularity with a lot of young people. And I don't think his popularity is in any way limited young, frustrated white dudes, despite that repeated narrative coming from critics of Peterson.

  3. #83
    Armchair Explorer Doctor Anaximander's Avatar
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    this part:
    Because all of this was happening silently, called down from satellites and poured in through earbuds
    reminds me of this:


  4. #84
    Armchair Explorer Doctor Anaximander's Avatar
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    Although I do think the idea of "common sense" is overrated and questionable....on the flip, yeah, why are people so freaked about "common sense" in JP's work?

  5. #85
    Armchair Explorer Doctor Anaximander's Avatar
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    When the poetry editors of The Nation virtuously publish an amateurish but super-woke poem, only to discover that the poem stumbled across several trip wires of political correctness; when these editors (one of them a full professor in the Harvard English department) then jointly write a letter oozing bathos and career anxiety and begging forgiveness from their critics; when the poet himself publishes a statement of his own—a missive falling somewhere between an apology, a Hail Mary pass, and a suicide note; and when all of this is accepted in the houses of the holy as one of the regrettable but minor incidents that take place along the path toward greater justice, something is dying.
    Here, by the way, is the referenced poem:

    If you got hiv, say aids. If you a girl,
    say you’re pregnant––nobody gonna lower
    themselves to listen for the kick. People
    passing fast. Splay your legs, cock a knee
    funny. It’s the littlest shames they’re likely
    to comprehend. Don’t say homeless, they know
    you is. What they don’t know is what opens
    a wallet, what stops em from counting
    what they drop. If you’re young say younger.
    Old say older. If you’re crippled don’t
    flaunt it. Let em think they’re good enough
    Christians to notice. Don’t say you pray,
    say you sin. It’s about who they believe
    they is. You hardly even there.
    Why the outrage over this poem again? Can someone enlighten me? I find it to be insightful and it really speaks volumes about the nature of marginalization and charity.

    I grew up when it was a thing for the right wing to criticize and attack new art. It was kind of expected that would come from reactionary elements. It's scary when the left has become just as reactionary, easily offended and uptight as the right. Anyway, I realize this is the spirituality subforum so apologies if I got too political there.

  6. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by asynartetic View Post
    Although I do think the idea of "common sense" is overrated and questionable....on the flip, yeah, why are people so freaked about "common sense" in JP's work?
    Its kind of why they freak about gateway drugs or phishing scams.

  7. #87
    I'm too sad for pants. Z Buck McFate's Avatar
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    Gabor Maté (author of Realm Of the Hungry Ghosts and When the Body Says No) posted these thoughts on Peterson today. (Full twitter thread here).

    Peterson no doubt genuinely means to empower young men (and perhaps women) with his "12 Rules for Living". And indeed, responsibility and knowledge of self are positive and healthful qualities—but ONLY if accompanied by a fully explored emotional life.

    Sadly his message, like his health, is being compromised by a choked rage that distorts his world-view. Hence his appeal to those who, perceiving themselves as victimized by the culture & threatened by social change, seek comforting explanations for their anger and insecurity.

    Personally, while I do think Peterson has some valuable things to share - I do find myself unsettled by the things Maté mentions in the second paragraph above (and I mostly agree with it).

    For some context/comparison, one of my favorite quotes from Maté's When the Body Says No: "Emotional competence is the capacity that enables us to stand in a responsible, non-victimized, and non-self-harming relationship with our environment. It is the required internal ground for facing life's inevitable stresses, for avoiding the creation of unnecessary ones and for furthering the healing process. Few of us reach the adult age with anything close to full emotional competence. Recognizing our lack of it is not cause for self-judgment, only a call for further development and transformation."
    Reality is a collective hunch. -Lily Tomlin

    INFJ 5w4 sx/sp Johari / Nohari -or- disagree with my type?
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  8. #88
    Senior Member Forever_Jung's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Z Buck McFate View Post
    Gabor Maté (author of Realm Of the Hungry Ghosts and When the Body Says No) posted these thoughts on Peterson today. (Full twitter thread here).

    Peterson no doubt genuinely means to empower young men (and perhaps women) with his "12 Rules for Living". And indeed, responsibility and knowledge of self are positive and healthful qualities—but ONLY if accompanied by a fully explored emotional life.

    Sadly his message, like his health, is being compromised by a choked rage that distorts his world-view. Hence his appeal to those who, perceiving themselves as victimized by the culture & threatened by social change, seek comforting explanations for their anger and insecurity.

    Personally, while I do think Peterson has some valuable things to share - I do find myself unsettled by the things Maté mentions in the second paragraph above (and I mostly agree with it).

    For some context/comparison, one of my favorite quotes from Maté's When the Body Says No: "Emotional competence is the capacity that enables us to stand in a responsible, non-victimized, and non-self-harming relationship with our environment. It is the required internal ground for facing life's inevitable stresses, for avoiding the creation of unnecessary ones and for furthering the healing process. Few of us reach the adult age with anything close to full emotional competence. Recognizing our lack of it is not cause for self-judgment, only a call for further development and transformation."
    I love that take from Maté! I was initially very drawn to Peterson's ideas, since I am big on Jung and Campbell. However, Peterson's tendency to froth from the mouth when certain topics trigger him, turned me off. There is something a little...unbalanced about him. At times he reminds me of an old-timey preacher, railing against sodomy or something. He gets enraged by stupid things like Disney's Frozen, and almost has a brain aneurysm if anyone even says the word "postmodern" or "Marxist", and yet he doesn't seem to understand either term on a very deep level. I also think he is being a bit disingenuous when he claims that his ideas just sort of "happen" to galvanize angry young men, and tries to convince interviewers he is as surprised as anyone.

    I still find him interesting, but I just don't seek his stuff out like I used to.

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