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random history thoughts

Doctor Cringelord

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The Olympic Class ship line was a success for the most part, nothing cursed about it. I hate it when people cloud hindsight with magical thinking.
 

Doctor Cringelord

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Consider that the Brittanic only sunk due to a mine, and the crew acted bravely and efficiently to evacuate nearly all lives. 30 died, but that was due to lifeboats that were accidentally deployed without the Captain's consent while he still had the engines running--they were pulled into the port side propeller, which was already partly above the water line due to the ship's bow tilting forward. When he realized what was happening, orders were given to stop the engines.

The captain was attempting to steer the ship to a nearby island in hopes of beaching the vessel so that it might be salvaged, but the rudder sustained damage and wouldn't function. In a last ditch attempt, he cut the power to the starboard propeller in hopes that the port and center propellers would steer the ship to the island. It might have worked, but the catch 22 here was that the forward propulsion caused water to flood more rapidly into the damaged hull--they simply couldn't make it to the beach at the rate she was sinking. After one final attempt at turning the engines back on and heading for the island, the captain cut the engines a final time and decided to continue evacuating everyone. It was very close, with the final crew members left on the bridge only jumping out once everyone else had evacuated and the water was already beginning to creep onto the bridge deck. This ship sank in about half the time it took Titanic to go down, so it is pretty remarkable they got everyone out before the final plunge.


Had Brittanic, given her improved designs, hit the same iceberg and at the same angle as her ill fated sister ship, she most likely would have survived at least until the Carpathia arrived on the scene--it is likely she would've stayed above the waterline but with a severe list. She may have even been able to limp back to port for repairs. The Brittanic also had some motorized lifeboats. Had the Titanic had one of these, they could have motored to the nearby California to request assistance (the California crew saw the lights of the Titanic but were unaware of the situation due to having shut their radio off for the night. They almost certainly could have made it to the Titanic in time had they known).


Given all of that, I consider the Brittanic a success compared to Titanic. If not for the mine she hit, she probably would've stayed in service for decades like her sister Olympic. Olympic herself might've stayed in service even longer, but by the mid-thirties, the world was in an economic crisis. It was more feasible to scrap her. If she'd not been scrapped, she might be a museum ship today.


I actually find the story of the Brittanic more fascinating and exciting, but I can see why it's less known, as it wasn't a disaster on the same level as Titanic, thus failing to fuel as much of the morbid curiosity that tends to linger over disasters like Titanic and Hindenburg.

Here is a real-time animation of the Brittanic's final plunge. Although she didn't split in half like her sister, they otherwise went down in a very similar manner, although Brittanic in considerably more shallow waters. The final 15-20 minutes or so of either ship's sinking must have been terrifying, as it suddenly became more rapid. The hours prior as either ship sank more slowly must have lulled some crew and passengers into a false sense of security.

 
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Doctor Cringelord

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It would be funny if you were on the ship and you heard this voice in the sky repeatedly saying "that looks pretty good. that looks right!"

 

Burning Paradigm

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I only recently learned about the Soviet invasion of Manchuria towards the end of WWII. Fascinating stuff.
 

ceecee

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Grant was actually one of the better U.S. Presidents, not the failure he’s been painted as by lost cause revisionists.
Agreed. And Grant was the only president to vigorously pursue Reconstruction and the first to treat blacks as both human and American. If nothing else, he was a decent man - federal Indian policy, secured the national currency, crushed the KKK. But you have to take into account what was happening in Congress and how much of a roadblock they created for his presidency.

And considering what proceeded him - one of the worst presidents of all time and the one I would absolutely want to fight if given the opportunity, MFer talked like current Republicans too - I also think the specter of corruption and the real cult of Lee that seemed to continue shitty treatment of Grant by historians for a long time, is coming to an end.

9/10 - would vote again
 
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Julius_Van_Der_Beak

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Agreed. And Grant was the only president to vigorously pursue Reconstruction and the first to treat blacks as both human and American. If nothing else, he was a decent man - federal Indian policy, secured the national currency, crushed the KKK. But you have to take into account what was happening in Congress and how much of a roadblock they created for his presidency.

And considering what proceeded him - one of the worst presidents of all time and the one I would absolutely want to fight if given the opportunity, MFer talked like current Republicans too - I also think the specter of corruption and the real cult of Lee that seemed to continue shitty treatment of Grant by historians for a long time, is coming to an end.

9/10 - would vote again
Both the AJs are really awful. I also dislike James K. Polk a great deal, but most people don't know who that is, which is curious because he's actually fairly significant. The main thing people need to know about Polk is that he's responsible for the Mexican-American war and therefore the acquisition of large amounts of territory in the Southwest from Mexico.

I would guess that whether you see that as a good or bad thing tracks to your attitude towards 21st century conflicts pretty well.
 
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Doctor Cringelord

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Agreed. And Grant was the only president to vigorously pursue Reconstruction and the first to treat blacks as both human and American. If nothing else, he was a decent man - federal Indian policy, secured the national currency, crushed the KKK. But you have to take into account what was happening in Congress and how much of a roadblock they created for his presidency.

And considering what proceeded him - one of the worst presidents of all time and the one I would absolutely want to fight if given the opportunity, MFer talked like current Republicans too - I also think the specter of corruption and the real cult of Lee that seemed to continue shitty treatment of Grant by historians for a long time, is coming to an end.

9/10 - would vote again
He basically destroyed the first incarnation of the KKK.
 

Doctor Cringelord

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Are there any real liberal republicans left? Schwarzenegger, maybe?

Curious to see what the seventh party system is going to look like, since we’re still in a transitional phase from the sixth party system. How the 2024 election goes will be key, and after that we may see another great realignment. The boomers are rapidly dying off too.

It’s true in a sense that some elections really are more important and critical than others.
 
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Doctor Cringelord

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Historically, we’ve averaged a Presidential death in office roughly every 20 years, either by natural causes or assassination. We’re currently well overdue. I hope Joe doesn’t die in office but odds aren’t great considering his age and the overall stress of the job. And if Trump gets elected again, we’ll he’s no spring chicken either.
 

Doctor Cringelord

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Presidents who had the game on easy mode: Monroe, Coolidge, Reagan, Clinton

Presidents who had the game on Hardcore/Survival mode: Lincoln, Hoover, FDR, Truman, Obama

Most of the others played on normal to hard

President who had one shot kills turned on: William Henry Harrison
 
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The Cat

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He basically destroyed the first incarnation of the KKK.
except he didn't though.

"Due to limited federal resources, Grant decided to make an example of several counties in the piedmont region of South Carolina, where some of the worst violence and lawlessness was taking place. After the Klan in that area failed to heed Grant’s warning, he utilized the Third Force Act. President Grant suspended habeas corpus (the right of a detained person to request help from a court to determine if their imprisonment is lawful) and declared martial law in nine mostly upstate South Carolina counties. Detachments of the 7th U.S. Cavalry were stationed in the area and worked to gather information and intelligence on local Klan activities. The military and US. Marshals then rounded up suspected Klan members for trial. The military then worked with the Department of Justice and Grant’s Attorney General, Amos Akerman, to prosecute KKK members suspected of engaging in terroristic violence. The Department of Justice had recently been established under the Attorney General's authority after President Grant asked Congress to pass a law establishing the office, which was done on June 22, 1870. The Justice Department aimed to protect the rights of newly-freed African Americans and serve as the federal government's enforcement mechanism for the various laws described above.

These efforts had mixed success. During the period of martial law, many Klan members went into hiding or fled. Federal resources were thin and Grant’s political adversaries—both North and South—railed against the alleged overreach of federal power as a violation of federalism. Issues of state and federal jurisdiction were often argued more vigorously than the seriousness of the crime itself. Akerman resigned as Attorney General in the end of 1871, ending the federal government’s most vigorous period of enforcement. Many convicted KKK members were given light sentences. Later, the increasing takeover by the Democrats of state and local governments made the Klan less relevant because White supremacists gained control of the laws in the South."

 

ceecee

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except he didn't though.

"Due to limited federal resources, Grant decided to make an example of several counties in the piedmont region of South Carolina, where some of the worst violence and lawlessness was taking place. After the Klan in that area failed to heed Grant’s warning, he utilized the Third Force Act. President Grant suspended habeas corpus (the right of a detained person to request help from a court to determine if their imprisonment is lawful) and declared martial law in nine mostly upstate South Carolina counties. Detachments of the 7th U.S. Cavalry were stationed in the area and worked to gather information and intelligence on local Klan activities. The military and US. Marshals then rounded up suspected Klan members for trial. The military then worked with the Department of Justice and Grant’s Attorney General, Amos Akerman, to prosecute KKK members suspected of engaging in terroristic violence. The Department of Justice had recently been established under the Attorney General's authority after President Grant asked Congress to pass a law establishing the office, which was done on June 22, 1870. The Justice Department aimed to protect the rights of newly-freed African Americans and serve as the federal government's enforcement mechanism for the various laws described above.

These efforts had mixed success. During the period of martial law, many Klan members went into hiding or fled. Federal resources were thin and Grant’s political adversaries—both North and South—railed against the alleged overreach of federal power as a violation of federalism. Issues of state and federal jurisdiction were often argued more vigorously than the seriousness of the crime itself. Akerman resigned as Attorney General in the end of 1871, ending the federal government’s most vigorous period of enforcement. Many convicted KKK members were given light sentences. Later, the increasing takeover by the Democrats of state and local governments made the Klan less relevant because White supremacists gained control of the laws in the South."

Not much has really changed, has it? Other than the parties completely switching of course.
 

The Cat

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Not much has really changed, has it? Other than the parties completely switching of course.
yeah the game is the same but the propaganda gets revised every 4-5 years or so. Its crazy to think how much money everyone would save if we stopped playing game of thrones with civilization. No one really wins, everyone loses, and the richest billionare only gets to leave with a coffin or an urn, or I suppose in some cases the pitch black stygian void of the abyss. Class warfare is gonna be the death of us all. I sometimes wish there actually were a woke mind virus. It's cheaper to be a good person.

That Andy Johnson he was a real fuckin fuck face and I believe he's a big reason why a lot of this shit dug in down here. He made Reconstruction so much worse than it needed to be. He kinda reminds me of whats his nuts. Nettenyahoo or whatever.
 

ceecee

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Presidents who had the game on easy mode: Monroe, Coolidge, Reagan, Clinton

Presidents who had the game on Hardcore/Survival mode: Lincoln, Hoover, FDR, Truman, Obama

Most of the others played on normal to hard

President who had one shot kills turned on: William Henry Harrison
It's almost unfathomable how easy Regan had it. Nearly every crisis was handled either by his predecessor (Iran hostages) or by outside forces, such as the Cold War's beginning of the end. He said that endless growth and affluence = freedom. He completely squandered any chance to point the US in a new direction, knowing that we had to stop old unsustainable growth path, stabilize the population, then devise, and export, sustainable energy, agricultural, waste disposal and oceanic protection systems. Jimmy Carter understood this but had no ability to put that into words or actions. And nothing more needs to be said about his economic beliefs.

He was a mediocre president that had the luck to be an optimist and able to convey that message to a very depressed US. That's it, that's really all he had to offer, which wasn't surprising as he was an actor. His entire persona was a myth, distorted and emboldened by the right. Even his ranch, which is currently owned and operated by the Young America's Foundation - a group of fashy young conservatives that upholds free speech as a key belief yet likes to file lawsuits against magazines and podcasts that say (and write) things that hurt their feeling in an effort to silence them.
 

Doctor Cringelord

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except he didn't though.

"Due to limited federal resources, Grant decided to make an example of several counties in the piedmont region of South Carolina, where some of the worst violence and lawlessness was taking place. After the Klan in that area failed to heed Grant’s warning, he utilized the Third Force Act. President Grant suspended habeas corpus (the right of a detained person to request help from a court to determine if their imprisonment is lawful) and declared martial law in nine mostly upstate South Carolina counties. Detachments of the 7th U.S. Cavalry were stationed in the area and worked to gather information and intelligence on local Klan activities. The military and US. Marshals then rounded up suspected Klan members for trial. The military then worked with the Department of Justice and Grant’s Attorney General, Amos Akerman, to prosecute KKK members suspected of engaging in terroristic violence. The Department of Justice had recently been established under the Attorney General's authority after President Grant asked Congress to pass a law establishing the office, which was done on June 22, 1870. The Justice Department aimed to protect the rights of newly-freed African Americans and serve as the federal government's enforcement mechanism for the various laws described above.

These efforts had mixed success. During the period of martial law, many Klan members went into hiding or fled. Federal resources were thin and Grant’s political adversaries—both North and South—railed against the alleged overreach of federal power as a violation of federalism. Issues of state and federal jurisdiction were often argued more vigorously than the seriousness of the crime itself. Akerman resigned as Attorney General in the end of 1871, ending the federal government’s most vigorous period of enforcement. Many convicted KKK members were given light sentences. Later, the increasing takeover by the Democrats of state and local governments made the Klan less relevant because White supremacists gained control of the laws in the South."

Yes he did, personally, with a cigar in his mouth and an uzi in each hand. Bandoliers of bullets draped across his bare oiled chest
 

ceecee

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Yes he did, personally, with a cigar in his mouth and an uzi in each hand. Bandoliers of bullets draped across his bare oiled chest
This 100% would have been Teddy Roosevelt in almost any situation. Talking to his cabinet, taking down banks and industrial monopolies, fucking up some corrupt cops...
 

The Cat

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This 100% would have been Teddy Roosevelt in almost any situation. Talking to his cabinet, taking down banks and industrial monopolies, fucking up some corrupt cops...
I like to imagine that Teddy Roosevelt woke up in the morning around 445 and started playing reveille. The kind of dude who would step outside for a fair bout of fisticuffs with anyone feeling froggy enough to ask. Then share a beer afterwards. He's the original Chuck Norris.
 

The Cat

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There has never in the history of shipping or humans been such a thing as free shipping. Free Shipping is just something we tell ourselves to make us feel better as we huddle around the dying light of the fire while out in the darkness lions roar and hyenas laugh at us. Free Shipping is a lie. There is always a price that must be paid.
 
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