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New name, new type

Agent Washington

Softserve Ice Cream
Joined
Jan 24, 2017
Messages
2,053
(Curious to see what others think because the tests I take are no way certain... Things have also changed quite a bit around here, so maybe I have too. :unsure:

Do ask questions if interested :) I'm not exactly sure what kind of questions I should pick because I would likely end up picking a biased set of questions.)

My Keys 2 Cognition results here:


TypoC's Questionnaire Results:

 

skimpit

Active member
Joined
Oct 4, 2016
Messages
717
I'm not sure how to interpret test results, so don't ask me.

But you sure didn't beat around the bush and just posted what people usually ask for, so good on you. I did the opposite of that lol
 

Vendrah

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 26, 2017
Messages
1,940
MBTI Type
NP
Enneagram
952
Ill reorganize like this:

Test 1:
High: Fi-Ni-Si
Middle 1:Te-Ti-Ne
Low: Fe-Se
Fi > Si > Ni > Ne = Te = Ti > Fe > Se

Test 2:
High: Si-Fi-Ti
Middle 1: Fe-Se
Middle 2: Ne-Ni
Low: Te
Si > Fi = Ti > Fe = Se > Ne > Ni > Te

Assembling:
Always high: Si-Fi
Always Middle: Ne
Always low: None
Uncertain position: Te-Se-Ni-Fe
The dominant functions (always high) is always introverted, and the recessive functions (always low) are always extroverted, so you got to be introverted.

Types with Fi and Si in their first 3 cognitive functions at functions stack:
INFP - Fi>Ne>Si
ISTJ - Si>Te>Fi
I tried to compare other functions, but, besides Fi and Si, all other functions functions seems to be moving and dancing all along, so all I get surely is that you have high Fi and high Si, but the big question is: What is your prefered extroverted function? I dont think you can answer yourself, but the key to this problem is to understand your communication style and how you communicate. If we stop to analise only the extraverted functions we get:
Test 1: Ne=Te>Fe>Se
Test 2: Fe=Se>Ne>Te
Its so different between test and thats the source of the confusion.

Combining INFP and ISTJ to get ISFJ is tempting, but your Fe is always significant lower than your Fi in both tests, so you should not be ISFJ.
You should not be ENFP because the introversion is clear.
The question towards INFP and ISTJ is interesting, it depends on your favorite extraverted function. You could try a third test with cognitive function and 4-letter code type. I do have a lot of questions, questions this time is my plan B:
1) Had you done tests like these in the past? If yes, how did they looked like?
2) Things change in which way in terms of your freedom? Do you feel more limited or more free now?
3) Are you exercising or experiencing something now that demands you to be more rational (like starting to get a math or engineering degree) or to be more sentimental?
4) This is a little bit difficult, but how do you communicate and what is your comunication style? Maybe I should try searching your posts lol.
5) Do you like structured enviroments? Or prefer a more independent enviroment?
6) How do you help people when help is needed? When someone is depressed because of a problem for example.
7) Would you prefer a stable and reliable life or a life more opened to surprises (suppose that none of these surprises are a complete disaster that ruins your entire life, but some should be bad)?
8) Do you practice more convergent or divergent thinking or none? These images helps clarify:
Divergent: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-VRZ_kofZ6...I0/WtDJV5StFEs/s1600/Nilsson+Div+and+Conv.jpg
Convergent: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-wkyMXPv9k...BBmEFr8/s1600/Nilsson+Convergent+Thinking.jpg
 

Agent Washington

Softserve Ice Cream
Joined
Jan 24, 2017
Messages
2,053
Ill reorganize like this:

Test 1:
High: Fi-Ni-Si
Middle 1:Te-Ti-Ne
Low: Fe-Se
Fi > Si > Ni > Ne = Te = Ti > Fe > Se

Test 2:
High: Si-Fi-Ti
Middle 1: Fe-Se
Middle 2: Ne-Ni
Low: Te
Si > Fi = Ti > Fe = Se > Ne > Ni > Te

Assembling:
Always high: Si-Fi
Always Middle: Ne
Always low: None
Uncertain position: Te-Se-Ni-Fe
The dominant functions (always high) is always introverted, and the recessive functions (always low) are always extroverted, so you got to be introverted.

Types with Fi and Si in their first 3 cognitive functions at functions stack:
INFP - Fi>Ne>Si
ISTJ - Si>Te>Fi
I tried to compare other functions, but, besides Fi and Si, all other functions functions seems to be moving and dancing all along, so all I get surely is that you have high Fi and high Si, but the big question is: What is your prefered extroverted function? I dont think you can answer yourself, but the key to this problem is to understand your communication style and how you communicate. If we stop to analise only the extraverted functions we get:
Test 1: Ne=Te>Fe>Se
Test 2: Fe=Se>Ne>Te
Its so different between test and thats the source of the confusion.

Wow! This is an incredible method and an interesting way of organizing the information gained from the tests. Thank you so much for letting me know your thought processes. I think the way both tests are structured lead it to be different because the TypoC one leads me to change the answers by using comparison. Dichotomy wise it would go ahead and change again depending on mood, which is why I posted these. I also think test 2 defines Fe differently from Test 1.

Onto the questions:

1) Had you done tests like these in the past? If yes, how did they looked like? Absolutely. I almost always get INTP, actually. Dichotomy testing has also varied a lot depending on my mood; i.e. more recently I started getting INFP and ISTJ, as well as ISTP. Functions on the other hand tend to be a bit less volatile within the past couple of years or so.

2) Things change in which way in terms of your freedom? Do you feel more limited or more free now? In comparison with the past? I feel more limited now. Not sure how I feel about that.

3) Are you exercising or experiencing something now that demands you to be more rational (like starting to get a math or engineering degree) or to be more sentimental? I'm experiencing something that demands me to be more sentimental, but I have to get started on my thesis (history). I think it is rational, but the methodology seems to utilise Te rather than Ti; i.e. the research fundamentally depends on existing professional opinions, studies tend to require solid facts to back them up, etc. What has always confused me was whether Ti could be supplemented by Se to reach a result similar to Te, hence my prior ISTP typing.

4) This is a little bit difficult, but how do you communicate and what is your comunication style? Maybe I should try searching your posts lol. A little too concise, I reckon. I tend to be more rational and down-to-earth. A lot of speculation regarding who's doing what, celebrities or not, tend to get shut down with no response, or just a short noncommital "uhuh". My posts tend to be short, as well. I'm unsure how the quality of communication comes across as. I suppose it sounds a bit harsher than I would like it to be.

5) Do you like structured enviroments? Or prefer a more independent enviroment? Independence often results in procrastination, but I prefer independence and no commitment. Unfortunate fact of life is there's always commitment. I need a structured environment to complete my commitments... But I like freedom, or at least the idea of it. I do greatly dislike micromanagers however; it's very unproductive and lowers morale.

6) How do you help people when help is needed? When someone is depressed because of a problem for example. I try to help by just listening and then making them feel validated and not judged, like in therapy.Not that I'm trained, it's just that all the books I read on making connections require a good listener. Unfortunately I think those books aren't very good.

7) Would you prefer a stable and reliable life or a life more opened to surprises (suppose that none of these surprises are a complete disaster that ruins your entire life, but some should be bad)?

I think that's a huge problem because I don't have lots of happy surprises. Just unhappy ones. Keeping this in mind, stable. But let's say I don't have such bad experiences. Then I would like surprises, change in routine, looking at new things, etc.

8) Do you practice more convergent or divergent thinking or none? These images helps clarify:

I think I practise convergent thinking more, but I'm not sure. I generally start by looking at the goals, the required information (premise) needed to accomplish the task, generate one (one) solution, measure that solution (i.e. how well it fits the task), and then focus on that. I then ask whoever is in charge if this plan would work, then focus on it, or go back to step one. But during the process of executing the solution I sometimes stray a lot and follow the ideas that come up divergently, resulting in a need to start over again. Usually I also get feelings of insights, but not as good as Ni doms.

I have trouble discerning between Ne, Te and Ti, so I have serious doubts on my own typing.
 

Vendrah

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 26, 2017
Messages
1,940
MBTI Type
NP
Enneagram
952
Wow! This is an incredible method and an interesting way of organizing the information gained from the tests. Thank you so much for letting me know your thought processes. I think the way both tests are structured lead it to be different because the TypoC one leads me to change the answers by using comparison. Dichotomy wise it would go ahead and change again depending on mood, which is why I posted these. I also think test 2 defines Fe differently from Test 1.

Onto the questions:

1) Had you done tests like these in the past? If yes, how did they looked like? Absolutely. I almost always get INTP, actually. Dichotomy testing has also varied a lot depending on my mood; i.e. more recently I started getting INFP and ISTJ, as well as ISTP. Functions on the other hand tend to be a bit less volatile within the past couple of years or so.

2) Things change in which way in terms of your freedom? Do you feel more limited or more free now? In comparison with the past? I feel more limited now. Not sure how I feel about that.

3) Are you exercising or experiencing something now that demands you to be more rational (like starting to get a math or engineering degree) or to be more sentimental? I'm experiencing something that demands me to be more sentimental, but I have to get started on my thesis (history). I think it is rational, but the methodology seems to utilise Te rather than Ti; i.e. the research fundamentally depends on existing professional opinions, studies tend to require solid facts to back them up, etc. What has always confused me was whether Ti could be supplemented by Se to reach a result similar to Te, hence my prior ISTP typing.

4) This is a little bit difficult, but how do you communicate and what is your comunication style? Maybe I should try searching your posts lol. A little too concise, I reckon. I tend to be more rational and down-to-earth. A lot of speculation regarding who's doing what, celebrities or not, tend to get shut down with no response, or just a short noncommital "uhuh". My posts tend to be short, as well. I'm unsure how the quality of communication comes across as. I suppose it sounds a bit harsher than I would like it to be.

5) Do you like structured enviroments? Or prefer a more independent enviroment? Independence often results in procrastination, but I prefer independence and no commitment. Unfortunate fact of life is there's always commitment. I need a structured environment to complete my commitments... But I like freedom, or at least the idea of it. I do greatly dislike micromanagers however; it's very unproductive and lowers morale.

6) How do you help people when help is needed? When someone is depressed because of a problem for example. I try to help by just listening and then making them feel validated and not judged, like in therapy.Not that I'm trained, it's just that all the books I read on making connections require a good listener. Unfortunately I think those books aren't very good.

7) Would you prefer a stable and reliable life or a life more opened to surprises (suppose that none of these surprises are a complete disaster that ruins your entire life, but some should be bad)?

I think that's a huge problem because I don't have lots of happy surprises. Just unhappy ones. Keeping this in mind, stable. But let's say I don't have such bad experiences. Then I would like surprises, change in routine, looking at new things, etc.

8) Do you practice more convergent or divergent thinking or none? These images helps clarify:

I think I practise convergent thinking more, but I'm not sure. I generally start by looking at the goals, the required information (premise) needed to accomplish the task, generate one (one) solution, measure that solution (i.e. how well it fits the task), and then focus on that. I then ask whoever is in charge if this plan would work, then focus on it, or go back to step one. But during the process of executing the solution I sometimes stray a lot and follow the ideas that come up divergently, resulting in a need to start over again. Usually I also get feelings of insights, but not as good as Ni doms.

I have trouble discerning between Ne, Te and Ti, so I have serious doubts on my own typing.

I took a look at the internet, this should be easy to solve. But it isnt :D
ISTJ and INFP are incredibly different but I could see a connection, now I certainly do see that connection. Since the connection happens on the introverted level it is quite invisible. The differences are visible.

I do have an opinion, an unsure opinion although. Only time can answer really this question, or a deep analysis of your enviroment and your life (and thats not up to me). I have an opinion that you are a INFP trying to fit a SJish structured enviroment.
Three things got me convinced on this.

1 - A quote from quora (I googled ISTJ vs INFP), from "Jennifer R. Smallwood, Student of MBTI":
"If you feel really unsure, you are more than likely an INFP. In my mind, it would be extremely uncommon for an ISTJ to wonder if they might be an INFP.

Here’s why I say this.

ISTJ’s are one of the most common types in society. They are surrounded by other like-minded people on a regular basis, and are very concrete in nature. As a result, they can easily know who they are and their dominate place in society.

INFP’s on the other hand, are very rare, and do not find other like-minded people on a regular basis. They are continually surrounded by ISFJs, ESFJs, ISTJs and ESTJs. They are also abstract in nature. The result? An easy way to lose one’s self and one’s identity. The INFP is raised most often by SJ parents. They are surrounded by them in school and work. They are continually told to be more SJ like, and because it’s all they are around, they end up trying to be one so as to grasp for some kind of connection with people. Being abstract and continually focused on endless possibilities can create confusion as well when trying to understand one’s self in a more concrete manner."
Thats how I campe up with the answer.
Further read and they start to compare the two profiles:
How to know if I'm an ISTJ or INFP - Quora
There is also this guy with the same issue in tumbrl, most answers could apply to you:
MBTI Database — ISTJ vs. INFP?

2 - You said you feel more limited now and you used to score INTP. I also missed that Ti got in the middle and high, which explains how you got INTP result (I dont think you are INTP because of the leading Fi). But, also, in order to get INTP result your Ne should be slightly higher in the past, when you felt you had more freedom. Also, the ISTP results that didnt used to show earlier suggests that your intuition functions dropped over time compared to your sensing functions, suggesting again that Ne dropped and Si likely got stronger. I see that as you changing your personality and preferences in efforts to try to adapt an enviroment which I suggest is a little bit too rigid. Also, supposing that I am right, between 4 personalities (INFP, ISTJ,INTP,ISTP), only INFP got feeling, which made me to conclude that, if your enviroment is rigid like I suggest, it also dislikes you being sentimental. It looks like you suppress your feelings (better: Hide them as much as you can or both) in order to fit.

3 - Answer 5 supports 1 and 2.
 

Agent Washington

Softserve Ice Cream
Joined
Jan 24, 2017
Messages
2,053
I took a look at the internet, this should be easy to solve. But it isnt :D
ISTJ and INFP are incredibly different but I could see a connection, now I certainly do see that connection. Since the connection happens on the introverted level it is quite invisible. The differences are visible.

The order of the stacks is supposed to be the key, I suppose their location affects the trait description. By Dichotomy I could theoretically score any type with I preference depending on my mood, so dichotomy typing isn't helpful... Which leaves one option... ... Ouja board (j/k)

I do have an opinion, an unsure opinion although. Only time can answer really this question, or a deep analysis of your enviroment and your life (and thats not up to me). I have an opinion that you are a INFP trying to fit a SJish structured enviroment.

Actually reading your response brought up a certain idea that might be useful in typing. Some time ago I was convinced that I was a looping ISTJ, because of the high instance of Si and Fi, with Si often scoring higher than Fi. Over time, Fi just grew stronger, until it became a clear preference. The environment, of course, demands SJ traits. But it's not just about fitting into the environment, it's a long-term prospect of the future. I think to some extent I wanted to be an SJ type, because it would be more promising for me in the long run so long as I could get out of the funk and get to use Te more. But I had typed as INTP (Ti-Si) for such a long time, that it just became even more confusing for me.

I think your methodology is refreshing and interesting, and very insightful. Also, very useful for humanities... ;)

1 - A quote from quora (I googled ISTJ vs INFP), from "Jennifer R. Smallwood, Student of MBTI":
"If you feel really unsure, you are more than likely an INFP. In my mind, it would be extremely uncommon for an ISTJ to wonder if they might be an INFP.

Here’s why I say this.

ISTJ’s are one of the most common types in society. They are surrounded by other like-minded people on a regular basis, and are very concrete in nature. As a result, they can easily know who they are and their dominate place in society.

INFP’s on the other hand, are very rare, and do not find other like-minded people on a regular basis. They are continually surrounded by ISFJs, ESFJs, ISTJs and ESTJs. They are also abstract in nature. The result? An easy way to lose one’s self and one’s identity. The INFP is raised most often by SJ parents. They are surrounded by them in school and work. They are continually told to be more SJ like, and because it’s all they are around, they end up trying to be one so as to grasp for some kind of connection with people. Being abstract and continually focused on endless possibilities can create confusion as well when trying to understand one’s self in a more concrete manner."
Thats how I campe up with the answer.


2 - You said you feel more limited now and you used to score INTP. I also missed that Ti got in the middle and high, which explains how you got INTP result (I dont think you are INTP because of the leading Fi). But, also, in order to get INTP result your Ne should be slightly higher in the past, when you felt you had more freedom. Also, the ISTP results that didnt used to show earlier suggests that your intuition functions dropped over time compared to your sensing functions, suggesting again that Ne dropped and Si likely got stronger. I see that as you changing your personality and preferences in efforts to try to adapt an enviroment which I suggest is a little bit too rigid. Also, supposing that I am right, between 4 personalities (INFP, ISTJ,INTP,ISTP), only INFP got feeling, which made me to conclude that, if your enviroment is rigid like I suggest, it also dislikes you being sentimental. It looks like you suppress your feelings (better: Hide them as much as you can or both) in order to fit.

I went to read the links you provided me yesterday, and I actually think that makes a very good point, in that it seems to describe how I came to mistype myself in the first place - not just a desire to be SJ, but also an accurate depiction of being surrounded by SJ types and getting their values incalculated into me. I think INFP might be right on the money - I tried slipping INFP on, but it didn't really feel suitable because I've more or less always seen myself as the logical and rational type (Not just due to INTP typing, but also a lot of my approach feels rational to me; if it isn't rational then it bugs me).

That's two things that I couldn't reconcile with the INFP label. First would be that rationality. Second is my Ne tending to catastrophise, leading me to think it was ISTJ (e7 sx). But I also suppose with an inadequate environment Ne would simply be realistically projecting likelihoods, that is to say, catastrophise. And this ... is an example of how I always think MBTI typings into a corner, at least for myself. xD See?

But yes. I think you're onto something. There's usually a background leading to changes in people, and the present-past dichotomy is one that can lend useful insights. This I have to meditate on a bit more, because the past definitely emphasized SP values, but I just hated it a lot, because plans and structure is necessary for me to work, and it was a chaotic environment that just kept disrupting my plans. Hence why I thought ISTJ as well. But on hindsight it could be my Fi hating people assuming that everyone works the same way and that it's ok to break other people's schedules for no reason whatsoever. But now that I'm back with my SJ parents, I kinda see why I'm definitely much more intuitive than I thought I was.

Now - I know this is stereotyping, but I find it hard to picture any TJ looking at the descriptions and not going "this is me", because of how high Te is. Uncertainty and tangential thinking also seems to be Ne style thought.

If I am INFP, it's not really something I'm happy with, but I think right now it has the highest likelihood to be so. The consideration of my environment is also spot on; my worst experience was being in an SP environment, not an SJ environment, which also led me to think I may be TJ.

I'm not sure if any of my ramblings help. But I think the reasoning is more or less solid.
 

Vendrah

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 26, 2017
Messages
1,940
MBTI Type
NP
Enneagram
952
Sory, there is not much I can do anymore.

EDIT: I mean, you are still a little bit confused and I am either.
I still reinforce the INFP thing, by the same arguments before, but I am unsure.
 

Peter Deadpan

phallus impudicus
Joined
Dec 14, 2016
Messages
8,882
I think your style of communication is clearly Delta. I think you have a good grasp on what you like, how you feel about things, and a fair amount of insight into the inner workings of others, specifically relating to ethics/depth of emotion. Your humor is dry, your word choice is not. You are often very creative and expressive in a manner which is not typically seen in ISTJs.

I do think you are an INFP. I am sorry to hear that you do not like that, but I understand not liking your own type. I personally enjoy being an INFP, other than the whole "holy shit, this life is a joke, I'm never going to have happiness because I wasn't designed to live this way and I can never find the way out" thing.
I'm helping! :happy2:

Also, being an intellectual and being an INFP are not mutually exclusive. Far from it. Low Te typically just means "I have a hard time getting started or knowing what the best course of action is", and also "I'm not going to do things that I don't like just because everyone else does it and expects me to".

Furthermore, if you feel that you don't always know how you feel about things, it could be an indication that your subtype (Socionics) is Ne (mine is). I would venture to guess that yours is too.
 

Agent Washington

Softserve Ice Cream
Joined
Jan 24, 2017
Messages
2,053
Sory, there is not much I can do anymore.

EDIT: I mean, you are still a little bit confused and I am either.
I still reinforce the INFP thing, by the same arguments before, but I am unsure.

Not a problem at all. Uncertainty isn't a bad thing, sometimes it means we are open to truth.
 

Agent Washington

Softserve Ice Cream
Joined
Jan 24, 2017
Messages
2,053
I think your style of communication is clearly Delta. I think you have a good grasp on what you like, how you feel about things, and a fair amount of insight into the inner workings of others, specifically relating to ethics/depth of emotion. Your humor is dry, your word choice is not. You are often very creative and expressive in a manner which is not typically seen in ISTJs.

I do think you are an INFP. I am sorry to hear that you do not like that, but I understand not liking your own type. I personally enjoy being an INFP, other than the whole "holy shit, this life is a joke, I'm never going to have happiness because I wasn't designed to live this way and I can never find the way out" thing.
I'm helping! :happy2:

Also, being an intellectual and being an INFP are not mutually exclusive. Far from it. Low Te typically just means "I have a hard time getting started or knowing what the best course of action is", and also "I'm not going to do things that I don't like just because everyone else does it and expects me to".

Furthermore, if you feel that you don't always know how you feel about things, it could be an indication that your subtype (Socionics) is Ne (mine is). I would venture to guess that yours is too.

It sucks, though? The whole "this life is a joke and I can never find a way out" kind of deal. If left to my own devices and nothing but that, I genuinely wouldn't have to care what others think. But given how much of living actually depends on what others think of you, it's pretty much just a huge mess.

Oof...

I don't like it, but it makes sense. *sits down* I was hoping for some insight from INFPs as well, and I'm glad to have gotten it, so thank you. I also never really saw myself as creative, but I'm glad to hear that from you. :)

Ahh...I'm not sure about socionics, I only looked into it for type compatibility and relations. It was interesting in that regard for me. I do often not know how I feel about things. Coming online and such is often a way that lets me step back and think for myself without the pressure to feel one way or another. I suppose chances are we're the same type...?
 
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