Temperament by Inclusion, Control and Affection

[Venom]

OK, that makes sense. When I first read about Enneagram, I identified the 9 types with the five temperaments and four "Phlegmatic blend" pairs, and the 4 sounded like the MelancholyPhlegmatic/SupinePhlegmatic range (introverted, and between people-focused and task-focused).

do you have a table relating all of this??? (I wanna see where i fit in! )

Im 1w9 ...they integrate at 7 and disintegrate to 4...im a supine phlegmatic in affection...does that mean that affection invariable leads to an enneagram mental breakdown?

 

[Eric B]

This uses the same dimensions as the map posted earlier in the thread

(From Temperament Part 3: APS and other systems)

 

[Venom]

This uses the same dimensions as the map posted earlier in the thread

(From Temperament Part 3: APS and other systems)

Ah... So now we can break it down even further!!!

Inclusion: Choleric Phlegmatic = 3 = Most people really dont know me beyond my superficial attempts to look like I'm achieving and fitting in. To get underneath you have to earn it/be patient/do something/who knows what.

= Se dominates Fe. Ive been told that if you barely know me, I come off as ESTP

Control: Phlegmatic Choleric = 1 = I'm a perfectionist. If I dominate too much I fail, if I lack control I fail. People have to like agree with me, but if they dont, I dont care and still want it my way . Its an almost impossible balance.

= Ti tries to completely keep pace with Fe. If you only see me "in action", I appear ENXJ.

Affection: Supine Phlegmatic = 4 = I live in a reaction only fantasy land. I want to leave my island to visit another island, but I dont make an attempt unless I see a friendly flag (and I dont fly friendly flags myself!).

= Ni paranoia dominates Fe. If you weren't aware of my thought process, you would think I was blind to people's actions, and might appear INFX.

I spend most of my time in the control region of my personality. therefore my overall disposition is
ENXJ "1". There is a phlegmatic "air" to all of my regions, therefore I have a tendency towards a 9 wing and an NF temperament. Add it all up and we get ENFJ 1w9!

How else can we needlessly complicate me!? (serious)

 

[Eric B]

I originally gathered the links and wrote the response, but for some reason, it didn't post, so I had to do it again, and didn't have time to rewrite the whole thing. So what got left off was that that page is offering a proposed full correlation between Enneagram and APS (utilizing the instinctual variants, which are dead ringers for Inclusion, Control and Affection, but not stacked with different types.

But hey, if you're saying they fit, or seem to explain things about you; then all the more great! So in this idea, you would be 3so1sp4sx, and I guess the 1 is what comes out strongest (and the 3 and 4 mellow each other out to a 9 wing). Would sp happen to beyour strongest variant in the standard stacking method with only one type? (If you've ever taken a test using variant theory). If so, that would also explain it.

 

[/DG/]

I had a difficult time deciding mine...

Inclusion: either Supine Phlematic or Supine
Control: Phlegmatic Sanguine
Affection: Melancholy

I don't really know what to make of this. What type does this equate to?

 

[Domino]

I think I may be:

Inclusion: Melancholy
Control: Melancholy
Affection: Supine

The affection part gave me a pause. I do initiate affection sometimes though not primarily, so I agree with that, but I don't need a full contact experience all the time either.

 

[Eric B]

DisneyGeek: ISFP? (Bordering on INFP)

Domino: Melancholy-Melancholy- would likely be ISTJ. Now, Melancholy in Inclusion/Supine in Control would fit INFJ, but you have Supine in Affection. In any case, a Melancholy in Inclusion is a definite introvert. (though I see you have the "e" lowercase).

The person who first introduced me to the Keirsey test, and thus to the type code, was Melancholy-Melancholy-Supine, and ISTJ; and my father is also Melancholy-Melancholy-SupinePhlegmatic, and fits ISTJ. I guess the Affection part you describe does fit him as well, but that's because both my mother and I had compulsively low expressed Affection, so that left him the most expressive one, and even his moderate want would not be met otherwise.

Also, if you're female, ISTJ females do often seem like Feeling types, because of the traditional roles of women, which they retain with their dominant Si; plus the tertiary Fi provides plenty of Feeling.

 

[ChocolateMoose123]

Inclusion: phlegmatic melancholy
Control: phlegmatic choleric
Affection: phlegmatic melancholy? or Phlegmatic? That was a tough one.

what does this mean? I don't understand the graph with different names.

 

[Aleksei]

Inclusion- Phlegmatic-Sanguine
Control- Sanguine-Phlegmatic
Affection- Sanguine-Phlegmatic

 

[Eric B]

MDP2525:

On the graph, right is more expressive, left is less expressive or more reserved. That is extraverted vs introverted for Inclusion and Affection, and pragmatic vs cooperative for Control. Up is more responsive, and down is less responsive. That's people vs task or informative vs directive for Inclusion, and motive vs structure for Control.

Your temperaments all express as a Phlegmatic, which is midway between left and right. It means you're all around moderately expressive in all areas.

Phlegmatic Melancholy (Inclusion) is ambiverted and directive. Basically between Chart the Course and In Charge, but on the CtC side.

Phlegmatic Choleric is next to Phlegmatic Melancholy, on the Choleric side, and is similar. But this is in Control for you rather than Inclusion. That would in my view be between SJ and NT.

However, you have ISTP. That would match the Chart the Course or Phlegmatic Melancholy in Inclusion.
The Control isn't matching, however (I expect SP to be Sanguine). Though it's not terribly far off. (Sanguine is higher on the responsive scale from Choleric).

Aleksei:
This matches ENFP a little bit better than the Sanguine-Choleric of the four temperament test.
Phlegmatic-Sanguine in Inclusion matches the ENP (Get Things Going) part OK; just a little less expressive (i.e. ambiverted). This could explain why you came out as an introvert in at least one test you have listed there.

Sanguine Phlegmatic (Control) is actually next to Choleric. So that almost matches the other test. It is just as expressive as Choleric, though moderately more responsive (which would translate to "motive focused").
Since it is part Phlegmatic, and Phlegmatic matches NF, then I can see how you could come out ENFP.
At the same time, as I had pointed out, SLUEI=ENTP, which is SanChlor, and you are close to that. I imagine you also might come out as ESFP as well.

I could also see this combination as being very 3-ish.

 

[Noon]

Inclusion: Supine or Supine Phlegmatic, but the following written under SP is not entirely true for me: 1) Rolls with the punches -- can take rejection and approval equally well (if you like him/her it's okay, and if you don't, it's also okay)
Control: Supine or Supine Phlegmatic
Affection: Supine or Supine Phlegmatic, but the following written under SP is not true for me: 1) Can "roll with the punches" -- able to tolerate unaffectionate, even hostile people very well, 2) Expresses a fear of rejection -- however, in reality, he/she is very confident in deep relationships.

I think that's correct. What would all of that amount to in terms of Jung/enneagram?

 

[Eric B]

In my correlation of the systems, it would be INFP. If you don't identify with "rolling with the punches", then you might just be pure Supine. Perhaps bordering on SP (like I do in Inclusion).
Enneagram, probably a solid 4 if SP. Could be 6 as well, especially if just Supine.

 

[Noon]

Wow, that is pretty fantastic. Thank you. My highest Etype is always either 4 or 6. You're probably right about bordering on SP then. As for Jung, sometimes I feel ISFP, other times I feel ISFJ.

 

[Eric B]

ISFP I would expect to be Supine Sanguine (Inclusion, Control respectively), while ISFJ would be Supine Melancholy. Neither would be that far off.
So you're sure you're an S, then?

 

[Aleksei]

In my correlation of the systems, it would be INFP. If you don't identify with "rolling with the punches", then you might just be pure Supine. Perhaps bordering on SP (like I do in Inclusion).
Enneagram, probably a solid 4 if SP. Could be 6 as well, especially if just Supine.

Wouldn't supine be an extrovert type? The supine is described as a passive extrovert that craves social contact but waits for others to come to him/her. To me Supine sounds a lot like an ENFP 9.

 

[Candid]

Inclusion: Melancholy Phlegmatic and/or Phlegmatic Melancholy
Control: Phlegmatic
Affection: Supine Phlegmatic, though I'd totally not "resist physical (sexual) encounters as a means of protecting his/her low energy level".

 

[Eric B]

Wouldn't supine be an extrovert type? The supine is described as a passive extrovert that craves social contact but waits for others to come to him/her. To me Supine sounds a lot like an ENFP 9.

When they say it's an extrovert, what they mean is that it RESPONDS (or wants interaction) like an extrovert (i.e. the same as the Sanguine). What we normally think of as introversion/extroversion is EXPRESSED behavior, where it is clearly reserved or "passive". (introverted)
Back when I had someone insisting I was an extravert, and that ENP's were "introverted extraverts" (which matches this description of the Supine) I had to consider that, but I determined that my low expressed behavior does match a legitimate I preference.

So the Supine's "extroversion" in that sense would correspond more to what the Interaction Styles model calls an "informing" preference. Because they like people, they speak in a more informing tone. (Rather than directive, or indifferent). They are higher in that scale than the Phlegmatic, who is really moderate, though both get lumped together in these four-to-five correlations as the closest thing to each other.

Phlegmatics are called "introvert AND extrovert", meaning they are inbetween on both scales. They can respond to people or tasks, or take them or leave them. They are not really as reserved as the Supine, needing to wait for others to approach them.

ENFP's, as NF's, I expect to be possibly Supine in Control (if not Phlegmatic). In Inclusion, they are clearly Sanguine. (Which is biggest reason why I could never buy myself being one).

9 always sounded purely Phlegmatic to me, though I have considered it being Supine. I couldn't see 6 as Phlegmatic, though. 2 and 4 also seem like they could be part Supine or Phlegmatic. (2 sounds ambiverted, like Phlegmatic Supine / Phlegmatic Sanguine, and 4 sounds like it is Supine Phlegmatic / Melancholy Phlegmatic, and this seems to be matching from what we're seeing here).

The video of the 6 here makes it really sound like a Supine, Enneagram Types, Nine Enneagram Types - Enneagram Worldwide
and Supines would naturally have the "phobic/counterphobic" tendencies because they are so reserved, but inpressionable by others.

 

[Eric B]

Inclusion: Melancholy Phlegmatic and/or Phlegmatic Melancholy
Control: Phlegmatic
Affection: Supine Phlegmatic, though I'd totally not "resist physical (sexual) encounters as a means of protecting his/her low energy level".

INTP's seem to be the ones who match this correlation the least. That is a typical result for them. Mixtures of Melancholy and Phlegmatic.
I know for me, it matches Supine-Choleric, and I know of one or two others who fit Phlegmatic-Choleric, but those are opposite temperaments, and they seem to mellow each other out to an overall Mel and/or Phleg combination.

 

[Donna Cecilia]

Inclusion: Melancholy
Control: Choleric
Affection: Melancholy

Credits to Aleksei for the information links.

 

[Eric B]

Just curious; how strong would your S preference be?
I see you also have S in Socionics; however RCOEI (SLOAN) corresponds to INTJ, as does Mel-Chlor.