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  1. #1
    Per Ardua Metamorphosis's Avatar
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    I was thinking about each of the letters in MBTI recently and I began to wonder why the term Feeling is used. It seems to me that Feeling is more of an intuitive thing, whereas Emotional describes emotions. I understand that there is already a letter E in MBTI, and I also understand that emotional has an inherent negative connotation, but for the sake of argument pretend that neither exists.

    The way it is currently, you can be a Feeler, yet have absolutely no ability to "feel" people's emotions (S's). Whereas, an NT might be able to "feel" things.

    Anyways, this could be a product of my being awake at a late hour and an attempt to push the envelope on procrastination concerning my test studying, but I'd like to hear some input.
    "You will always be fond of me. I represent to you all the sins you never had the courage to commit."

    Reason is, and ought only to be the slave of the passions, and can never pretend to any other office
    than to serve and obey them. - David Hume

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    Senior Member meshou's Avatar
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    I dunno, as a rule, most Feelers are more empathetic than most Thinkers, on average, although I do think that how calm and collected one is is pretty much independant of T verses F-- you'll run into some really non-reactive, collected feelers about as often similarly collected thinkers, in my experience. And Ts can be really strongly vitriolic, reactive, and emotional.

    I do wish "Qualitative" and "Quantitative" were used instead of "Feeling" and "Thinking." Feelers can be very good at qualitative logic.

    As for "S"s being less understanding, yeah, S vs N seems to be the biggest rift, at least for me, in terms of communication and general getting-along-ness. It does go both ways, though. I with a few exceptions (notably ISTPs), I probably badly fail to take many S styles of comunication seriously, just like they me.

    It's not that they're not empathetic, it's that you're basically alien to many of them, esspecially if they have no exposure to the MBTI. Empathy without commonality, or at the very least a tool of understanding, can fall way short.
    Let's do this thing.

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    Per Ardua Metamorphosis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by meshou View Post
    As for "S"s being less understanding, yeah, S vs N seems to be the biggest rift, at least for me, in terms of communication and general getting-along-ness.
    Exactly. Now, I expect that from time to time people will take my sarcasm seriously...since it isn't so blatant, but I don't think I have ever had an S person not take something I said at face value.
    "You will always be fond of me. I represent to you all the sins you never had the courage to commit."

    Reason is, and ought only to be the slave of the passions, and can never pretend to any other office
    than to serve and obey them. - David Hume

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    Senior Member Lookin4theBestNU's Avatar
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    I understand that there is already a letter E in MBTI, and I also understand that emotional has an inherent negative connotation, but for the sake of argument pretend that neither exists.
    The term "Feeler" already has plenty of negative connotation. I think changing it to emotional would neither help/hurt it any more than where it's at presently.
    "At points of clarity, I realize that my life on earth is meaningless, and that I am merely a pawn in a bigger game. A game I cannot possibly understand or have control of. Thankfully, before depression sets in, I drift back into my cloudy, bewildered daily routine." **Joel Patrick Warneke**

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    Per Ardua Metamorphosis's Avatar
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    On another note, what's the basis for using the words Judging and Perceiving. It's possible that I just don't understand the differences enough, but it seems a little wrong.
    "You will always be fond of me. I represent to you all the sins you never had the courage to commit."

    Reason is, and ought only to be the slave of the passions, and can never pretend to any other office
    than to serve and obey them. - David Hume

  6. #6
    Senior Member Alienclock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lookin4theBestNU View Post
    The term "Feeler" already has plenty of negative connotation. I think changing it to emotional would neither help/hurt it any more than where it's at presently.
    I think changing it to emotional would hurt. Feeler may have negative connotations, but it is more accurate. (I explain more below)

    Quote Originally Posted by Metamorphosis View Post
    I was thinking about each of the letters in MBTI recently and I began to wonder why the term Feeling is used. It seems to me that Feeling is more of an intuitive thing, whereas Emotional describes emotions. I understand that there is already a letter E in MBTI, and I also understand that emotional has an inherent negative connotation, but for the sake of argument pretend that neither exists.

    The way it is currently, you can be a Feeler, yet have absolutely no ability to "feel" people's emotions (S's). Whereas, an NT might be able to "feel" things.

    Anyways, this could be a product of my being awake at a late hour and an attempt to push the envelope on procrastination concerning my test studying, but I'd like to hear some input.
    A wise person once said:
    Its said often enough that Feeling isn't about feelings, but its also true that Thinking isn't about thoughts. Thoughts in terms of abstract concepts are an aspect of iNtuition, and feeling as an emotional affect physically experienced is associated with Sensation.
    Don't ask me what the above quote actually means, but it sounds smart and right. "feeler" I am a feeler. Viscerally I get a sensation that says yes, seems right, further investigate its integrity using logic... and feel out the logic... feeling for me does allow me to make jumps and connections that I then have to explain...

    side note
    Only a psychic or 6th sense type empath can actually "feel" someone else's emotions. Normally people, empathic or otherwise, react to their perceptions or how they imagine someone is feeling.

    On another note, what's the basis for using the words Judging and Perceiving. It's possible that I just don't understand the differences enough, but it seems a little wrong.
    Perhaps Judging relates to finality, and Perceiving relates to a dynamic sense of what is... Judging function often included deadlines, and rigidity in ideas... and Perceiving seems to me much more fluid, relating instead to the individuals emotional state or internal ideas compass etc...

    ? the above is just my thoughts, or feelings, or perception or whatever... What do you guys think?

    edited to add.
    Quote Originally Posted by "?" View Post
    The only generalization I'm comfortable with about J/P differences is that J's like to approach the world in the style of an orderly marching band -- with structure; they feel better following a plan; they like closure and want things completed. P's like to approach the world in the style of a jazz band -- spontaneous, flexible, preferring to keep their options open. And that's as specific about J/P as I'm willing to get!
    This sounds extremely right to me in describing the j / p difference.

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    Senior Member Eileen's Avatar
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    F is more about ethics/values than emotions, from what I can tell.
    INFJ

    "I can never be what I ought to be until you are what you ought to be. You can never be what you ought to be until I am what I ought to be. This is the interrelated structure of reality." -Martin Luther King, Jr.

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    Senior Member Alienclock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eileen View Post
    F is more about ethics/values than emotions, from what I can tell.
    What do you think F's share or have in common in terms of similarity of values/ethics?
    OR
    Do you think they make decisions using ethics/values more or less than other types?

  9. #9
    Senior Member Eileen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alienclock View Post
    What do you think F's share or have in common in terms of similarity of values/ethics?
    OR
    Do you think they make decisions using ethics/values more or less than other types?
    I don't think they necessarily have similar values, but I think they'd tend to use the subjective values that they do have to make decisions more than T types.
    INFJ

    "I can never be what I ought to be until you are what you ought to be. You can never be what you ought to be until I am what I ought to be. This is the interrelated structure of reality." -Martin Luther King, Jr.

  10. #10
    Senior Member meshou's Avatar
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    Judging and Perceiving come from the function theory of MBTI.

    There are two types of functions-- Judging, that is, decision making, and Perceiving, or information gathering. The functions used to make decisions are any of the Feeling or Thinking functions. The ones used to observe and understand the world are Intuition and Sensing.

    Now a person is defined in MBTI by their first pair of functions-- First, your primary function. As an INTJ, your first function is Introverted Intuition.

    This is where INXX comes from.

    Now, in MBTI, the first extraverted function defines whether you are a judger or a perceiver, because that is what people will see you doing in the world-- deciding or gathering information.

    As an INTJ, your second function, and the first extraverted function, is Extraverted thinking. People will see you, when you do do things in the world, as primarily organizing and synthesizing information toward an end.

    In the case of an extravert-- let's say an ESFP, their first function is going to be an extraverted Perceiving function. Since they're a sensor, their first function is Extraverted Sensing. Their main goal is to gather Sensory information as much and as long as possible, and avoid taking action that'd cut that option off for them. Like a decision.

    Not going to go into how the tertiary and shadow functions are determined at the moment, since it's actually off topic. I don't actually buy this is entirely how type or functions must always work, but it does help understand.

    Keirsey basically agrees, without a function theory behind it. If you'd rather gather information, you're a P, if you'd rather make a quick decision, you're a J.

    Socionics doesn't look at behavior, but instead personal experience. They look at the first function to determine J vs P, so it differs in both type description and on what type certain introverts are. Personally, I find socionics a leeetle kooky, but it's an important distinction to make.
    Let's do this thing.

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