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The Murder of George Floyd & Subsequent Protests/Riots

Z Buck McFate

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This guy offered no substantial proof outside of 'my experience of Antifa groups leaves no doubt in my mind they're behind it.'

I'm really on the fence about whether it's better to keep an eye on propaganda or just ignore it. eta: I mean obviously, one reason to keep watching is in case anything substantial is said. But it's so fucking depressing, and it gets difficult to keep perceiving these assholes as fully human.
 

Lexicon

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Antifa is simply an abbreviation for antifascist. It’s a stance. It’s not an actual organization. :laugh:

Home | antifa.org
 

Z Buck McFate

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Maybe at some point I'll find the video where he explains that's not the case, and some stuff about how his experience leaves no doubt in his mind they're an organised terrorist group. :shrug:
 

anticlimatic

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Antifa is simply an abbreviation for antifascist. It's a stance. It's not an actual organization. :laugh: Home | antifa.org
Anybody who thinks antifa is anti fascist probably thinks the people's republic of North Korea is a people's republic. Anyone who thinks it's ok to block free speech and violently attack people the left disagrees with is what the AG is referring to "antifa or antifa like" individuals, however they brand themselves.
 

EcK

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Anybody who thinks antifa is anti fascist probably thinks the people's republic of North Korea is a people's republic. Anyone who thinks it's ok to block free speech and violently attack people the left disagrees with is what the AG is referring to "antifa or antifa like" individuals, however, they brand themselves.

Wait, are you saying the World Health Organization is not a wonderful group of super-hero doctors here to represent and selflessly protect all people's health equally?

But but... it's in the name. How can that be?
:rolleyes:Pff I don't believe it, next you're going to tell me that they're heavily financed by private groups disguising as NGOs standing to gain hundreds of billions, power & influence from the current pandemic.
 

Red Memories

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I'm just gonna...make a solid point about America right now in my depression. And then I'm leaving the politics section for a long while, because I don't even rationally feel motivated to vote this election at this rate.

Let me first say it loud for the people in the back: DONALD TRUMP IS A PIECE OF SHIT. He does inflame people, he is a bully at the least, and he is an idiot. I did not vote for Trump. After reading of his "grab'em by the pussy", or his support for stop-and-frisk, I really did not feel morally sound voting for him. Not that I felt exactly morally sound voting for a corrupt Clinton either. I would be happy to have a woman president, but not her. I was originally going to vote for a moderate independent who was a former war veteran, who believed in keep social security and etc. but was quite conservative on matters of border control and etc. But here we are.

But for all those who say the "revolution is coming", you've missed a really glaring issue...

Trump is the beginning of the fight. The "silent majority" arose and voted for him in areas because they are SICK of this toxic internet and social media agenda culture we live in. Even if they DISAGREE with almost EVERYTHING Trump says, they despised the thought of another 4 years of policy built around big city opinions. They're tired of being cancelled, or called something-phobic for even slightly fucking disagreeing with you. Leftists online, and I see righties do it too, act like a bunch of fucking echo chamber children who cannot handle an opposite opinion. The fact so many people are forced to swallow how "ashamed" they should be of themselves, or how you should literally hate the country when if you said a bunch of the shit you're saying about America in ANOTHER country they'd likely arrest or kill you, you piss people off. You don't create conversations, you do not open doors. Many of Trump's supporters are ANGRY because he now said he'd REACT to the censorship, the riots, etc. and he has done NOTHING he said he would. He promised order, and free speech would come back. He hasn't done jack shit on that note.

I cannot go anywhere and have a slightly differing opinion from progressive, near socialist left. I am a moderate who feels uncomfortable voting for Biden or Trump. Don't you dare play a moral card on me and say Biden is still better than Trump. He too is a corrupt piece of shit and there's plenty of things out there to show it. We need a party reform, because neither political party cares about the people anymore. They care about the lobbyist filling their pocketbooks. They care too much about a 2% at the best people bitching on twitter. When did 2% of people decide whether you were cancelled or not? It isn't a system reform. I'm sure it'd help, but do you really think socialism or communism or any of these political moves will actually be free of the problem capitalism has? Greed has existed as a terrible vice for thousands of years and it isn't going to stop there. I do not want to be told again that my religion is hate speech, that I'm automatically a bigot, misogynistic, homophobe for being one. I'm tired of being called xenophobic if I am worried about the country bringing in refugees that Syria admits ISIS hides in, without good vetting procedures. I'm tired of being considered "privileged" just because I'm not of color.

You know why so many rights hate the left? Why so many lefts hate the right? Why blacks hate whites and whites hate blacks? And it just continues? BECAUSE YOU'RE ALL FIGHTING WITH HATE. How do you STOP HATE by being hateful? By spreading more hate? How do you unite people by DIVIDING THEM WORSE? How can I be an ally when to be an ally I have to lynch myself and be ashamed as if I actively voted that blacks should die by police?

Obviously, the issue happening here, extends BEYOND George Floyd. It extends beyond so many matters and into deep rooted division in America, that began with the Bush administration, Obama was tone-deaf at best, and now Trump has just rekindled every flame possible. But you know what? I LOVE AMERICA. I LOVE AMERICA BECAUSE I HAVE FREE SPEECH TO SAY HOW I FEEL ABOUT ALL OF THIS. I HAVE FREEDOM TO THINK, TO BELIEVE IN SOMETHING I BELIEVE IN. WE HAVE THE FREEDOM TO GO OUT THERE, PROTEST, AND TRY TO WORK ON THE PROBLEMS IN AMERICA. I do not want communism, I do not want anarchy, I do not want some system which hinders the freedoms we are given. I am a woman, I can vote, I can work hard now and get a job and I don't have to be just some homemaker, but I can be if I want to. THIS IS THE GREAT AMERICA. We aren't perfect by any stretch but find me a country that is. We are brainwashed by a social media culture where misery loves misery.
New Studies Show Just How Bad Social Media Is For Mental Health
Social media is full of sad, lonely people pretending they're OK and perfectly fine attention-seekers pretending to be sad | The Independent

Not only that, we have young kids, who are practically raised by their phones and have this constantly put in their faces. They constantly have to be "woke". More suicides with youth involved happen from social media bullying and somehow they don't censor any of that fucking shit but they'll bitch about trump since they get publicity and woke points from that. NONE OF THESE PEOPLE ARE GOOD OR CARE ABOUT YOU ANYWAY. I've watched my older brother turn to facebook and become basically addicted to it, constantly going there to seek validation or won't make plans until he can get with friends. He used to be super independent and just go do stuff with or without people. I spent my teen years wrapped in the pure negatives of social media, and being practically addicted to it, and more and more I'm wishing someone would just break twitter, smash instagram, and turn them off for 30 days. WHAT WOULD THESE PEOPLE DO? WHERE WOULD THEY GET THEIR OPINIONS? THEY COULDN'T CANCEL SOMEONE FOR DISAGREEING WITH THEM OMG.

So loot and destroy the freedoms we worked for. See historically though, most major revolutions allows for terrible authoritarians like Hitler or Napoleon to take over, and start an even BIGGER fucking war. Instead of protesting in the streets, educate yourself, find someone you think stands for America, and WRITE THEM IN. We ALL have the ability, and we all have the social responsibility to actually think outside the box when voting at this rate. IF YOU WANT CHANGE, ACTUALLY MAKE THE CHANGE. Voting for Joe Biden ISN'T the change. Neither is Trump. We need someone who can reach both aisles and reunite this broken country before there's nothing left. Why do you want this country you live in to burn to ashes? All I see is two communists countries in Russia and China that'd love to take us over during a terrible disarray. Think of THEIR human rights violations. America is light mayo compared to that shit. But we are so GREAT because we actually have a VOICE and BRAINS we can use. You cannot trust the mainstream media, or even local news at this rate, to be honest. As long as you aren't on the conservative side to them you get a pat. It is hard not to consider THAT propaganda, as much as I'd call Fox News "right" propaganda. It is ALL propaganda, not just the shit you disagree with.

All the discourses here remind me why I usually avoid political discussions of most kinds, because all people can really do is agree to disagree on most things. Instead of being hateful, consider changing your vision to what America could be. I stand behind those peacefully protesting because, I want to see a UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. I want to see not disarray or "don't be Trump", I want to see the loving country that can come together. The country that for years was a land of dreams and people working hard to accomplish the hopes of that dream. The American dream is still real... But we need jobs back in America. We need less mechanization that is taking jobs from people. We need imaginations and innovators to come out and create, or build upon things we have. We need the freedom to think, speak, exist again even if it isn't in the extremist echo chamber. Most people are center something. Few are actually extremely left or right. If you think that is the majority you're really kidding yourself or either end. We'll always have extreme liberals and extreme righties, or even outright anarchists or south rising idiots (which my mother calls rednecks and they're as scary as antifa-like organizations if you wanna get into that issue too). What I see out there now are not just protestors of a terrible event that SHOULD be getting acknowledge, SHOULD be getting recognized as a wrong which occurred in our society and as many bad events do create a law protecting (like Amber alert named after a kidnapped child), they are people who want to see America burn, and make it into something else. They either want anarchy, or complete control. I don't want either one to win. I want to continue to live here where it is okay if we agree to disagree, where it is okay if I believe in God and you don't, where we can have these melting pots of opinions and coexist. But I also want a change in our system, where these people are held accountable, where no person of color is afraid of being pulled over, where the ability to enter America and experience our freedoms is accessible legally. Where we can experience unity and love, not just hate, and looking for things to destroy because we are in fact spreading our misery to other people. It is so easy to find something to gripe about. I encourage some of you to try and extend a hand kindly, rather than inflaming and name calling. If America is going to heal, we have to start where we began to divide the lines: with us.

Do not become hateful, like the hateful people which cause so much of the pain. It never works. I can assure you, it never has. Racism, this sort of thing, is sadly something raised at home. No one is born thinking that way, and we have to actively confront our biases and prejudices. I see so few people wanting to actually look inward to see if maybe they're an issue, they are raising something worse. I grew up hearing how bad islamics were and that islam is the enemy. I wasn't sure. I know the radicals were definitely not looking good, but I also began to look objectively and see how ISIS literally killed muslims who were not their style. I met two refugees. I heard one of them as they told me of their brother literally being blown up at his graduation. My heart shuddered and broke.

Spread love and empathy.
 

ceecee

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This guy offered no substantial proof outside of 'my experience of Antifa groups leaves no doubt in my mind they're behind it.'

I'm really on the fence about whether it's better to keep an eye on propaganda or just ignore it. eta: I mean obviously, one reason to keep watching is in case anything substantial is said. But it's so fucking depressing, and it gets difficult to keep perceiving these assholes as fully human.

I really don't believe that they are.

I have heard a lot of shit lately but that systemic racism is a conspiracy theory shows just how mentally deficient conservative America is as a whole and how successful their media has been in halting any kind of critical thinking. Their belief is - if *I* don't see it or know about it personally, it's likely to not exist. That's why their biggest, loudest complaint is not dead people. Of COVID or at the hands of police or due to systemic poverty assured by a country that hates the poor. Only the economic and business impacts. Completely derelict in mind and entirely soulless.

The right uses Antfa as their imaginary monster so they don't have to think about the very real paramilitary, white supremacist, domestic terrorists that have killed many and are an actual threat to this country. The actual fucking fascist, right wing, ultra national, full of law enforcement, often religiously driven and armed to the teeth groups that exist because the right is always shitting their pants in anxiety and fear. No matter how much evidence and proof you give them - nope. Those groups are just patriots exercising their 2nd Amendment rights.
 

Julius_Van_Der_Beak

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Anybody who thinks antifa is anti fascist probably thinks the people's republic of North Korea is a people's republic. Anyone who thinks it's ok to block free speech and violently attack people the left disagrees with is what the AG is referring to "antifa or antifa like" individuals, however they brand themselves.

it's in the name.

If you're anti-antifascist, it's clear what you are.
 

Lexicon

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Anybody who thinks antifa is anti fascist probably thinks the people's republic of North Korea is a people's republic. Anyone who thinks it's ok to block free speech and violently attack people the left disagrees with is what the AG is referring to "antifa or antifa like" individuals, however they brand themselves.

There are always extremists associated w/every ideology. I think people who claim to be against fascism but suppress free speech (particularly through fear/violence) are hypocrites. However, many people identify with being vehemently anti-fascist without being related to that more extreme ideology & set of behaviors. My point in mentioning it, to be clear (& admittedly somewhat pedantic), was merely observing that the “terrorist” label is going to get pretty messy in the longterm. It’ll be interesting to see how it’s dealt with, to say the least.
 

anticlimatic

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There are always extremists associated w/every ideology. I think people who claim to be against fascism but suppress free speech (particularly through fear/violence) are hypocrites. However, many people identify with being vehemently anti-fascist without being related to that more extreme ideology & set of behaviors. My point in mentioning it, to be clear (& admittedly somewhat pedantic), was merely observing that the "terrorist" label is going to get pretty messy in the longterm. It'll be interesting to see how it's dealt with, to say the least.
I get your point, you can definitely be anti fascist without being "antifa," but that's the brand a group that fit the violent anti free speech demographic gave themselves during the black lives matter era, so that's what's going to stick. I don't think anyone will find it confusing. The media will try to make it so because they are not interested in holding leftist extremists accountable.
 

ceecee

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I'm just wondering where all these people worried about the government coming for them, their liberty and freedom being violated or what the fuck ever they have said for decades - are? Where are these clowns that claim to fight tyranny. Where are these people?

200513-michigan-protests-ac-745p_419e5b49372ede175aff055e25078c25.fit-2000w.JPG


*crickets*
 

Riva

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So glad Floyd's brother came on TV and called for peace. Hopefully it would prevent the majority peaceful protestors from being tempted into violence.

However by saying that in the next election people should vote against Trump - who for political reasons probably want violence to continue - he is indicating that the problem is a Trump era issue; when infact it has been happening for quite sometime.

I believe the main issue here is the lack of police accountability and the judiciary protecting the police in a court of law.

Ps - I am from the other part of the world and it's all over our news too.
 

Lark

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I think it will be interesting to see if the pandemic, which the world is currently experiencing and has not finished by all accounts, will have any effect upon all these demonstrators, of any shade of opinion, who have gathered in groups and in public without any physical distancing what so ever.

Also interested to see what will happen when the work force takes a hit from through illness too. Including the law enforcement work force.
 

Jaguar

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Bishop 'outraged' over Trump's church photo op during George Floyd protests | US news | The Guardian
The Rev Mariann Budde says the institution aligns itself with those seeking justice for Floyd’s death

Biden: George Floyd's killing is 'a wake-up call for the nation'

The presumptive Democratic nominee lambasted President Trump for allowing law enforcement in Washington to tear-gas peaceful protesters in Lafayette Park, in front of the White House. The protesters were cleared so Trump could have his photo taken in front of nearby St. John’s Church with a Bible in hand. “When peaceful protesters are dispersed by the order of the president from the doorstep of the people’s house, the White House — using tear gas and flash grenades — in order to stage a photo op at a noble church, we can be forgiven for believing that the president is more interested in power than in principle,” Biden said.

“The president held up the Bible,” Biden continued. “I just wish he’d open it once in a while, instead of brandishing it. If he opened it, he could’ve learned something.”

Biden called for the country to acknowledge and take action to eradicate systemic racism.
 
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I'm very sad about what happened to George Floyd. It's senseless and tragic, and I'm sorry for the experiences that black Americans are continuing to have. That must be scary to be a minority and to see minorities being treated so inhumanely.
 

Jonny

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I'm very sad about what happened to George Floyd. It's senseless and tragic, and I'm sorry for the experiences that black Americans are continuing to have. That must be scary to be a minority and to see minorities being treated so inhumanely.

That the word "but" doesn't show up anywhere in this post makes you better than half the folks out there. Kudos to you, and agreed.
 
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