JivinJeffJones
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- Apr 25, 2007
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- INFP
And our bodies lose 21 grams when we die, no matter how big or small the body is.
Any source on that, out of curiosity?
And our bodies lose 21 grams when we die, no matter how big or small the body is.
How do you know we have souls that exist past the death of our bodies, and how do you know what the consistency of the soul actually is?
And our bodies lose 21 grams when we die, no matter how big or small the body is.
What are you personal views on what happens when you die? There's more than just electricity that flows through your body that makes it move. Each of us has his or her own individual and unique mind and personality. Each of us has a soul, which is different from one another. If you factor science in this, energy can neither be created nor destroyed. So what happens to the energy that makes up you, your soul, your spirit? Can it all just vanish? I know this isn't a new topic, but sometimes I think about it a lot and I'm very curious as to everyone's opinions.
"Mine's gonna keep coming back until it attains perfection, then it's a one way ticket out of this backwater consciousness! "
WW: were you joking or serious??? There are groups that genuinely believe that statement to be true. However, "backwater consciousness" makes me wonder if you meant it as sarcasm, or if were you being Buddhist or New Age or something else.
"sometimes wisdom presents itself as folly" other times people sound sarcastic because, well, they are truly just being sarcastic. But being serious in a joking way, that takes some real effort or skill or insight. I recognise some of my speaking style in you, fellow IN_P. However, many of the INTJ's that I've known, if they said what you said, they would have meant it in an utterly mocking way. But INTP's and INTJ's are rather different animals. Perhaps it is an IN_P trait to like speaking somewhat cryptically, which in my experience plenty of others quickly misunderstand.
Another INFP here who believes we have souls. I think that the laws of physics support the idea that the energy must go *somewhere*. And our bodies lose 21 grams when we die, no matter how big or small the body is. I believe that there is a force of life, creativity, and love in the universe and our souls go toward it. Or the energy remains behind in an imprint on earth (hell, if you will) that explains the aura surrounding landmarks where intensely horrible things have happened, like suicides, murders, and war battles.
I'm not sure if there is such a thing as a soul. It might simply be a perceptual byproduct of the way our mind processes reality. But my first idea upon imagining that a soul exists, is that we all simply become ghosts and wander the earth for eternity when we die, unable to be seen, interact with, or otherwise affect anything.
1. Why we lose 21 gram ? Is it because someone said so or is it because someone has empirical evidence? Something like this can be very easy to prove in public. So I am wondering why no one does it.
BBC to screen docu featuring corpsesBack in 2007, ITV was criticised for advertising that its documentary Malcolm and Barbara: Love's Farewell would show the moment when an Alzheimer's patient died. It later admitted that it had actually ceased filming three days earlier. A BBC spokesman says: "In Victorian times it was a widely accepted practice to take photographs of dead loved ones."
Chillax, Dude.
Here's something of answer to question one.
snopes.com: Weight of the Soul
The claim is based on true experiment, but in no can be considered empirical evidence.
And it's consider taboo to watch some one die (as in stranger in the room), that's why no-one does it today.
I remember a few years back a BBC documentary had much debate surrounding it because they claimed they were going to film some one dying. I just checked it though, they didn't.
BBC to screen docu featuring corpses
I'll state my position tommorrow (if I remember), I need to go to sleep.
Chillax, Dude.
Here's something of answer to question one.
snopes.com: Weight of the Soul
The claim is based on true experiment, but in no can be considered empirical evidence.
And it's consider taboo to watch some one die (as in stranger in the room), that's why no-one does it today.
What to make of all this? MacDougall's results were flawed because the methodology used to harvest them was suspect, the sample size far too small, and the ability to measure changes in weight imprecise. For this reason, credence should not be given to the idea his experiments proved something, let alone that they measured the weight of the soul as 21 grams. His postulations on this topic are a curiousity, but nothing more.
As far as I know there is a lot of very religious people in this world and I am sure that many of them would be quite happy to sereve as guinea-pigs in this matters. If nothing just to show a good argument that their belief is a correct one.
Any source on that, out of curiosity?
1. Why we lose 21 gram ? Is it because someone said so or is it because someone has empirical evidence? Something like this can be very easy to prove in public. So I am wondering why no one does it.
2. For you it is easy to claim laws of physics this or laws of physics that. But from your post it is obvious that you are not familiar with laws of physics.The standard SI unit for energy is Joule not Gram. What means that if body indead loses 21 grams they we are not talking about soul/energy.
Also if soul weights 21 grams that means that it has mass. What means that you can effect it with gravity. What doesn't correlate with idea od soul. (at least not a standard one)
3.You say 21 grams. But when you turn 21 grams into energy that is huge amount of energy.
One gram has 8.9876 x 10^13 Joules.
But explosion of 1000 tonnes of TNT produces only 4.18 × 10^12 joules.
What means that death of every human being would cause a huge exsplosion since the energy that will be relelased by transformation would be huge and that is what explosions are all about actually.
Since energy has to be channeled into something.
This transformation is the only way of turning those 21 grams which are purely physical into energy from which soul supposed to be made.
If you are not talking about the energy from physical laws then you should not have mentioned them. Since you are talking about some different kinds of energy which have pretty much nothing to do with physics.
3. You are talking about theoretical models where matter is made of energy once again you have a problem. Since everything is made of energy what means that apples , cars , walls ... could have souls as well
When you turn on a blender or oven in your kitchen to make yourself a lunch you use that same energy.
4. If people want to raad more I recommend this thread
5. If we heve souls what would be their purpose?
Trying to disprove what people believe spiritually is an utter waste of time. There are highly educated and intelligent people who believe in god, and ignorant people of average intelligence who don't. There is no direct correlation between education or exposure to information and atheism.
I think the issue more was using scientific language to express something that is actually just a belief, as you have pointed out. So you can't prove or disprove a spiritual belief; but you CAN discuss what "evidence" does and does not conform to sound observable principle.