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Thread: Faux INTJ?

  1. #1
    Member Frostshade's Avatar
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    Default Faux INTJ?

    Very recently I've come back into the area of personality types and Myers Brigg. Months back I spent time reading and studying the INTJ type. In hopes of knowing myself a bit better. This is the result I get over and over again. I will admit, not from the official myers-brigg, but from as many and most accurate resources as I could gather. INTJ every time. However I've begun to wonder about certain differences between myself and what most people see as common and defining traits of INTJs.

    At the time, I just brushed it off as no personality test is 100% and theres no cookie cutter personality. As time goes by though, I begin to wonder if its not so much me being an odd INTJ, than me not actually being an INTJ. Some of these traits I'm talking about are;
    • Academics, I'm told INTJs tend to excel and thrive in such an environment, I do not. I hate school of all types, and I do poorly in such environment (though my grades are ok). I have a slight loathing of people who make Academics their life.


    • Intellectual hobbies/strength. INTJs seem to be interested in the maths and sciences. I personally detest the two, and while I had fairly good grades in college, I am not that bright. Its one of the reasons I vist INTJ forums rarely, they talk over my head.


    • Tact and Diplomacy. Viewing some of these forums and listening to others talk about them, INTJs seem to be lacking in these departments. There are times at work when a friend of mine (an ENTJ) will say things to customers and I give a slight shudder, thinking that that could have been more tactful and with a different tone. I'm no Jimmy Carter, but I am careful to adopt proper tones and speaking voice when dealing with people, to put them at ease. Unless I'm very tired, then I become cold in manner because I simply don't care anymore and I've had my fill.


    • Confidence and decisiveness, I'm told INTJs have this in abundance. I have zero confidence the majority of the time. I question everything I do, and when I begin to try and judge myself on something, I never trust my own self-view. Thats why when it comes to anything that allows me to personalize or give input on my personality I freeze up. I'll take days of indecision over the stupidest things, simply because it involves me choosing something based on my personal preference.


    • Constructiveness, the internet tells me INTJs are constructive and always working on something or another. I am a lazy. I'm not proud of it, but I always rationalize one way or the other not to do something. Zero projects at this moment, and most of the last couple of year.


    • Religion. Most INTJs don't believe in God. I do. Not an expert apologist, but I try to read every apologetic article I can. So far I've read some pretty well thought out arguments. Granted this last item isn't a personality trait per say, but atheism seems a common theme among INTJs.


    Again, I understand that not every INTJ is going to be the exact same. But I am curious of other people's take on these differences, and if maybe all these tests I've been taking have been wrong about me.

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    Senior Member TenebrousReflection's Avatar
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    There are times where I get in a more thinking oriented mood and consider the possibility that I might be an INTJ or INTP, but when it comes to considering INTJ, I nearly always rule out that option because I don't have that motivated drive to succeed academically that I perceive as being a key trait of INTJs. I also relate to some of the other things you mention, but the two INTJ traits I see as type defining for them are the drive for success and their certainty of being right - I don't think they are certain about everything tho, so I would not be as quick to equate it to decisiveness, but if you don't frequently feel absolutely certain about about some very specific things, I do think that would be a good reason to consider other types.

    Since I do not type myself as an NT, my perceptions may be even further off than I realize, but based on what you have written, I do not see inconstancy with the INTP type, so you may want to ask yourself what about INTJ you do strongly relate to and what about INTP you do not relate to, and of course its good to keep an open mind to all the other type options just in case.

    Reading detailed type descriptions is in my opinion a much better way to try to find your type than taking tests to do it.
    (the onyl thing thats consistant for me on typolgy tests is introversion and intuition preferences, so I made my conclusion largly decision on descriptions of types)

    It does seem odd for any NT to not be interested in math and science, but I don't think its nescessarily a pre-requisite of all NTs
    I don't see any reason INTJs can't be tactful - there is a desire to be straightforward and honest, but that does not completely rule out being tactful.
    Regarding constructiveness, I think the question to ask would be how often you actually complete things you do start - uncompleted projects is a common trait among percievers.
    I know at least 1 INTJs that is not an athiest, but they are also not strongly religious.
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  3. #3
    Member Frostshade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TenebrousReflection View Post

    Since I do not type myself as an NT, my perceptions may be even further off than I realize, but based on what you have written, I do not see inconstancy with the INTP type, so you may want to ask yourself what about INTJ you do strongly relate to and what about INTP you do not relate to, and of course its good to keep an open mind to all the other type options just in case.
    The one test I took, that measured the traits in relation to ended up like this: Extroversion 5% Introversion 95%, Sensing 21% Intuition 79%, Thinking 74% Feeling 26%, Judging 53% Perceiving 47%.
    While the first three sets are obviously lop-sided, the J and P are awfully borderline. I'll take a look at INTP as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by TenebrousReflection View Post
    Reading detailed type descriptions is in my opinion a much better way to try to find your type than taking tests to do it.
    (the onyl thing thats consistant for me on typolgy tests is introversion and intuition preferences, so I made my conclusion largly decision on descriptions of types)
    I don't know about that, but using your method comes back to me not trusting myself with self-evaluation. It actually been a private belief of mine that the worst person to do a evaluation of you is yourself. I'll read something like, 'Do you like exercise?' and I'll think that yeah, exercise can be nice. Immediately afterwards a part of me goes 'But you don't really *like* it. I mean look at yourself. This is more for people who are athletic. Do you enjoy being athletic is what this means' You see? That is why what is a simple decision for some people is a drawn out process with me. I guess I share the perfectionist trait with INTJs at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by TenebrousReflection View Post
    Regarding constructiveness, I think the question to ask would be how often you actually complete things you do start - uncompleted projects is a common trait among percievers.
    That DOES sound like me. And I hate it. I hate it with a PASSION. My mother does this all the time and it feels me with disgust. Could me why I feel like garbage when I reflect on everything I don't have done.

    Quote Originally Posted by TenebrousReflection View Post
    I know at least 1 INTJs that is not an athiest, but they are also not strongly religious.
    Well if you ever need to know a 2nd (AND a strong one) just remember C.S. Lewis.

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    Senior Member King sns's Avatar
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    I feel like everything you put in your OP may be the sign of a "faux" INTJ. Meaning, that you're not the faux INTJ here- the people who drown themselves in academics and status are often just a big showy put-on. I'm not saying that all people who do this are phonies, I just don't think that it's the criteria for being INTJ.

    Also, as an off topic strength of academics doesn't always necessarily equate to strength of mind- for some people who make the biggest discoveries, I think the opposite is true. Instead of looking to others works and discussing them, their thoughts are original and genuinely out of the box.
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    Member Frostshade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shortnsweet View Post
    I feel like everything you put in your OP may be the sign of a "faux" INTJ. Meaning, that you're not the faux INTJ here- the people who drown themselves in academics and status are often just a big showy put-on. I'm not saying that all people who do this are phonies, I just don't think that it's the criteria for being INTJ.

    Also, as an off topic strength of academics doesn't always necessarily equate to strength of mind- for some people who make the biggest discoveries, I think the opposite is true. Instead of looking to others works and discussing them, their thoughts are original and genuinely out of the box.
    Oh I know that. Another reason I don't visit INTJ forums that much, I know some of them are putting on a show. And I know some act like jerks and hide behind their type. But I have noticed that when they do talk over my head, by accident or by putting on airs, they seem to genuinely know what they are talking about and care about it. What I listed are very big generalities. There just seem to be a lot of them that are inconsistent with myself. As for academics I agree with you. Academics annoys me because it seems inefficient and hollow when pursued for its own sake or by itself. When I was in school they taught me advanced algebra, now that I'm 28 and have been through four jobs trying to make ends barely meet, I wish they had taught me how not to spend money like a moron. I'll take wisdom over intelligence any day.

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    Member Jwill's Avatar
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    I think you sound like an INTX. You have a mixture of INTP traits and INTJ traits. The indecisiveness and lack of confidence were red flags that you don't completely fit the INTJ model. Other things, like your belief in God, your laziness, and your dislike of math/science and academics are traits that I've witnessed in many different INTJs. Have you ever taken the socionics or big 5 personality tests? Those might shed some light on your personality. If you think you over-analyze questions and give biased answers, you should ask a close friend or family member who knows MBTI to type you.

    I also agree that there are many annoying faux INTJs out there. I really can't stand all the pathetic talk of world domination on this board sometimes. In real life, I'm friends with a bunch of INTJs, and they aren't gigantic academic assholes/snobs. They're fairly normal, mature adults who like to have intellectual conversations, nerdy conversations, and a couple of beers on occasion. I think some people, especially guys, are drawn to being labeled as INTJ. INTJs are often characterized in the media as wildcards, evil geniuses, heartless bastards, free-thinkers, and independent wanderers. Those are perceived as "manly, " yet unique character traits.

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    Member Jwill's Avatar
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    I think you sound like an INTX. You have a mixture of INTP traits and INTJ traits. The indecisiveness and lack of confidence were red flags that you don't completely fit the INTJ model. Other things, like your belief in God, your laziness, and your dislike of math/science and academics are traits that I've witnessed in many different INTJs. Have you ever taken the socionics or big 5 personality tests? Those might shed some light on your personality. If you think you over-analyze questions and give biased answers, you should ask a close friend or family member who knows MBTI to type you.

    I also agree that there are many annoying faux INTJs out there. I really can't stand all the pathetic talk of world domination on this board sometimes. In real life, I'm friends with a bunch of INTJs, and they aren't gigantic academic assholes/snobs. They're fairly normal, mature adults who like to have intellectual conversations, nerdy conversations, and a couple of beers on occasion. I think some people, especially guys, are drawn to being labeled as INTJ. INTJs are often characterized in the media as wildcards, evil geniuses, heartless bastards, free-thinkers, and independent wanderers. Those are perceived as "manly, " yet unique character traits.

  8. #8
    Member Frostshade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jwill View Post
    I think you sound like an INTX. You have a mixture of INTP traits and INTJ traits. The indecisiveness and lack of confidence were red flags that you don't completely fit the INTJ model. Other things, like your belief in God, your laziness, and your dislike of math/science and academics are traits that I've witnessed in many different INTJs. Have you ever taken the socionics or big 5 personality tests? Those might shed some light on your personality. If you think you over-analyze questions and give biased answers, you should ask a close friend or family member who knows MBTI to type you.
    I haven't take those but I will make an attempt to take those after work today. As for asking friends and family, well I don't share anything with my family as we are not close. I have very very few friends, and none of them are familiar with this nor am I inclined to share this much information with them. I point once again to the strong introversion.

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    we non math and sci int s do seem to be outnumbered, but I think there is more than one way to apply ones n and t and perhaps we like to examine other ideas and constructs in a less linear way.

    I have known some border infj s who really work their t when engaged in analysis or synthesis of information so look like a T but have an F s ability to deal with people. the f also seems to somehow lead to procrastination in some areas---even without the P. perhaps the intune-ness that the f provides exposes them to competing possibilities of action ----so more valuable ideas on how to spend time than a typ intj would consider---looking more like an intp compeled by their p to consider all possibilities

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    Senior Member TenebrousReflection's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frostshade View Post
    I don't know about that, but using your method comes back to me not trusting myself with self-evaluation. It actually been a private belief of mine that the worst person to do a evaluation of you is yourself. I'll read something like, 'Do you like exercise?' and I'll think that yeah, exercise can be nice. Immediately afterwards a part of me goes 'But you don't really *like* it. I mean look at yourself. This is more for people who are athletic. Do you enjoy being athletic is what this means' You see? That is why what is a simple decision for some people is a drawn out process with me. I guess I share the perfectionist trait with INTJs at least.
    When you take a personality test, you are basically doing the same thing. You are comparing your point of reference to 2 (or more) variables and choosing which is more like you than the other one, but with a more detailed description, you have additional context to base the comparison on. When I take a personality test, unless the wording is very precise, I can usually think of several different contexts each variable choice could be taken in, and its not uncommon for that to result in me answering differently depending on what I think they may have meant vs what it could have meant.

    When you read a good description of a type, there is usually enough surrounding detail and context to say if it fits you or not. If you feel a weak connection (this is a little like me, but not exactly), that's still worth considering, but only if you feel that about all the types you read about - it won't be this way for everyone, but many people do feel a very strong connection once they finally read a type description that actually fits them.

    INTP Central has a very well written profile/description of INTPs that I would highly recommend reading.

    I did some searching to try to find an equivalent description of INTJs, but I did not find one as comprehensive as that, but you can try these links for additional INTJ reading. Conversations with
    Conceptualizer Directors
    and Portrait of an INTJ

    If you are not comfortable with that method, a test that attempts to determine the preference strength of each of your cognitive functions may give you additional information to work with.

    I found this test with a quick google search and I don't think I've tried that one myself so I don't know how good it is, but I'm sure others more familiar with cognitive function theory can recommend better tests if thats not a good one - at least its a starting point.
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