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  1. #1
    Member Ozzy26's Avatar
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    Default Hypothetical question for ENFJs regarding backstabbing

    ENFJs, put yourself in this hypothetical scenario.

    You are a part of a program. A program that you really believe in and put yourself behind. This program, in a nutshell, helps to give people a second chance and rebuild their broken lives. You are essentially making a living off helping other people based in exactly your own area of expertise. You aren't the owner of this program nor do you run it. You are a very integral part of it and it could not be as successful as it is without you, but you do not make the final decisions. Final decisions which you disagree with more than not. You think that if you were running this program and had your way, you could really make a difference and things would run a lot smoother.

    So put yourself in this position. Lets say you thought this program, the main focus of your life, was being run into the ground. Lets say you STRONGLY believe that the owners will sooner or later kill this program if they keep running it how they are. Now here's the question: If given the chance, would you backstab these owners in an attempt to take over this program and save it?

    Any NF is free to answer really, but I'm interested in what the ENFJs here have to say.

  2. #2
    Senior Member Lookin4theBestNU's Avatar
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    Finding win/wins is something that I always strive to do so when solving serious issues involving others. It's been a rare circumstance (none that I can think of in recent memory) where resorting to such tactics was necessary. If I thought that there was no way of saving the program otherwise and this was the only available method that would be successful to do so then the answer would be yes.
    "At points of clarity, I realize that my life on earth is meaningless, and that I am merely a pawn in a bigger game. A game I cannot possibly understand or have control of. Thankfully, before depression sets in, I drift back into my cloudy, bewildered daily routine." **Joel Patrick Warneke**

  3. #3
    Senior Member Malkavia's Avatar
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    If an NF would be able to rationalize it to themselves, then yes.

    I can see (and may HAVE seen) an ENFJ do this...

  4. #4
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    Hi, I'm an ENFJ. With a P


    Here's what I would attempt, in order, until something finally happened:
    • Attempt to understand their reasoning and see exactly how their decisions might be beneficial
    • Talk to the owners about my concerns in a genuine and heartfelt way (especially given the nature of our business), also cluing them into the fact that I understand their perspective
    • Talk to the owners about my concerns by digging up facts, figures, and reasoning that support my case, being direct with the owners about the problem
    • Do whatever it takes to get myself promoted, perhaps to a position where I've got more clout
    • Take over the operation
    • Make the decisions that I'm going to make without regard to what they think, regardless of my position


    Things that are not on this list because I don't do them: guilt-tripping, emotional appeal

    (yes, I'd rather just take over the organization than guilt-trip the owners.)

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ozzy26 View Post
    So put yourself in this position. Lets say you thought this program, the main focus of your life, was being run into the ground. Lets say you STRONGLY believe that the owners will sooner or later kill this program if they keep running it how they are. Now here's the question: If given the chance, would you backstab these owners in an attempt to take over this program and save it?
    Can you be a little more specific as to the kind of “backstabbing” you are referring to. Are you talking about simply out maneuvering the owners through some kind of business strategy and using some kind office politics? Or are you referring to something that goes completely against the ENFJs values? If you are referring to the latter then I think it poses a completely different situation. Because one thing that I have learned as an evolving ENFJ that used to rationalize a lot of things is that the ends do not always justify the means.

    Quote Originally Posted by Malkavia View Post
    If an NF would be able to rationalize it to themselves, then yes.

    I can see (and may HAVE seen) an ENFJ do this...
    This is true. But there’s a big difference between an ENFJ that rationalizes things and truly believes it, as opposed to an ENFJ that rationalizes something but still knows that what they did was wrong. Any ENFJ that rationalizes something and truly believes it is just plain ignorant. An evolved ENFJ will respond to a situation like this in two ways: either it will be a plain and simple no because it conflicts too much with our internal values or it will be a conscious rationalization with the awareness that what we did was not right, but we had to make a tough decision.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Malkavia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedruM View Post
    An evolved ENFJ will respond to a situation like this in two ways: either it will be a plain and simple no because it conflicts too much with our internal values or it will be a conscious rationalization with the awareness that what we did was not right, but we had to make a tough decision.
    Either way, if they feel like they need to they are taking over that organization.
    Last edited by Lady_X; 12-23-2013 at 09:06 PM.

  7. #7
    Member Ozzy26's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedruM View Post
    Can you be a little more specific as to the kind of “backstabbing” you are referring to. Are you talking about simply out maneuvering the owners through some kind of business strategy and using some kind office politics?
    This. I'd imagine it would be fairly easy with all that ENFJ charisma.
    Last edited by Lady_X; 12-23-2013 at 09:06 PM.

  8. #8
    Junior Member NæturVindur's Avatar
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    I wouldn't consider taking over the company to make it better as "back-stabbing." I would have no problem rising to the top of some organization I love in order to make it run better. I am, in fact, in the middle of doing exactly that with a club at my school. It wasn't running the way I wanted it to, so I got myself onto the exec-board, and will make it run the way I like.
    Keep me away from the wisdom which does not cry,
    the philosophy which does not laugh,
    and the greatness which does not bow before children.
    -Khalil Gibran

    Fe=Ni>Ne=Ti>Te>Fi>>Se>Si

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by NæturVindur View Post
    I wouldn't consider taking over the company to make it better as "back-stabbing." I would have no problem rising to the top of some organization I love in order to make it run better. I am, in fact, in the middle of doing exactly that with a club at my school. It wasn't running the way I wanted it to, so I got myself onto the exec-board, and will make it run the way I like.
    +1 I totally agree with this. I think "back-stabbing" was the wrong word choice. I see ENFJ "back-stabbing" as more ruining others' reputations to get what they want.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ozzy26 View Post
    This. I'd imagine it would be fairly easy with all that ENFJ charisma.
    Indeed it would be. That is why I wanted to know what kind of backstabbing you were referring to because the word "backstabbing" has a highly negative connotation to it.

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