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  1. #11
    Aspiring Troens Ridder KLessard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CuriousFeeling View Post
    This is something I even tell myself when I envision hypothetical situations of meeting someone remotely famous. I know that the connection I desire is the same I have in the music, and that is really difficult. Perhaps it could be an indication that I'm trying to connect with a part of his personality that I see reflected in me, or trying to achieve self-actualization.

    A lot of hero "worship" I think is just us figuring out who we are. We are essentially looking at traits we see in them and how they are related to us, or traits that we wish to have.

    But we can turn the yearning to meet someone into something constructive by creating works of art, poetry, etc. and fostering our own personal growth. Heck, I never thought I would ever songwrite before, I would always play music I had in front of me, but now I'm creating my own works. Essentially it's like putting your hero's influences into your own work. I learned in psych class that in order for us to have motivation to do things, the goals must be realistic yet challenging. Thus, it would be a realistic goal to learn to songwrite and practice music to recreate the sound of the musician you like. Not exactly the thing that yields the ultimate happiness (getting Utilitarian here), but if you add up the small things that make you happy, they will all add up and it's a longer sustaining effect. Going higher up to the level of happiness you desire then quickly coming down from it won't yield sustaining happiness.

    It can be possible that the passion and connection you feel from your heroes can be used to the NF benefit for helping others to realize their full potential too.
    It sure does inspire me! I have gone beyond my own abilities, surprising myself of what I was able to achieve because of such powerful inspiration. But the disappointment of the "meeting" is wounding and will make you crawl flat on the floor for months.

  2. #12
    From the Undertow CuriousFeeling's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KLessard View Post
    It sure does inspire me! I have gone beyond my own abilities, surprising myself of what I was able to achieve because of such powerful inspiration. But the disappointment of the "meeting" is wounding and will make you crawl flat on the floor for months.
    On that note, I thought about even if I did work with or met my hero, when I'd have to leave I'd really be a wreck afterwards because the whole thing might not even happen again.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    Johari/Nohari

    “Thoughts are the shadows of our feelings -- always darker, emptier and simpler.”
    ― Friedrich Nietzsche




  3. #13
    にゃん runvardh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KLessard View Post
    So true. This is where you get the reality check. Ideal human beings don't exist. This is where you must choose to love your role model as he/she is: imperfect and sometimes hurtful.
    But what if the very thing you looked up to them for was really just a lie? What if you've come to a point in your life when your own successes surpass them? These days there are people around who have certain traits I'd like eventually; but those traits tend to be singular and the person being someone am neutral about, or sometimes dislike. That is my reality.
    Dreams are best served manifest and tangible.

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    I accept no responsibility, what so ever, for the fact that I exist; I do, however, accept full responsibility for what I do while I exist.

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  4. #14
    Head Pigeon Mad Hatter's Avatar
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    Can't really say that I'm much into idealizing other people. I'm quite the opposite - once I get fascinated by a famous person, I research things about them in order to find some flaw (I guess it makes them more credible and interesting to me.)

    (I was really amazed to find out that the historical Siddartha allegedly died of dysentery after eating a spoiled piece of pork.)
    IN SERIO FATVITAS.

    -τὸ γὰρ γράμμα ἀποκτέννει, τὸ δὲ πνεῦμα ζῳοποιεῖ-

  5. #15
    Aspiring Troens Ridder KLessard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by runvardh View Post
    But what if the very thing you looked up to them for was really just a lie? What if you've come to a point in your life when your own successes surpass them? These days there are people around who have certain traits I'd like eventually; but those traits tend to be singular and the person being someone am neutral about, or sometimes dislike. That is my reality.
    I'm not sure I get this. Could you expand or paraphrase, Runvardh?

    I do think that when you idealize a person, you seek and hope to find personal ideals there. That person certainly has beautiful things in her. But they might not be your ideals. This is where it gets interesting. As you begin to see this, you have to choose to love the person, not the ideals. The role model I was referring to before (an ISFJ) has disappointed me many times. But then, I realized I really appreciated her as a person, and decided to love her as she was. At that moment, I started to see very noble ideals in her, but different ones than mine, among them loyalty to her family and to her culture and trying to be good and caring about everybody at the same time (what a challenge, but well...).


    I will share my personal spiritual convictions here. Take it or leave it, that's up to you. The reason we seek ideals in people is because ideals don't exist on their own, they are linked to a person. God. That's where hero worship can become unhealthy and idolatrous.

    I love this quote from C.S. Lewis:

    "We were made for God. Only by being a manifestation of his beauty, loving-kindness, wisdom or goodness, has any earthly Beloved excited our love. It is not that we have loved them too much, but that we did not quite understand what we were loving. It is not that we shall be asked to turn from them, so dearly familiar, to a Stranger. When we see the face of God we shall know that we have always known it. He has been a party to, has made, sustained and moved moment by moment within, all our earthly experiences of innocent love. All that was true love in them was, even on earth, far more His than ours, and ours only because His. In Heaven there will be no anguish an no duty of turning away from our earthly Beloveds. First, because we shall have turned already; from the rivulets to the Fountain, from the creatures He made lovable to Love Himself. But secondly, because we shall find them all in Him. By loving Him more than them we shall love them more than we now do." (C. S. Lewis, The Four Loves- Charity)

  6. #16
    にゃん runvardh's Avatar
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    Unfortunately having my own trouble with God, though I'm certain all the issues have something to do with me. I've tried to yeld, but all that seems to happen is depression and lonliness.

    As to further explanations on my issues with other humans: that which I loved about my uncle, as I grew up proved to be false; the things I aspired to pertaining to my father, I have already surpassed. Also my uncle is now only a shadow of the man he used to be and in nearly every way positive I now look down on my father rather than up at him. Other random people have single traits that are nice, but the rest of who they are does not impress me or causes me disgust. This is the best I can explain it, any further would require a mind link and even that I'm thinking would only be 50% helpful.
    Dreams are best served manifest and tangible.

    INFP, 6w7, IEI

    I accept no responsibility, what so ever, for the fact that I exist; I do, however, accept full responsibility for what I do while I exist.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  7. #17
    Aspiring Troens Ridder KLessard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by runvardh View Post
    Unfortunately having my own trouble with God, though I'm certain all the issues have something to do with me. I've tried to yield, but all that seems to happen is depression and lonliness.

    As to further explanations on my issues with other humans: that which I loved about my uncle, as I grew up proved to be false; the things I aspired to pertaining to my father, I have already surpassed. Also my uncle is now only a shadow of the man he used to be and in nearly every way positive I now look down on my father rather than up at him. Other random people have single traits that are nice, but the rest of who they are does not impress me or causes me disgust. This is the best I can explain it, any further would require a mind link and even that I'm thinking would only be 50% helpful.
    Yeah, family is a whole different thing to me. My late INFP father was a very knowledgeable man, even though not a scholar at all, but he had great memory and taught me a million things. When I grew older and went to university, I came to a point where I started to see my father in a different way. I still loved him dearly, but was aware that he couldn't do much for me or teach me anymore. It happens.
    I think you have to accept these men's flaws and love them as they are, even if you are disappointed.
    I think I'm starting to see your point...
    You feel like there isn't anybody you can look up to?
    I think it's a healthy place to be in a way, seeing good things in some people, but being realistic about who they really are. I think what you need is inspiration.
    I will pray for you. God is something different from your father or your father figures. He is not limited.

  8. #18
    にゃん runvardh's Avatar
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    I said nothing about not loving my uncle or father. I need inspiration in an area that is actually going to work and make me happy instead of just one or the other. I also know that God isn't the limited one, it's me, and so far my only help there is if he destroys me.
    Dreams are best served manifest and tangible.

    INFP, 6w7, IEI

    I accept no responsibility, what so ever, for the fact that I exist; I do, however, accept full responsibility for what I do while I exist.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  9. #19
    Senior Member Lacey's Avatar
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    I have the tendency to idolize pretty much anyone. I have to consciously remind myself that they are merely human beings. Otherwise I get into this really bad emotional rollercoaster of being giddy because I think they're awesome, and then comparing myself to them and getting really depressed that I don't measure up. It's not good for me at all.

    I also tend to idolize people who are similar to me in some small (but seemingly significant) way, so that I feel that I have a strong connection to them...but they're different enough that I can't actually hope to be like them. It gets me down. I have to learn how to be myself, and decide what kind of person I want to become...without using other peoples as models so much. Judging from how things in my life have gone so far...I'll probably do something different than anyone I've seen, so I have to be more independent in this area.

    I fantasize about meeting certain people, but in reality I know it'd be terrible. I'm socially awkward, and the people I like tend to be socially awkward when they're not in performance mode. So it'd be pretty bad all around. ahaha

    And real-life heroes... I think I've only had a few. It's kind of bittersweet, I guess. They usually leave my life for one reason or another. My tap teacher was my major one most recently, but now she's a little wrapped up with other things besides tap dance (she just got married) and isn't really able to spend a ton of time mentoring me. (Yes, I'm needy and selfish.) But besides that, she's changed a lot in the past year or so, and I'm not sure I relate to her as well anymore... Anyway, I like having these kinds of people, because I learn and grow so much because of them, but once our time together is done I feel kind of lost. Right now, there's no one in particular I look up to, so I'm left to my own devices and I'm a little uninspired...

    I know a lot of people consider their parents/grandparents heroes. I do, to a certain extent. I would call my mom and grandma my heroes, because of everything they've taught me and done for me. However, I don't necessarily want to make the same life decisions they've made...I don't want to mimic them. It makes me think that I have to change my personal definition of hero.

    I think heroes are good if you decide what thing(s) you like about that person, and try to work for those skills. Learn things from them, basically. But getting all wrapped up, emotionally, with them as a whole? Not so much.

    I think I've decided that I need to be my own hero.

  10. #20
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    Not me at all. Take a look at my signature. Words I live by. I can admire someone's work and see value in it but I will always want to approach things in my own way.

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