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  1. #11
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    I think that one side of the story is not said here.

    Time.
    Billions of years and hundered millionth part of a second are also counter-intuintive.

  2. #12
    Senior Member kuranes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GZA View Post
    I have always sort of felt that the world was counter intuitive................ I've come to notice that everything really is different than what it seems, different in that it likely functions in the opposite way you would have assumed.
    Everything ? I wonder what has reinforced our "intuitiveness" ( versus the counter ) through generations, or "evolution", then ?
    Quote Originally Posted by GZA View Post
    I think humanity is the perfect example. If you want people to like you, the last thing you want to do is try to impress them, as nothing will impress them less. The last way to win a girl is to show her your affection. The most charismatic person is the one who needs your attention the least, ect.
    This is so true, what you are saying. Like the old joke about the bank that is happy to give you a loan as long as you can prove that you don't need it. ( Although I guess they relaxed on this rule more recently. )

    It always made sense to me ( because of what I observed ) when people would tell me that the way to attract certain people was to act like they didn't matter much to you. ( This is sometimes termed "playing hard to get" or "ivory tower" etc. ) But it surprised me the first time I heard it, for the very reason that it was counter-intuitive, I guess.

    I also noticed that it didn't always hold true. I might meet someone who shared an obscure interest, and ( as soon as we recognized this to be so ) we would be so mutually enthusiastic about stumbling across such a person that it was almost funny. Of course, we weren't trying to "impress" one another, but it could still be said that we offered "too much information" for the liking of most people.

    Confession - I keep forgetting that I am supposed to be operating in this counter-intuitive way and thus often screwing up the first steps of meeting people that I really find interesting. When I am being stand-offish with someone who I don't find interesting, I am sometimes on the other side of this "game" without even intending to be. Someone might think I am trying to be aloof just to get them to "give" more, and thus try even harder. But I am not playing the game. I really don't find them terribly interesting.

    I will wonder at times how I am supposed to simultaneously reach out to someone new/strange, introducing myself in some way, and yet seem as though I don't really care all that much about meeting them, simultaneously. It seems a contradiction, although I would agree that one doesn't have to be "extremely extreme" just to feel natural.

    People have mixed feelings about some related "systems" of meeting people and "negging" them etc. when the subject is singles, and they say ( quite naturally, it seems to me ) that instead of doing this one should "be yourself". Somehow they seem to miss that "being yourself" might mean accidentally "coming on too strong" if you genuinely are intrigued by the other person. Especially if you both are strangers and will likely never meet again.

    I almost have to hope that the people I meet are neither those who I have an antipathy for, nor those who strike me quickly as someone that would really be great to know. That way I can apparently strike the balance I am supposed to have - of showing only an intense but extremely brief/abbreviated interest, ....or showing only perfunctory interest.

    The question of how a hypothetical someone could strike me so quickly as being "very worth getting to know" comes up, but ( without derailing the thread ) I can only tell you that it does in fact happen often enough that I wish I knew the answer to the quandary. ( Sometimes I may have prior information on the person even though we are only meeting for the first time, and sometimes it may be something I just sense about them ...intuitively. )
    "The people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them that they are being attacked and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism, and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country."
    Reichsfuhrer Herman Goering at the Nuremburg trials.

  3. #13
    Senior Member Anja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nocapszy View Post
    Yeah. The point is, the scientists are pwning the shit out of religion and other such nonsense, which are only given rise to conceptual existence through poor observation.
    As I read the OP I thought about the "original," nature -oriented state of man and also that in many ways science has alienated us from that.

    I don't recall a time in my life when my spirituality wasn't connected to the world about me and the vaster Universe which I conceptualize. Also the microcosms.

    But I don't think that science and nature have to be opposing inclinations. That kind of black and white thinking IS alienating, from my perspective. It seems to me that everything "fits" together in mysterious ways.

    I've frequently read that as scientists get closer to understanding the mechanics of the Universe many of them are clarifying a undeveloped sense of spirituality.
    "No ray of sunshine is ever lost, but the green which it awakes into existence needs time to sprout, and it is not always granted to the sower to see the harvest. All work that is worth anything is done in faith." - Albert Schweitzer

  4. #14
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anja View Post
    As I read the OP I thought about the "original," nature -oriented state of man and also that in many ways science has alienated us from that.

    I don't recall a time in my life when my spirituality wasn't connected to the world about me and the vaster Universe which I conceptualize. Also the microcosms.

    But I don't think that science and nature have to be opposing inclinations. That kind of black and white thinking IS alienating, from my perspective. It seems to me that everything "fits" together in mysterious ways.

    I've frequently read that as scientists get closer to understanding the mechanics of the Universe many of them are clarifying a undeveloped sense of spirituality.
    Some scientists are getting more spiritual because they have emotions and often scientific truth not only that it is very abstract but it is also very cold.


    They need spirituality simply to stay in conntact with their "human side".

  5. #15
    Senior Member Anja's Avatar
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    I don't know about the "sanity" part, Antisocial one, but I do believe that most all people have a spiritual component.
    "No ray of sunshine is ever lost, but the green which it awakes into existence needs time to sprout, and it is not always granted to the sower to see the harvest. All work that is worth anything is done in faith." - Albert Schweitzer

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anja View Post
    I don't know about the "sanity" part, Antisocial one, but I do believe that most all people have a spiritual component.
    This fluctuates from part to part of the world.


    How does the concept known as "Eternal night" sounds to you?

  7. #17
    Once Was Synarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kuranes View Post
    He's just being antisocial.
    I find it interesting that Antisocial posts to a message board, an inherently social medium. Seems inconsistent.
    "Create like a god, command like a king, work like a slave."

  8. #18
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    I think that one side of the story is not said here.

    Time.
    Billions of years and hundered millionth part of a second are also counter-intuintive.
    This is an excellent point.

  9. #19
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    Default The Antidote

    Quote Originally Posted by NoahFence View Post
    ?
    I guess, from what the "literate" have continually said, I always figured the big war of ideology right now was in -how- to be illiterate, etc.
    You might say the war for illiteracy and innumeracy is led by Jean-Jacques Rousseau from the Eighteen Century.

    Jean-Jacques gave us the ideology of, "The Noble Savage".

    This is a powerful ideology that still plays on our guilt and nostalgia.

    And it still prevents us from applying the only known antidote to tribalism.

    And the antidote to tribalism is literacy and numeracy.

    And it is also completely fascinating that literacy and numeracy are also the antidote to the noosphere.

    So the noosphere and tribalism have much in common - not least being their antidote.

  10. #20
    Senior Member Anja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post


    How does the concept known as "Eternal night" sounds to you?
    It used to sound terrifying but as I creep closer to what may be "eternal night" it sounds like, if it exists, (which I doubt) a good, long and well-deserved rest!

    "However" will be okay, cuz what are my options?
    "No ray of sunshine is ever lost, but the green which it awakes into existence needs time to sprout, and it is not always granted to the sower to see the harvest. All work that is worth anything is done in faith." - Albert Schweitzer

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