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  1. #141
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
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    you're not reading.my words right then riva
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  2. #142

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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackCat View Post
    I actually relate to this. Maybe you have an 8 wing? I don't consider myself a doormat. But it's like I have a really hard time not considering others or understanding the consequences. It's just kinda natural for me. I have no problems with consoling people and it makes me happy to know that others benefit from my presence.

    A healthy 9 will often go more toward 3, and unlock some sudden energy I think. I have kinda done this, and it's like when I'm not healthy I feel really sluggish. But it's like when I am healthy I am full of energy and very serene. I rarely get elated. The whole "people become part of you" thing sounds really 9 sx. I do that too. It's like I pick up on things that I like and make them apart of myself. You have never seemed very 7 nor soc last to me. Now we know why!

    Also I think that type 9 sp last may be less obvious, since 9 seems kinda sp in and of itself. Might have to do some reading to understand that, but I think it would manifest about being chill about your belongings and maybe not stressing money or resources that much.
    good, this.
    Masculine presenting transgender lesbian


    At heart, I’ll always be a bleeding heart liberal.

  3. #143

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady_X View Post
    yes...i stress less about money or any sort of major life component than anyone else i know. and reading that 9's sort of have this magical type thinking like it will all just work out...that just resonates...i do just do what i can and not stress much about the things that i can't fix yet.

    not sure about instincts yet but are you saying you think i'm sx/so?
    Yes, that is somewhat true, and in my experience, I get annoyed or stressed out when people want to discuss financial matters. It doesn't matter, my wife could be speaking positively about our financial status. Like, we might have all of our bills met for the month and have some money left over, but it will still stress me out to think or talk about it.
    Masculine presenting transgender lesbian


    At heart, I’ll always be a bleeding heart liberal.

  4. #144
    Entertaining Cracker five sounds's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fuzzy Conduit View Post
    Yes, that is somewhat true, and in my experience, I get annoyed or stressed out when people want to discuss financial matters. It doesn't matter, my wife could be speaking positively about our financial status. Like, we might have all of our bills met for the month and have some money left over, but it will still stress me out to think or talk about it.
    i relate strongly to that.
    You hem me in -- behind and before;
    you have laid your hand upon me.
    Such knowledge is too wonderful for me,
    too lofty for me to attain.

  5. #145

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kasper View Post
    Pay attention to the annoyance, does it result in resentment and resistance? If so ponder if you feel dismissed as those are things that for a 9 come from anger. I've never met a 9 who did not at some point claim to not feel angry, I've also not met a 9 who does not experience anger.

    I would suspect Sx/So as well, fwiw. Whatever the case I would think Sp last.
    I think that 9s, despite a serene outward appearance, might have more potential than any other type for deep, fiery anger which others may not always see, but it will burn through if not kept in check or dealt with. Under that calm surface can be a great deal of conflict. 9s want to have peace within themselves and amongst other people, but at the same time they can burn with anger or resentment that might surface in a way which will surprise others, even the people who think they know the 9 well. The first time my wife saw my angry side, I smashed a mirror with my bare fist. This might be more true in the case of 9s with an 8 wing? I don't know so much about 9w1.

    edit: when expressed, my anger isn't always physical. It can often be expressed in words that can be very damaging and hurtful. When I lose control and unleash a verbal onslaught, it's like I can see and hear myself doing it but can't stop it. When it's done, I often feel regret at having fucked up my zen and hurt someone's feelings. Also, being ISTP, I have a very Ti way of criticizing others when I am frustrated or angry. It doesn't happen often, but when it does, it can be very brutal and honest.
    Masculine presenting transgender lesbian


    At heart, I’ll always be a bleeding heart liberal.

  6. #146

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady_X View Post
    that type 7 description i read was just all about being a materialistic sensation experience junky person when in moderate to low health levels.
    My sister is ENFP and probably a 7 (8 wing, maybe). Obviously my interaction with you has been limited, but so far you are nothing like her. The description of materialistic junky or whatever rather well sums her up in her unhealthiest state, sadly. Not to bash 7s or anything.
    Masculine presenting transgender lesbian


    At heart, I’ll always be a bleeding heart liberal.

  7. #147
    Entertaining Cracker five sounds's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fuzzy Conduit View Post
    My sister is ENFP and probably a 7 (8 wing, maybe). Obviously my interaction with you has been limited, but so far you are nothing like her. The description of materialistic junky or whatever rather well sums her up in her unhealthiest state, sadly. Not to bash 7s or anything.
    are you sure that's not an instinctual variant thing? even at my worst, and maybe especially at my worst, i really don't think i'm materialistic at all. at my worst, i'm completely overwhelmed with a million ideas swirling at once, maybe prone to paranoia, and otherwise completely paralyzed (unless it's some big change now). i'm very idea > thing focused, at every stage of health.

    i do like little odd nick-nacks (either artful, cultural, or otherwise quirky), but they really aren't important to me, and in a moment of panic i'd surely sell them or abandon them over clinging to them. and i spend next to no money or time on obtaining them. when i splurge it's on nice meals or traveling/activities.
    You hem me in -- behind and before;
    you have laid your hand upon me.
    Such knowledge is too wonderful for me,
    too lofty for me to attain.

  8. #148

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    Quote Originally Posted by five sounds View Post
    are you sure that's not an instinctual variant thing? even at my worst, and maybe especially at my worst, i really don't think i'm materialistic at all. at my worst, i'm completely overwhelmed with a million ideas swirling at once, maybe prone to paranoia, and otherwise completely paralyzed (unless it's some big change now). i'm very idea > thing focused, at every stage of health.

    i do like little odd nick-nacks (either artful, cultural, or otherwise quirky), but they really aren't important to me, and in a moment of panic i'd surely sell them or abandon them over clinging to them. and i spend next to no money or time on obtaining them. when i splurge it's on nice meals or traveling/activities.
    good point. she is also a collector of "weird shit"

    she lives at thrift stores lol.

    she spends A LOT on eating out at nice restaurants, probably more than she should.
    Masculine presenting transgender lesbian


    At heart, I’ll always be a bleeding heart liberal.

  9. #149
    Diabolical Kasper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady_X View Post
    however...i don't feeeel angry...much haha
    If you're lucky you're not, much, well lucky may not be the right word. On one hand it is a powerful force that can push a 9 to being self-propelled, knowing what we don't want helps show what we do and force us to set boundaries, on the other hand if anger is there, once you learn what the signs are it can feel overpowering because you're aware of the anger.


    Quote Originally Posted by Starry View Post
    ^^I relate to all of the above here as well. I could easily attribute most of it to sx-merging as opposed to 9-merging but I'm keeping an open mind.
    Fair point that. 9 Sx's can be quite subdued for Sx's, they can be like merging on crack, like they melt into other people.


    Quote Originally Posted by Fuzzy Conduit View Post
    I think that 9s, despite a serene outward appearance, might have more potential than any other type for deep, fiery anger which others may not always see, but it will burn through if not kept in check or dealt with. Under that calm surface can be a great deal of conflict. 9s want to have peace within themselves and amongst other people, but at the same time they can burn with anger or resentment that might surface in a way which will surprise others, even the people who think they know the 9 well. The first time my wife saw my angry side, I smashed a mirror with my bare fist. This might be more true in the case of 9s with an 8 wing? I don't know so much about 9w1.

    edit: when expressed, my anger isn't always physical. It can often be expressed in words that can be very damaging and hurtful. When I lose control and unleash a verbal onslaught, it's like I can see and hear myself doing it but can't stop it. When it's done, I often feel regret at having fucked up my zen and hurt someone's feelings. Also, being ISTP, I have a very Ti way of criticizing others when I am frustrated or angry. It doesn't happen often, but when it does, it can be very brutal and honest.
    I consider that the w8 influence, the drama is if the 9 is resisting dealing with problems the avoidance and pushing down can cause things to come to a head when things are too far gone and there is no chance of an even reaction. For core 8 anger isn't the last resort, less has happened when you see their anger, and force is an element in play, for 9w8s when anger is seen a hell of a lot must have happened for it to spill out in a visual way, and it is not controlled. It would be short lived through typically, as the quick after thought is "don't have a right to anger", "their position is valid in it's own way as I understand their pov", "this may bother other people which will lead to rejection/disconnection" and the doubt over it being an appropriate reaction can quickly become more suppression if not careful.

    9w8 is well visualised as a caricature when thinking of Bruce Banner/Hulk. Unassuming, withdraw and chill, but able to rage hot.

    That said, no one would have seen my rage since I was a teen, not because it isn't there, just because I fear letting it out, the consequences of it, and I have enough control to notice it and temper it. Plus recognising signs of rising anger early means I can be proactive about things.

  10. #150

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kasper View Post
    If you're lucky you're not, much, well lucky may not be the right word. On one hand it is a powerful force that can push a 9 to being self-propelled, knowing what we don't want helps show what we do and force us to set boundaries, on the other hand if anger is there, once you learn what the signs are it can feel overpowering because you're aware of the anger.




    Fair point that. 9 Sx's can be quite subdued for Sx's, they can be like merging on crack, like they melt into other people.




    I consider that the w8 influence, the drama is if the 9 is resisting dealing with problems the avoidance and pushing down can cause things to come to a head when things are too far gone and there is no chance of an even reaction. For core 8 anger isn't the last resort, less has happened when you see their anger, and force is an element in play, for 9w8s when anger is seen a hell of a lot must have happened for it to spill out in a visual way, and it is not controlled. It would be short lived through typically, as the quick after thought is "don't have a right to anger", "their position is valid as well even", "this may bother other people which will lead to rejection/disconnection" and the doubt over it being an appropriate reaction can quickly become more suppression if not careful.

    9w8 is well visualised as a caricature when thinking of Bruce Banner/Hulk. Unassuming, withdraw and chill, but able to rage hot.

    That said, no one would have seen my rage since I was a teen, not because it isn't there, just because I fear letting it out, the consequences of it, and I have enough control to notice it and temper it. Plus recognising signs of rising anger early means I can be proactive about things.
    Well said.

    That's where the 9w8 inner conflict comes from--a desire to remain calm and placid on the surface and not alienate others. The problem is that 9w8s can and will hold resentments regarding people they disagree with or people who rub them the wrong way, but they are reluctant to "make waves" by voicing their resentment or distaste for the person's actions
    Masculine presenting transgender lesbian


    At heart, I’ll always be a bleeding heart liberal.

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