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  1. #1
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    Default Difference between E3 and E7?

    What are the biggest differences between E3 and E7?

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    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    E3s tend to be more focused than E7s. E3s get in the rat race that is the world, whereas E7s tend to muck about in the world. E3s embrace hierarchy and systems in place and game them, whereas E7s create an environment that is as flat as possible hierarchy-wise and introduce fun and games as a means of distracting themselves from more serious stuff that needs doing. E3s go for praise and glory, whereas E7s go for cool. E3s will do things in a short cut dirty way if that is what the situation demands it, whereas an E7 will just have several balls in the air and move from one idea to the next, trying them all out and seeing which ones will get them to where they wanna go.

    Rat race vs Jack-in-a-box
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amargith View Post
    E3s tend to be more focused than E7s. E3s get in the rat race that is the world, whereas E7s tend to muck about in the world. E3s embrace hierarchy and systems in place and game them, whereas E7s create an environment that is as flat as possible hierarchy-wise and introduce fun and games as a means of distracting themselves from more serious stuff that needs doing. E3s go for praise and glory, whereas E7s go for cool. E3s will do things in a short cut dirty way if that is what the situation demands it, whereas an E7 will just have several balls in the air and move from one idea to the next, trying them all out and seeing which ones will get them to where they wanna go.

    Rat race vs Jack-in-a-box
    I don't know about embracing, but I do know that I like to learn about the structure and system so that I can exploit it in every way possible. If you can cheat the system with little consequence, why not?
    C#2-C#5-F#5
    3 octaves, 2 notes and 1 semitone
    Supported range: F#2-F#4-C#5

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    i think this covers it:

    role: ego: self worth: self confidence: bonding tips: trolling tips:
    E3 strive to be the best players in other people's games. "i am successful because i have become (insert title)" seeks recognition and approval - to become someone. prosper in success but are easily devastated by failure. compliment them. frame them negatively
    E7 seek out how to best create their own emergent games. "i am awesome because i am doing (what i want to do)" explore experiences - to figure out who the fuck they are. get bored by success but experience insight in failure. surprise them. tease them positively

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    In Molina's system, 3s are 3EE (Extrinsic-Extrinsic), while 7s are 7SE (Systemic-Extrinsic).

    (The other manifestation of the Extrinsic within its center is the 8, which is 8IE [Intrinsic-Extrinsic].)

    As such, the 3 is entirely focused on the Extrinsic, while the 7 starts with the Systemic and moves into the Extrinsic.

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    reflecting pool Typh0n's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    In Molina's system, 3s are 3EE (Extrinsic-Extrinsic), while 7s are 7SE (Systemic-Extrinsic).

    (The other manifestation of the Extrinsic within its center is the 8, which is 8IE [Intrinsic-Extrinsic].)

    As such, the 3 is entirely focused on the Extrinsic, while the 7 starts with the Systemic and moves into the Extrinsic.
    English please!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Typh0n View Post
    English please!
    Molina, a close student of Naranjo's, combines the enneagram with the Hartman Value Inventory.

    The Hartman Value Inventory was developed by Robert S. Hartman, a holocaust survivor, logician, and philosopher.

    It attempts to provide an objective explanation of values, and posits that there are three realms of value: the Intrinsic, the Extrinsic, and the Systemic.

    Each of these realms of value correlates to one of the Enneagram's centers: Instrinsic-Gut, Extrinsic-Heart/Image, Systemic-Head.

    So, all types within each center get their first letter from their center:

    - 2s, 3s, and 4s are 2Ex, 3Ex, and 4Ex
    - 5s, 6s, and 7s are 5Sx, 6Sx, and 7Sx
    - 8s, 9s, and 1s are 8Ix, 9Ix, and 1Ix

    Then, within each center, each of three three types manifests that particular center's version of one of the three value centers.

    And that's where each type gets its second letter from. As such:

    - 2s, 3s, and 4s are 2ES, 3EE, and 4EI
    - 5s, 6s, and 7s are 5SI, 6SS, and 7SE
    - 8s, 9s, and 1s are 8IE, 9II, and 1IS

    Not exactly English, but the system is actually not that difficult to understand.

    I continue proselytizing about it on here because Naranjo highly approved of the way in which it further clarifies and fleshes out the Enneagram system, I wholeheartedly agree with him, and, unfortunately, not many people are aware of it.

  8. #8
    reflecting pool Typh0n's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    Molina, a close student of Naranjo's, combines the enneagram with the Hartman Value Inventory.

    The Hartman Value Inventory was developed by Robert S. Hartman, a holocaust survivor, logician, and philosopher.

    It attempts to provide an objective explanation of values, and posits that there are three realms of value: the Intrinsic, the Extrinsic, and the Systemic.

    Each of these realms of value correlates to one of the Enneagram's centers: Instrinsic-Gut, Extrinsic-Heart/Image, Systemic-Head.

    So, all types within each center get their first letter from their center:

    - 2s, 3s, and 4s are 2Ex, 3Ex, and 4Ex
    - 5s, 6s, and 7s are 5Sx, 6Sx, and 7Sx
    - 8s, 9s, and 1s are 8Ix, 9Ix, and 1Ix

    Then, within each center, each of three three types manifests that particular center's version of one of the three value centers.

    As such:

    - 2s, 3s, and 4s are 2ES, 3EE, and 4ES
    - 5s, 6s, and 7s are 5SI, 6SS, and 7SE
    - 8s, 9s, and 1s are 8IE, 9II, and 1IS

    Not exactly English, but the system is actually not that difficult to understand.

    I continue proselytizing about it on here because Naranjo highly approved of the way in which it further clarifies and fleshes out the Enneagram system, I wholeheartedly agree with him, and, unfortunately, not many people are aware of it.
    I see. So it would be like this:

    2 ExtrinsicSystemic(Intrinsic?)
    3 ExtrinsicExtrinsic
    4 ExtrinsicSystemic(or would it be Intrinsic?)

    5 SystemicIntrinsic
    6 SystemicSystemic
    7 SystemicExtrinsic

    8 IntrinsicExtrinsic
    9 IntrinsicIntrinsic
    1 IntrinsicSystemic

    Does it mean the same thing as "gut center" for example? so IE would mean "gut center + heart center" etc? Are these like subcenters for the center your type already fits into?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Typh0n View Post
    I see. So it would be like this:

    2 ExtrinsicSystemic(Intrinsic?)
    3 ExtrinsicExtrinsic
    4 ExtrinsicSystemic(or would it be Intrinsic?)
    It would be 2ES and 4EI.

    Thanks for pointing that out.

    I fixed it in my previous post.


    Quote Originally Posted by Typh0n View Post
    5 SystemicIntrinsic
    6 SystemicSystemic
    7 SystemicExtrinsic

    8 IntrinsicExtrinsic
    9 IntrinsicIntrinsic
    1 IntrinsicSystemic
    Yeah, you got it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Typh0n View Post
    Does I mean the same thing as "gut center" for example? so IE would mean "gut center + heart center" etc? Are these like subcenters for the center your type already fits into?
    No, I wouldn't call them subcenters, nor would I call IE "gut center + heart center".

    I would say the Gut Center tends to be correlated with the Intrinsic Value Dimension.

    And likewise, the Heart Center tends to be correlated with Extrinsic Value Dimension.

    And that, as such, 8IEs, come from the Gut Center, but manifest that in the Extrinsic Value Dimension.

    It's like 8s export their gut feelings into the extrinsic, or external, world (i.e., dominating 8 behavior).

    Likewise, 1ISs also come from the Gut Center, but do so primarily in the Systemic Value Dimension.

    As such, 1s manifest their gut feelings into the systemic world (or world of rules, laws, and regulations).

    So 8s manifest their gut in the external world (dominating), and 1s in the systemic world (moralizing).

    The truly amazing part about Molina's system is how well it maps onto other triad-based systems.

    In Freudian terms:

    - The Intrinsic is the Id
    - The Systemic is the Superego
    - The Extrinsic is the Ego.

    Likewise, if you know of the three Hindu Gunas:

    - The Instrinsic is the Tamasic
    - The Systemic is the Saatvic
    - The Extrinsic is the Rajasic

    Or, related to the Gunas, if you know the Taoist Yin and Yang:

    - The Intrinsic is the Yin
    - The Systemic is the balance of Yin and Yang
    - The Extrinsic is Yang

  10. #10
    reflecting pool Typh0n's Avatar
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    Hey this makes sense. Like 8s,9s, and 1s are all gut center but 8s manifest their gut centeredness in the external world, 9s in the internal, and 1s in the world of laws,rules and systems.

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