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Poll: What Personality Type Was Robin Williams?

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Thread: Robin Williams

  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal12345 View Post
    Those who use their intellect are sometimes accused of stereotyping simply for bringing up behavior as typological evidence. On the other hand, those who use "vibes" offer no evidence but their vibes.
    Real typing basically integrates both, since "vibes" are essentially big picture feels and "behavior" provides specific instances that contribute to vibes. It places relevant representative observations within a properly prioritized broader framework.

    Pretty much every field of knowledge operates this way in terms when people are problem-solving or trying to advance the field.

    For example, here I think a J type for Williams is simply misguided. At every turn, he seems to flex to the situation at hand, and usually is seeking connection with others. Also, for a J, structure and restraint is easier; for a P, flexibility is easier.

    Every anecdote I hear about Williams in relationships or in his work reflects a P nature; just tonight I read Hank Azaria's recollections of him while shooting "The Birdcage," which I saw last week and seemed like remarkable restrained work on Williams' part (since Nathan Lane was taking the "wild" role leaving Williams to provide a foundation). Azaria describes how Williams always respected Mike Nichols' direction and would do two straight takes on a scene to make him happy, but it seemed to drive him crazy to do it -- it was obviously something that he had a lot of trouble with. Then, he would ask for a take or two where he could just cut loose and do his thing, which Azaria referred to as Williams' "purging" himself because otherwise he would have gone crazy doing it straight. He could do it out of warmth towards his director, to make him happy; but he couldn't simply do it without repercussion; he needed his "flex crazy" time or go nuts.
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  3. #83
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Real typing basically integrates both, since "vibes" are essentially big picture feels and "behavior" provides specific instances that contribute to vibes. It places relevant representative observations within a properly prioritized broader framework.

    Pretty much every field of knowledge operates this way in terms when people are problem-solving or trying to advance the field.

    For example, here I think a J type for Williams is simply misguided. At every turn, he seems to flex to the situation at hand, and usually is seeking connection with others. Also, for a J, structure and restraint is easier; for a P, flexibility is easier.

    Every anecdote I hear about Williams in relationships or in his work reflects a P nature; just tonight I read Hank Azaria's recollections of him while shooting "The Birdcage," which I saw last week and seemed like remarkable restrained work on Williams' part (since Nathan Lane was taking the "wild" role leaving Williams to provide a foundation). Azaria describes how Williams always respected Mike Nichols' direction and would do two straight takes on a scene to make him happy, but it seemed to drive him crazy to do it -- it was obviously something that he had a lot of trouble with. Then, he would ask for a take or two where he could just cut loose and do his thing, which Azaria referred to as Williams' "purging" himself because otherwise he would have gone crazy doing it straight. He could do it out of warmth towards his director, to make him happy; but he couldn't simply do it without repercussion; he needed his "flex crazy" time or go nuts.
    The distinction I made was between vibes and intellect, not vibes and behavior. Behavior provides information to both, since even intuition ("vibes") is dependent upon the sensory content of behavior. The problem is, when someone points out the behavior and intellectually links it to a type, this is labeled 'stereotyping.' But when a vibe person does the same thing in a wordless way, in a way that possesses no explanatory power, then "stereotyping" is avoided.

    With vibes, mere assertion (it's true because I feel it's true) becomes a substitute for methodical thinking. Vibes are acceptable to the extent that they provide hypotheses for further exploration, so of course they are important in trying to advance a field. But they are not the end; they, like logic and evidence-gathering, are only one means to an end.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal12345 View Post
    "I've always believed he was ESFJ but doubt I would have said it unless you had because it becomes tiring for me to go up against all the stereotypes." Since my first week on this forum, I've been witness to a conflict between those who trust "vibes" and those who use their intellects to sort out types.

    Those who use their intellect are sometimes accused of stereotyping simply for bringing up behavior as typological evidence. On the other hand, those who use "vibes" offer no evidence but their vibes.

    Why did you use a direct quote from my post in this thread...without quoting me or mentioning me? It almost seems like you're a.) trying to spin a bullshit story about me and yet b.) don't possess the courage to confront me directly.

    Why do you do this? You do realize that we've never, ever talked because I've never, ever thought you personally worth talking to. So why quote something of mine and follow it with bullshit? I'm quite interested.

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    I am new to all of this but am wondering how people begin to presume to know enough about a public persona to type them?

    I am a subject matter expert on the Medicare Provider Network and speak authoritativly on this subject. I also lead large animal fire rescue teams, barking orders and getting the job done.

    Who would know by observing my behavior that when I am at a party I want to crawl into the walls and become invisible and that I often go weeks without leaving my house except to spend time with my horses (I work as a telecommuter). How can we observe someone's actions and assume to know their motivation?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal12345 View Post
    The distinction I made was between vibes and intellect, not vibes and behavior. Behavior provides information to both, since even intuition ("vibes") is dependent upon the sensory content of behavior. The problem is, when someone points out the behavior and intellectually links it to a type, this is labeled 'stereotyping.' But when a vibe person does the same thing in a wordless way, in a way that possesses no explanatory power, then "stereotyping" is avoided.

    With vibes, mere assertion (it's true because I feel it's true) becomes a substitute for methodical thinking. Vibes are acceptable to the extent that they provide hypotheses for further exploration, so of course they are important in trying to advance a field. But they are not the end; they, like logic and evidence-gathering, are only one means to an end.
    Usually a vibe is based on big-picture (i.e., multiple occurrence / venue broad triangulation) data points of behavior, whereas easier IMO for an intellectual assessment to cherry-pick data points. Find any three points (as we were taught in good old high-school essay class) and then detach completely from the data source because at that point you can write your paper and draw some kind of conclusion based solely on theory. It's far more susceptible to the flaw of taking limited experience and then spinning ideas in one's private tower without interacting with the subject, whereas big-picture forms of vibes insist that you continue to observe and interact for many many points of data to construct the picture.

    The trouble with "vibes" is that it is also emotional in nature, and so the reader's feelings can taint that vibe -- personal feelings of "like/dislike," versus feelings of "completeness/sync". I think the former is more dangerous when it comes to assessing the truth of something, as we're trying to find an objective truth regardless of how we personally like/dislike the outcome.

    As you suggest, they're both useful and I think a conclusion stronger when it melds both together.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  7. #87
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jlhinfj View Post
    I am new to all of this but am wondering how people begin to presume to know enough about a public persona to type them?

    I am a subject matter expert on the Medicare Provider Network and speak authoritativly on this subject. I also lead large animal fire rescue teams, barking orders and getting the job done.

    Who would know by observing my behavior that when I am at a party I want to crawl into the walls and become invisible and that I often go weeks without leaving my house except to spend time with my horses (I work as a telecommuter). How can we observe someone's actions and assume to know their motivation?
    It's called VI - visual identification, the method by which you can be typed on sight.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  8. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Usually a vibe is based on big-picture (i.e., multiple occurrence / venue broad triangulation) data points of behavior, whereas easier IMO for an intellectual assessment to cherry-pick data points. Find any three points (as we were taught in good old high-school essay class) and then detach completely from the data source because at that point you can write your paper and draw some kind of conclusion based solely on theory. It's far more susceptible to the flaw of taking limited experience and then spinning ideas in one's private tower without interacting with the subject, whereas big-picture forms of vibes insist that you continue to observe and interact for many many points of data to construct the picture.

    The trouble with "vibes" is that it is also emotional in nature, and so the reader's feelings can taint that vibe -- personal feelings of "like/dislike," versus feelings of "completeness/sync". I think the former is more dangerous when it comes to assessing the truth of something, as we're trying to find an objective truth regardless of how we personally like/dislike the outcome.

    As you suggest, they're both useful and I think a conclusion stronger when it melds both together.
    When personal (subjective) feelings of like/dislike become involved with intuitive vibes, this is evidence of an Fi-Si loop. That's because the liking/disliking is not a part of the vibe, it becomes an added content - a subjective feeling-sensation, not to be confused with an intuition.

    The Fi-Si loop is very big on this forum. It is often the case that, since the person in the loop doesn't know that the source of the like/dislike reaction is subconscious - personal, not objective - the cause of the reaction is projected out onto the sense-object. Those who experience the feeling-sensation automatically believe that the object is the cause of the sensation and that, therefore, the object itself is either good ('because I like it') or bad ('because I dislike it').
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  9. #89
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    Default Robin Williams


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    Last edited by EJCC; 02-09-2015 at 10:52 AM.

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    Loved him as an actor, but I can't understand how you can still have money issues after such a career :s

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